questions on push button ignition/

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danho440

danho440

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Ok I have recently replaced my ignition switch on my duster then had a bug to put a push button ignition in its place .... ok here is my question my ignition switch has five wires that go into my connector under the steering column I have all the male connecters that I can use to plug into that connecter so I can wire from the new ignition box , the new ignition box has a race toggle on/off then the push button . What's the simplest way to make this work
 
ha someone figure this out planning to do this in the future

depends which one is hot, ignition, and starter wire... electrical test stuff
 
Ya I was hoping some could tell what color stuff goes to which one is the power in which one to starter etc the switch says for the toggle accessory for one then run that to button then out to starter I would like just to mate it with my harness , I thought this was going to be easy
 
First of all what kind of setup is the REST of the car?

That is --what ignition, do you run an ignition resistor?

Where is the battery, up front, trunk?

IF you have no ballast resistor, you can just wire the push button to either of the "push on" terminals of the starter relay, and the remaining push - on terminal of the start relay goes down to the neutral safety switch

DO NOT run without a neutral safety switch -- for one thing, it's required by NHRA.

If you have a shifter mount neutral safety switch, you can wire that in series with the push button and then off to the starter relay.

Another way to do it, if you prefer to use a rear mount "Ford relay" is to find one --NOT SURE of the application, but I think it was used in AMC stuff. It LOOKS like a Ferd relay, but the two coil connections are brought out to terminals.

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaannnnnnnnnnnnnnnndddd I just got done looking through the Echlin and SMP illustrated guides and CAN NOT freekin' FIND what I'm looking for

Here's the thing. ............There are several ways that some solenoids are wired.

The Ferd solenoid with 4 terminals has two big studs for the contacts, one small stud for the coil, and the coil is grounded to the mount. The 2nd small stud is the coil resistor bypass terminal "I"

Some starter mount solenoids like tractors have ONE end of the coil hooked to one of the big studs. The starter button then hooks to the small stud and to ground, IE the starter switch is in the ground leg

IF YOU can find one of these, you could hook the common stud to the battery, and then run the small stud in series with the push button, to the neutral safety switch, to ground

Somewhere there exists an AMC? IHC? relay that has the coil brought out as mentioned above.

A so called "continuous duty" solenoid will NOT work because it has a weaker coil and does not carry enough contact current for reliable starter operation, due to the weaker contact pressure.
 
The ignition is pretty much stock I have the upgrade from.year one that has the ecu and distributor yes it has a ballast resistor . Thanks for your reply but you lost me I wanted to wire it into my connecter that the original ignition plugged into . Because in theory is it not the same thing. power to it the when place on power to accessory then turn which now would be the button send power to the starter . I have a Clinton manual and the wiring semantic in back is gone so I am struggling to know where the five wires go to I have a red yellow blue black brown
 
I got the panel from peak racing it has a toggle , button then a smaller toggle for whatever
 
OK here's the thing:

The ignition switch on a Mopar is pretty special. There are SEVERAL distinct switches in there, and they work different from any other ignition in the industry

FIRST there's the obvious the ACCESSORY switch, which supplies power to the fuse box in both "Run" and "accessory."

SECOND there's the "ignition run' switch, which powers the dash gauges, warning lights, the ignition system, the alternator field and regulator, and electric choke if used

THIRD there's the START wire which fires the STARTER RELAY, BUT BUT --- if you are running an automatic, the starter relay is the key to the neutral safety switch hookup, and a stick, the clutch safety if present

FOURTH there's the ignition bypass circuit. This switch is ALSO hot only in start, but is SEPARATE from the START switch. This switch lead goes out through the bulkhead to the positive side of the coil, and gives you a nice hot spark to start

Now if you are just using a push button switch, you need to figure out how you are going to implement the neutral safety switch (you have an auto trans?)

And you need to figure out a way to run the ignition bypass.


So we need to know

1 What year model is your car

2 Is it an auto trans, or are you using a clutch safety switch

3 Where is the battery located?

4 IF the battery is going to be in the trunk, and IF you are going to use a trunk mount start solenoid, we'll have to address that in order to incorporate a safety switch.
 
1974 duster auto trans... I want to totally get rid of the old switch and just run the set up that I got from peak racing . What I was thinking is run power to.the toggle and anything that needs to be on (run position)then everything that is powered in start off the button ....the battery is in the front
 
The switch panel is as follows

Heavy duty 60 amp push button ignition with screw connectors and rubber cover. 45 amp, two pole toggle switch with red flip cover and screw fasteners. One 45 amp, two pole toggle accessory switch with rubber cover.
 
