Pinion Snubber or not?

[SSing]

Hi,
I´m building a SS/B Barracuda for Nostalgia and Exhibition Racing.
When I start seeking for a Pinion Snubber, I notice quite a few guys recommend not to use this device with SS Springs.
Car is set up like it would have been done back in the sixties. Race Hemi, 4-speed, Dana 60 with 4.88 gears, #002-3 SS Leaf Springs, 25" Imperial Shocks. Up front is 90/10 Shocks, and all this in a 3000lb Fastback. Slicks are 10.5" something...
SS Springs are from the seventies, in case there is some changes in stiffness compared to the newly made, and also have some additional clamps on the front segment.
I old man take this for granted. A Pinion Snubber is adjusted close or tight to the flor pan.
Of cause the Chrysler Guys in charge for the Racing Program had this thing very well worked out, but still, what´s this deal about skipping the snubber...
Need your experienced advice here
Thank You, Stefan

 

[ssba]

Hello Stefan, use the snubber and stick with your 68-69 historically correct theme you have been working
toward.
The SS/B's suspension will work just as it did 40 some years ago. The parts you have gathered are all
engineered to work together.
Bolt the rear leg plate of your 3 point bar directly above your snubber to take the hit to the floor.
I am constantly told by others not to use these kind of outdated parts on my project. Usually with a modern substitute or suggestion.
Not everyone gets why I'd build a car to fit in an extinct class with period parts. I just keep on with my plan.

 

[jimjimjimmy]

if you have traction and power use a snubber to avoid wheel hop. yes ss springs will wrap

 

[SSing]

Hello Stefan, use the snubber and stick with your 68-69 historically correct theme you have been working
toward.
The SS/B's suspension will work just as it did 40 some years ago. The parts you have gathered are all
engineered to work together.
Bolt the rear leg plate of your 3 point bar directly above your snubber to take the hit to the floor.
I am constantly told by others not to use these kind of outdated parts on my project. Usually with a modern substitute or suggestion.
Not everyone gets why I'd build a car to fit in an extinct class with period parts. I just keep on with my plan.

Yes thanks, but still, it would be interesting hearing the reason not to use the snobber...

By the way can you remember if the Kramer BO Car, have the 3 point Lakewood post straight, or leaning some inwards. The post behind drivers seat... Maybe it was that simple, that post is vertical, and top of the loop was not exactly in line with the center of the seat. Also the rear leg is welded more to the right side of the loop, probably to be more over the center of the driver. Anyway this is the way I am going to do this...
Thanks again, Stefan

 

[halifaxhops]

I have a old mans sleeper with the stock springs and added a set of old Lakewood traction bars for the look. Tell you what the darn thing goes straight on the launch. I friend of mine who is a old dodge guy was explaining to me not to use a pinon snubber because it can be a pivit point for the rear end movement. Makes some sence to me but can also see the benefits of a snubber also. Just my 2c

 

[SSing]

if you have traction and power use a snubber to avoid wheel hop. yes ss springs will wrap

Thanks and Yes ok, but traction is something you can get with the right set up, but also something you can lack with wrong set up of equipment. Another factor is the condition of the track and slicks... So will the snubber improve poor traction?
This is interesting... You may develop this...

 

[ssba]

I am not sure if Kramers car used a Lakewood or
some other three bar. When I seen his car it was closed up and he was busy running the event.
As far as I can tell the Lakewood's came out a couple years later than your target build date of 68-69.
Al's Toy SS/BA also had the 3 bar and was not a bolt in universal Lakewood with the slip fit feet and rear down tube.
It may have been a weld up kit or custom made and what I would think is a better choice for 68-69 era.
Anyhow the right side vertical was not as close to the jamb or panel as bars are constructed today. This would help with your centering some with the seat.

 

[SSing]

I am not sure if Kramers car used a Lakewood or
some other three bar. When I seen his car it was closed up and he was busy running the event.
As far as I can tell the Lakewood's came out a couple years later than your target build date of 68-69.
Al's Toy SS/BA also had the 3 bar and was not a bolt in universal Lakewood with the slip fit feet and rear down tube.
It may have been a weld up kit or custom made and what I would think is a better choice for 68-69 era.
Anyhow the right side vertical was not as close to the jamb or panel as bars are constructed today. This would help with your centering some with the seat.

Yes, I thing you are right about Lakewood come a bit later. Reason I use Lakewood as a reference is I have to have some sort of a Roll Bar to be able to test the car on the track. And Lakewood is early racing history, isn´t it?
All Lakewood 3 point I have seen, has the rear bar directed more to the left front spring hanger, rather than above the snubbe. That's way I also thing those who had some sort of a Roll Bar on this ´68-69 configuration custom made them.
On the other hand Lakewood offered several typ of Roll Bars for different car models. I don´t think I have seen one for the Mopar A-Body.

