Rear axle bearings

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They should be repacked. There is an inner seal that's supposed to keep gear oil at bay.
 
unless you rebuild with a sealed(green) bearing. which is what i reccomend.
 
a68postcar said:
unless you rebuild with a sealed(green) bearing. which is what i reccomend.
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I would keep the stock bearings. The greens can't take much side load and they also wear out much faster than the normal bearings. Repack and then adjust the endplay on your stock ones.
 
goldduster 318, at the risk of sounding like a wise acre, where did you hear that. just curious. i've been to skf, timken and bca's bearing classes, and never heard that. i'm a millwright by trade and thats aa new one on me.
 
a68postcar said:
goldduster 318, at the risk of sounding like a wise acre, where did you hear that. just curious. i've been to skf, timken and bca's bearing classes, and never heard that. i'm a millwright by trade and thats aa new one on me.
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68 it's true Greenbearing only have about 1/3 of sideload carring capability of the stock tapered roller If your into cornering {high sideload} or Towing They are a No No ~
Also" New stock bearings wont need attention again for Many many many years
think of it like this next time your changing shoes popout the axles and inspect if need be
{and they wont} repack em kinda gives you a chance to check the gear oil condition and
and inner axle seal condition Plus you get the satisfaction of knowing the stock stuff went 30 or 40 years
without attention and without a debate~
 
a68postcar said:
goldduster 318, at the risk of sounding like a wise acre, where did you hear that. just curious. i've been to skf, timken and bca's bearing classes, and never heard that. i'm a millwright by trade and thats aa new one on me.
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I can't remember if the greens are ball bearings or straight rollers, but in any case, the stock bearings are a tapered roller setup, similar to the ones found on the carrier bearings or the front wheel bearings.

For the greens to hold up, you need to hold a side tension on the bearings using a retaining plate or step on both sides, and the stock axle ends and the design of the green bearings retainer plates don't do this too well.

Not only are the stock bearings better in that regard (the retaining plate is the adjuster on one side and a very beefy one on the not adjustable axle), and there is a thrust block in the differential to share the loads. Its that much more of a robust complete design.

You guys ever seen the pictures of what happens when the greens start to fail? The axle starts coming out through the bearing.
 
good info. thanks alot boys, i'm glad i saw this before i did my 7.25. i'm gonna have to get the stockers.
 
goldduster318 said:
I can't remember if the greens are ball bearings or straight rollers, but in any case, the stock bearings are a tapered roller setup, similar to the ones found on the carrier bearings or the front wheel bearings.

For the greens to hold up, you need to hold a side tension on the bearings using a retaining plate or step on both sides, and the stock axle ends and the design of the green bearings retainer plates don't do this too well.

Not only are the stock bearings better in that regard (the retaining plate is the adjuster on one side and a very beefy one on the not adjustable axle), and there is a thrust block in the differential to share the loads. Its that much more of a robust complete design.

You guys ever seen the pictures of what happens when the greens start to fail? The axle starts coming out through the bearing.
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Let's see some pictures. Is this info. on Green Bearings all made up? Or does someone have definitive proof on Green Bearing failures.
 
When using the Green bearings, do you have to remove the old axle seals or can you leave them in the housing?

Joe
 
a68postcar said:
goldduster 318, at the risk of sounding like a wise acre, where did you hear that. just curious. i've been to skf, timken and bca's bearing classes, and never heard that. i'm a millwright by trade and thats aa new one on me.
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a68postcar, I'm curious too. I really think we need someone who knows about bearings to show us some difinitive proof. Either Green Bearings fail or they don't. I've heard about Green Bearings and side load bla bla bla. Although I never hear that from the manufacturer. Curious isn't it?
 
The Green Bearing is a similar design to the sealed bearings used on millions of FWD vehicles and IFS 4x4's. It has a double row of balls with a two piece inner race that is inserted from opposite sides. These inner races extend up higher on the outer sides than the typical ball bearing giving it improved side load carrying capacity. Certainly they don't have the side carrying capacity of a tapered roller bearing but there is no reason not to expect them to have a long life in a street application.

a68postcar, your 7.25 doesn't use a tapered roller at all. The early ones used a bearing similar to the green bearing and latter ones used a straight roller and required a c-clip to provide side load carrying capacity.
 
dgc333 said:
The Green Bearing is a similar design to the sealed bearings used on millions of FWD vehicles and IFS 4x4's. It has a double row of balls with a two piece inner race that is inserted from opposite sides. These inner races extend up higher on the outer sides than the typical ball bearing giving it improved side load carrying capacity. Certainly they don't have the side carrying capacity of a tapered roller bearing but there is no reason not to expect them to have a long life in a street application.a68postcar, your 7.25 doesn't use a tapered roller at all. The early ones used a bearing similar to the green bearing and latter ones used a straight roller and required a c-clip to provide side load carrying capacity.
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Dave: Have you ever read anything, from anyone in the bearing industry stating that because of poor side load capacity people should not use Green Bearings? Thanks for your input. Seems to be a lot of misinformation about Green Bearings out there.
 
well in my application, when the thrust surface, at the end of the original axles shows some wear (and were musroomed a bit!). Replacing the stock bearings with green bearings solved a few issues (helps keep the slicks from rubbing against the leaf springs!) and cost a lot less than replacing axles.

Bob

PS: I have seen a some pressed on tapered roller bearings wearout a few axles in my time also! (on both mopars and ford products).
 
Demon, it's a known engineering fact that tapered will take more side loading. However, the do require cleaning and re-packing just like the fronts. The fact that few even know or do it and they still work is a testament to how over-built they are. If you are going to autocross, or are building a car to push more than 1G on a skidpad AND plan to make use of it, staying with factory tapered rollers are a best choice. However, for any other use, they Green (manufacturer's name BTW) are a very goo alternative that does not need repacking. I've used the green style bearings on street, drag, and highway racer type cars with no catastrophic failures. I have had them get noisey... But never come apart. You really gotta beat them to get them to fail and the axle move... Because they are held by the same collar the std bearings are.

