rocker arm oiling HELP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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I turned a 378 8,500 every pass with 360 mains and full groove mains. On 360's I use hv pump. The ps oil galley was tubed and ds blocked at #1 main. #2 and #4 cam journals grooved to oil constant. Then a 66 holley jet in deck. Harlond sharp rockers.

Never had an issue.
 
To me the real question to be asked is whether you think full groove bearings are a disadvantage as far as adequate bearing surface.
The Chev method of grooving the saddle still gets less volume to the rods than a full grooved bearing, but the Chev does not use a full grooved bearing. When I talked recently with Mahler clevite they are against full grooved bearings. But Chrysler still recommends there use. Go figure. Converting to full time rocker oiling by abandoning the cam timed oil passages certainly cannot hurt crank bearing oiling.
IMHO. My last build failed 2 and 4 main because I screwed up that restriction, so you certainly cannot say that the rocker feed restriction has no effect on the crank bearings. Why not make all the crank and rod bearings all oil the same way by getting rid of that circuit altogether.


They are not a disadvantage as far as bearing surface goes. More engineering crap that engineers loose sleep over.

What they don't say is they don't want oil to the rods all the time. Most engine builders are smart enough (or should be) to calculate area and most bearings have more bearing area than you ever need.

Sending oil to the rods full time takes more oil volume, so you need a bigger pump (not good) produces more oil exiting at the Rod bearings (bad) which in turn means you need more oil in the pan and a bigger pan to hold it (also bad) and lastly, you are trying to keep oil off the crank and dumping oil out the rods all the time is a big power eater. The higher the RPM, the more power it eats.

Full grooves in the main bearings is a fix, not a cure. Bearing area is the least of your worries.

I'm still trying, in my mind to understand how you think pulling oil off the 2 and 4 mains to oil the rockers made you lose bearings? The system is self regulating. In fact, if I'm running a high RPM roller deal, I open up the feed from the mains all the way to the shafts, and put a groove around the cam journal.

Years ago I blocked the oil to the rockers from the mains and plumbed up full time oil to the rockers. What a waste of time that was.

The Chrysler system is good for what it is. It seems to me you are doing a bunch of engineering based you don't need because of a failure you had. Go to the track and see how many guys are going through the hoops you are. I don't know any. I personally have never seen a main bearing failure from oil going to the rockers. Not one. Not even the big block guys who are 100% sure that's the failure.

So no, I don't think a full groove in the main bearing presents an issue as far as bearing area. As I've said it presents other issues.
 
I turned a 378 8,500 every pass with 360 mains and full groove mains. On 360's I use hv pump. The ps oil galley was tubed and ds blocked at #1 main. #2 and #4 cam journals grooved to oil constant. Then a 66 holley jet in deck. Harlond sharp rockers.
Never had an issue.

What heads, cam, cr, intake did you have? What kind of car and et and mph did it run? What pistons did you use?
 
They are not a disadvantage as far as bearing surface goes. More engineering crap that engineers loose sleep over.

What they don't say is they don't want oil to the rods all the time. Most engine builders are smart enough (or should be) to calculate area and most bearings have more bearing area than you ever need.

Sending oil to the rods full time takes more oil volume, so you need a bigger pump (not good) produces more oil exiting at the Rod bearings (bad) which in turn means you need more oil in the pan and a bigger pan to hold it (also bad) and lastly, you are trying to keep oil off the crank and dumping oil out the rods all the time is a big power eater. The higher the RPM, the more power it eats.

Full grooves in the main bearings is a fix, not a cure. Bearing area is the least of your worries.

I'm still trying, in my mind to understand how you think pulling oil off the 2 and 4 mains to oil the rockers made you lose bearings? The system is self regulating. In fact, if I'm running a high RPM roller deal, I open up the feed from the mains all the way to the shafts, and put a groove around the cam journal.

Years ago I blocked the oil to the rockers from the mains and plumbed up full time oil to the rockers. What a waste of time that was.

The Chrysler system is good for what it is. It seems to me you are doing a bunch of engineering based you don't need because of a failure you had. Go to the track and see how many guys are going through the hoops you are. I don't know any. I personally have never seen a main bearing failure from oil going to the rockers. Not one. Not even the big block guys who are 100% sure that's the failure.

So no, I don't think a full groove in the main bearing presents an issue as far as bearing area. As I've said it presents other issues.
Hi yellow rose. To answer your question. I unintentionally defeating the self regulating by installing a cam with the 2&4 cam journals fully grooved with no restrictors in the deck or heads. Lost the bearing springiness after 40 passes. Caught in during a winter inspection before they spun. If you really think about it if we are oiling the rockers but pulsing the oil when the oil holes line up in the cam journals, then we are also pulsing to a lesser extent the feed to the mains and rods as well. It makes sense to me to convert the rocker oiling to full time from the main galley and it's not that difficult to do.
I thought it was ingenious when I saw how to do it.
Did you look at that Hemi lately lol.
 
They are not a disadvantage as far as bearing surface goes. More engineering crap that engineers loose sleep over.

What they don't say is they don't want oil to the rods all the time. Most engine builders are smart enough (or should be) to calculate area and most bearings have more bearing area than you ever need.

Sending oil to the rods full time takes more oil volume, so you need a bigger pump (not good) produces more oil exiting at the Rod bearings (bad) which in turn means you need more oil in the pan and a bigger pan to hold it (also bad) and lastly, you are trying to keep oil off the crank and dumping oil out the rods all the time is a big power eater. The higher the RPM, the more power it eats.

Full grooves in the main bearings is a fix, not a cure. Bearing area is the least of your worries.

I'm still trying, in my mind to understand how you think pulling oil off the 2 and 4 mains to oil the rockers made you lose bearings? The system is self regulating. In fact, if I'm running a high RPM roller deal, I open up the feed from the mains all the way to the shafts, and put a groove around the cam journal.

Years ago I blocked the oil to the rockers from the mains and plumbed up full time oil to the rockers. What a waste of time that was.

The Chrysler system is good for what it is. It seems to me you are doing a bunch of engineering based you don't need because of a failure you had. Go to the track and see how many guys are going through the hoops you are. I don't know any. I personally have never seen a main bearing failure from oil going to the rockers. Not one. Not even the big block guys who are 100% sure that's the failure.

So no, I don't think a full groove in the main bearing presents an issue as far as bearing area. As I've said it presents other issues.

Not doing anything drastic with the oiling. Just basic recommendations. Most right from Guitar Jones thread, and others from Charles Sanborn thread on Mopar Chat, and some from the stroker small block book. Utilizing the front oiling mod with the boss that was cast right into the x block to eliminate the velocity issue,lifter bushings instead of tubes to use newer lifters, full grooved "h" bearings with upper shells slotted,drilled all oil filter passages to 1/2 inch and main passages to 5/16 and the previously mentioned cam bearing restriction to convert to full time rocker oiling. Biggest headache was trying to use the Milodon super stock pan with a scraper and a windage tray on a 4 inch stroke.
I previously posted in a previous thread that Charles Sanborns oiling thread mentions exactly the failure I had being caused by to much oil to the rockers through the stock system causes main bearing and rod failure.
 
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