OK, the simple stuff. You can hook the acessories line that was on the IGN switch to that ACC toggle You can hook your ignition run line from the IGN switch to your new IGN toggle

But the tricky part is going to be this:

The easy way to run your neutral safety switch AND deal with the ballast resistor is to get a late model Jeep starter relay like this:

NOTICE that it looks just like your old start relay EXCEPT

it has one more terminal, and, the "square terminal" is now replaced with two "push on" terminals labled EGR/SOL

SO buy one of those, replace your starter solenoid wire with a (probably yellow) push on connector, and hook the relay up just like it was----

The wires off the old stud back on the new stud

The starter solenoid wire onto the new EGR/ SOL connector

Your original yellow "start" wire to the "I" terminal

Your original transmission neutral safety switch wire to the "G" terminal

ADD a wire from the new "BAL" terminal to the coil + terminal, and THAT will take care of the coil resistor bypass circuit

THEN just go inside the car and hook your new push button to power on one side, and the other side goes to the yellow "start" wire.

A SECOND way of taking care of the resistor bypass would be to buy a good quality Bosch relay and mounting socket.

IF you use a Bosch relay, like so:

http://www.rowand.net/Shop/Tech/images/RelayWiringGuide.jpg

Run fused power from the start relay stud to terminal no 30

Run a wire from the coil + to relay terminal no 87

(87A is not connected)

Now wire the coil, 85 and 86 in parallel with the two "push on" wires on your original start relay

This will cause the Bosch relay to pull in whenever the start relay does.

Useable diagrams from MyMopar:

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=31

Diagrams for a 74 duster

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1974/74ValiantA.jpg

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/1974/74ValiantB.jpg

StarterRelay.jpg


Your old IGN switch should be:

Large RED power coming into the switch from the ammeter circuit Hook this to the power buss in your new panel

Large black: switched accessory power to the fuse box Hook this to the ACC switch in the new panel

Dark blue IGN run Hook this to the IGN toggle in the new panel

Yellow start Hook this to the output of the start pushbutton

Brown the coil resistor bypass circuit, what the new start relay is replacing.
 
Large black: switched accessory power to the fuse box Hook this to the ACC switch in the new panel it would be just one wire going to the acc switch correct the is two spots to place it on the switch in the back .... also man your being a great help
 
I don't know how the panel is wired. The original black at the IGN switch is power FROM the switch in either accessory or run, going TO the fuse box.

So you need to switch it with the new panel.

Are you saying there is no power going to the switch? If not, you'd have to jumper that terminal to the red (power coming in)
 
It would be simplest if you upgrade to HEI ignition, with no ballast resistor. Wire the toggle switch so it connects +12V power to the IGN and ACC circuits. I think these are marked on the starter switch. If not, go by the wire colors. You can find wiring diagrams for many cars by a FABO search (need a diagram anyway).

The push-button will connect +12 V to the "start" wire, which is yellow in most cars. This shouldn't change your existing relay or neutral safety switch.
 
That's true Bill --- I guess I thought that would add complications.

And on that note, HEI is what I run --stock type Accel replacement breakerless dist and HEI module, stock coil, no ballast. Simple, and it WORKS.
 
Ok update ...... I have the switch hooked up I used all the same color power red to toggle ING switch when switch is on black connected to black for fuse and accessory (when I hit the switch I have power inside the car so we are good there. Then black to or out to push button switch the running out I have yellow and brown going out which should only be used in start per diagram . But when I push button nothing happens ? Something simple I am missing
 
You have yellow and brown both hooked to the output of the push button? Can't do that

So far as why it won't crank, go out under the hood, and rig your test light with clip leads.

Find the yellow on the start relay, You have 1 or 2 push on terminals on your start relay?

If you have 2, the neutral safety switch is probably not getting ground. Check your yellow and see if you have power with the push button down.

So far as the brown to the bypass, that has to be isolated That's why I suggested you use the later model Jeep starter relay. You can hook the brown bypass circuit from the indicated terminal on the Jeep relay go the coil +
 
Ok brown ran to accessory switch once started I switch off seems to be working good now . All wired in to the old harness ...Thanks for all the help
 
67Dart273 is one knowledgeable dude. Thanks for being aboard FABO.
 
Yes he is , tons of knowledge and was a huge help
 
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