I'll add my guess is this is very similar to having to use an HV pump ona new motor. There's a lot of misinformation about it.
 
I would wager that the vast majority of those the decry the use of Greens have never used and/or had a failure with them. Tends to be one of those "I heard that..." things that get passed along.

Have there been failures? Sure. Is it common? No. From an engineering standpoint is a tapered roller going to take more abuse than a Green? Yeah - in all likelihood. Does it really matter in your application?

I've got Greens installed. Unless or until I have a failure I have no reason to believe they will not outlast me.

Also, the inner seal is optional. The Greens are sealed and have an o-ring around their circumfrence. I've got the inner seals installed for extra insurance.
 
Another thought... GM uses a ctraight roller in the rear... On everything. Cars, 1/2 ton trucks, some heavier trucks. Even changing to C clip eliminators keep the rollers. They do just fine in hard applications.
 
moper said:
Another thought... GM uses a ctraight roller in the rear... On everything. Cars, 1/2 ton trucks, some heavier trucks. Even changing to C clip eliminators keep the rollers. They do just fine in hard applications.
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Its a c-clip axle, so you use straight rollers since the c-clips retain the axles. No issue since they are not supposed to take ANY side loads. The 8 1/4 and 9 1/4 mopar axles are pretty much clones of that design.

C-clip eliminators are pieces of crap too. You wonder why they sell chevy 12 bolt axle shafts made for ford torino bearings. The c-clip eliminators also eliminate the inner axle seal and are very prone to leakage. Those are really drag car only items.

The roll forming to hold the bearings together on the original green bearings is not very good which is why they fail under side loads. Noisy+not repackable=failure in my book. If you have the Moser ones (which are cheaper but better and use a snap ring and proper retainer plate) you'll probably be ok.

I did look on Moparts for the picture of the failed green bearings, couldn't find it, but there certainly were several topics I found about people having them fail after about 10k miles.

The factory bearing retainer won't let the axle move relative to the bearing unless the press fit on the inner race would fail. If the bearing races fail on the original greens they will come apart.

The OEM bearings are also much less expensive anyway. I just don't understand why someone wouldn't spend 10min setting their axle endplay and another 10 packing the bearings. My car still has the 40 year old timkens and they're still in fine condition.
 
I've been around a while .... nosing into Mopar mags, and online and never read anyone state "Well the green bearings bit the dust today!"
 
I've come across 1 or 2 guys on Moparts that claimed they had failures. Begs the question whether it was "operator error" or the early versions or what. I haven't lost any sleep.
 
moper said:
Demon, it's a known engineering fact that tapered will take more side loading. However, the do require cleaning and re-packing just like the fronts. The fact that few even know or do it and they still work is a testament to how over-built they are. If you are going to autocross, or are building a car to push more than 1G on a skidpad AND plan to make use of it, staying with factory tapered rollers are a best choice. However, for any other use, they Green (manufacturer's name BTW) are a very goo alternative that does not need repacking. I've used the green style bearings on street, drag, and highway racer type cars with no catastrophic failures. I have had them get noisey... But never come apart. You really gotta beat them to get them to fail and the axle move... Because they are held by the same collar the std bearings are.

I'll add my guess is this is very similar to having to use an HV pump ona new motor. There's a lot of misinformation about it.
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moper: Thanks for the input. I do understand the Green Bearings will take less side load than the tapered bearings. As dgc333, an engineer also explains in his post here. But, the point is; why do so many misinformed people without any engineering expertise continue to pass on the BS stories about Green Bearings failing? Or passing on information about them not lasting as long because of that side load BS. moper, I'm glad you have the courage and the fearless fortitude to continue using the Green Bearings in your applications. I will continue to use them fearlessly also. lol(BTW Bearing Technologies acquired Green Bearing in 1997 and is no longer called Green.) I could be wrong, but I think I'm right, and if I think I'm right, I could be wrong. LOL Thanks moper.
 
goldduster318 said:
Its a c-clip axle, so you use straight rollers since the c-clips retain the axles. No issue since they are not supposed to take ANY side loads. The 8 1/4 and 9 1/4 mopar axles are pretty much clones of that design.

C-clip eliminators are pieces of crap too. You wonder why they sell chevy 12 bolt axle shafts made for ford torino bearings. The c-clip eliminators also eliminate the inner axle seal and are very prone to leakage. Those are really drag car only items.

The roll forming to hold the bearings together on the original green bearings is not very good which is why they fail under side loads. Noisy+not repackable=failure in my book. If you have the Moser ones (which are cheaper but better and use a snap ring and proper retainer plate) you'll probably be ok.

I did look on Moparts for the picture of the failed green bearings, couldn't find it, but there certainly were several topics I found about people having them fail after about 10k miles.

The factory bearing retainer won't let the axle move relative to the bearing unless the press fit on the inner race would fail. If the bearing races fail on the original greens they will come apart.

The OEM bearings are also much less expensive anyway. I just don't understand why someone wouldn't spend 10min setting their axle endplay and another 10 packing the bearings. My car still has the 40 year old timkens and they're still in fine condition.
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Who manufactures the Moser bearings?
 
i'm not going to poo-poo the greens until i have a difinitive answer. i'm going to call my contact at timken and see if they have any data on the side load. my brother and his buddy in texas build several rears every year and i think they use nothing but green. if timken says that they are ok i'm probably going to have to say ok. i will know more after i speak with them. maybe they have some literature to say one way or the other. good thread boys. this is what this is all about.
 
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