 

[famous bob]

Yes, I thing you are right about Lakewood come a bit later. Reason I use Lakewood as a reference is I have to have some sort of a Roll Bar to be able to test the car on the track. And Lakewood is early racing history, isn´t it?
All Lakewood 3 point I have seen, has the rear bar directed more to the left front spring hanger, rather than above the snubbe. That's way I also thing those who had some sort of a Roll Bar on this ´68-69 configuration custom made them.
On the other hand Lakewood offered several typ of Roll Bars for different car models. I don´t think I have seen one for the Mopar A-Body.

My car was a lot heavier (S.S. D/A) than yours, and longer. We ran the 002-003 springs on it, (actually too lite) w/ the front of the rear wheel wells stretched and tubbed also. The springs had to be replaced every so often because of the weight of the car. they worked pretty good, considering the tires were not what we have today. We tore every pinion snubber we put on up in one race, it didn`t run any better w/ it on, finally gave up on running one at all. jfyi sounds like a kick a$$ car your building ! bob

 

[SSing]

My car was a lot heavier (S.S. D/A) than yours, and longer. We ran the 002-003 springs on it, (actually too lite) w/ the front of the rear wheel wells stretched and tubbed also. The springs had to be replaced every so often because of the weight of the car. they worked pretty good, considering the tires were not what we have today. We tore every pinion snubber we put on up in one race, it didn`t run any better w/ it on, finally gave up on running one at all. jfyi sounds like a kick a$$ car your building ! bob

Hmm... Well I was thinking of using a different type of rubber on the Snubber. More of a square thicker piece, from a tire or something... I think S&M used this home made trick.
Still interesting... but if for no other reason, I´m going to use the snubber, to save on the u-joint and stuff, cased by the pinion wind up...
Thanks

 

[whitepunkonnitro]

A snubber is an anti rotation device that just happens to double as a traction aid.
With an 8.75, which is a sheet metal housing, it IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY!!!
A PROPERLY adjusted snubber relieves the housing of ALL torsional load. This is where the big taboo about Mopars and Slapper style bars comes from.

 

[SSing]

A snubber is an anti rotation device that just happens to double as a traction aid.
With an 8.75, which is a sheet metal housing, it IS ABSOLUTELY NECESSARY!!!
A PROPERLY adjusted snubber relieves the housing of ALL torsional load. This is where the big taboo about Mopars and Slapper style bars comes from.

Yes, that first sentence is good... and with the SS Springs and how they were made to work. A solid front segment, and a working rear segment. They were ment to work together right? Or is a adjustable snubber a good idea with any Leaf Springs?
And than we have the guys that can be without them. But that´s racing... you use what works best for your racer

 

[whitepunkonnitro]

They were absolutely meant to work together. SS springs were designed around a snubber type of system.
Things like slappers and Caltraks are fine for use in press-tube style axles, but on an 8.75 are a REALLY bad idea, even on one that is back braced. The front of the housing that supports the chunk is still subject to the torsional load and will either distort or tear over time. A snubber negates this.
Biggest issue with a pinion snubber, us that it is almost too simple and effective. Nobody can make any money off it, so it's ignored.
Match race Funny Cars ran deep into the 8s back in 65/66..the snubber was their ONLY traction device. The **** flat out works.
As for the lack of undersranding of this device, blame it on the Ford and GM guys.
Mid sixties Mopars were the only ones built on a unibody platform.
You couldn't use an effective snubber on a chassis car, because it would be working against the body mounts.
As a their suspension science evolved, it cross polluted ours.

 

[SSing]

They were absolutely meant to work together. SS springs were designed around a snubber type of system.
Things like slappers and Caltraks are fine for use in press-tube style axles, but on an 8.75 are a REALLY bad idea, even on one that is back braced. The front of the housing that supports the chunk is still subject to the torsional load and will either distort or tear over time. A snubber negates this.
Biggest issue with a pinion snubber, us that it is almost too simple and effective. Nobody can make any money off it, so it's ignored.
Match race Funny Cars ran deep into the 8s back in 65/66..the snubber was their ONLY traction device. The **** flat out works.
As for the lack of undersranding of this device, blame it on the Ford and GM guys.
Mid sixties Mopars were the only ones built on a unibody platform.
You couldn't use an effective snubber on a chassis car, because it would be working against the body mounts.
As a their suspension science evolved, it cross polluted ours.

Yepp... I ride with you...
Thanks