(SOLVED) Dead cylinder at idle? Low temp on header collector

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macdrew77

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What could cause a dead cylinder at idle (no change in idle when unplugged) low temp on header collector (230F compared to ~450F on other cylinders) and what to check next?
I've swapped plug and wire with neighboring cylinder and there was no change. Cap and rotor are pretty new

1990 stock 360, 4bbl smog intake with EGR plugged, headers, Thermoquad 9800
16 inHg vacuum at 750rpm, needle fluctuates 1-2 inHg
Cant find any external vacuum leaks

Compression test
1: 135psi 2:135
3: 130 4:140
5: 130 6:130
7: 130 8:130

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Is it an electronic distributor? If so, have you checked the reluctor for possible damage on that cylinder #1 cylinder?
 
whats the temp on #2 exhaust?
 
Any mechanical work done to it recently?
You try moving in closer with the temp guage.
 
Any mechanical work done to it recently?
You try moving in closer with the temp gauge.
Swapped the intake for a fresh blue painted one. Wonder if I need to plug the hole in the floor? People say no need to plug, but I left the upper plane threaded hole unplugged and those 4 cylinders were running like dog **** until I plugged it. Lower plane hole is still wide open.
 
Just a suggestion...

Try one of these on the ignition wire of the dead cylinder,

Cheap tester and will 100% tell you if no spark.

Did you actually change the cap?

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That's about what my #1 temp is too. It's been a year since I hit mine with a heat gun. Just got the engine back in and going to plug the pcv valve and try breathers. My intake valves are all sludged up, just looked at them with a borescope . Trying to figure out why. I can let you you know what my temps are when I start it. The center cyls are the hottest. You may not have a problem. Leak down test is best.
 
That's about what my #1 temp is too. It's been a year since I hit mine with a heat gun. Just got the engine back in and going to plug the pcv valve and try breathers. My intake valves are all sludged up, just looked at them with a borescope . Trying to figure out why. I can let you you know what my temps are when I start it. The center cyls are the hottest. You may not have a problem. Leak down test is best.
That would be helpful. I'm more worried about the fact it doesnt change the idle when its unplugged vs what the temperature is.
 
Here's what I have found in this situation; Not saying this is your problem.
If the exhaust valve is not sealing;
Be it for a broken spring, a burned valve, or just carbon on the seat, Then it may still run fine at rpm. But at idle, the piston on the intake stroke, finds it easier to pull air in from the exhaust system, than to pull air in from the intake where the throttles are almost completely closed.. And so, a large portion of the AFR in the chamber on the following compression stroke, is inert exhaust gas, which lowers the heat of combustion, and you can read that on the IR gun.
If your exhaust system is tight, you can prove this very simply;
Just go to the back of the car and put your gloved hands over the tailpipes without closing them right off.
If you have a Crossover tube, you can close one side. In your case, you already know it's on the Driver's side, so without a Crossover, you can work on just the Driver's tailpipe.
So then with the engine idling, and your palm set to seal the pipe, if you feel 3 pressure pulses and one missing, it will feel like the missing cylinder is sucking your hand onto the pipe. Obviously it is not, but, because you are pushing towards the pipe and fighting the pressure, when the pulse is missing, your energy, assisted by the atmosphere will push your hand onto the pipe. If you feel that, that is your proof that the exhaust valve is not sealing.
This does not show up on a Leakdown test, at 100psi, which forces the valve to seat. At that point the Valvespring doesn't even need to be there.
If you had tried it at say 40 psi, it might have been another story.

In any case, this test takes about 2 minutes, and is proof positive that one exhaust valve is not sealing. If this has only just started and if it's carbon on the seat, the fix may be as easy as taking her out for a blast. Or you can pour some carbon cleaner down the carb at high idle.
But, if this situation is allowed to continue, a burned valve will be the end result. But on the way there, the carbon can cause pre-ignition, leading to detonation, leading to broken engine parts.
Jus saying

BTW-1
IMO 4% LD @a test pressure of 100psi, is already quite a bit, and
if I didn't know that Camino CA was at around 3100>3500 ft elevation, I would have said that your cylinder pressure of 130-ish, was quite low.
If you have iron heads it might be fine for a DD;
But if it was my engine, at 900 ft, I would be tearing it apart; especially if said engine had alloy heads, which will easily support 190 psi on 87E10, here in Manitoba Canada.
At 3000/3500 ft, your performance engine needs a lot more than 130psi to be considered a performance engine.

BTW-2
I think the floorjets on the floor of the intake are a non issue.
I once took an intake off, looking for a missing one, cuz I was thinking; OMG if that thing rolls into a chamber this engine will be toast!
It turns out that the one floorjet was not even threaded, doggone-it. So then I cleaned out the heated-plenum crossover, since the intake was off anyway.
On my 2bbl intake, IIRC, those two floorjets were connected together, and to the EGR valve, which at idle is closed, and so they are supposed to be dead at idle. Furthermore, the EGR is supposed to stay closed when the engine is cold and at WOT.
The EGR valve is really only to be open when the engine is fully warmed up and you are cruising.
But there were several different methods used in those years, and I don't remember them all.

BTW-3
16 inches of vacuum seems a bit low, but, at your elevation may be ok, IDK. If you suspect a leak, have you considered a leak into the Valley? The way I prove that is to flip the PCV out of the cover and seal both the valvecovers, then put the vacuum gauge on the dipstick tube, then start her up. In this set-up, there should NOT be any vacuum to be read. Instead at idle, pressure should slowly build up; how fast will depend on how well your rings seal. Try not to let it get over 3>3.5 psi, cuz by 4psi, something is gonna want to blow, and if the rear cam plug pops out, yur gonna be real mad at me. Don't panic, the pressure does not rise that quickly.
But;
1) if you find vacuum, with the PCV flipped out, yur gonna have to pull the intake off and fix the dang thing. and/or
2) if you don't find pressure, then the CC is leaking somewhere which also will have to fixed.
3) With the PCV out, and the engine idling, you gotta have pressure; no store-bought rings in the world will seal 100%. Well, a Plasma-Moly in a straight round bore, comes pretty close, which is why I installed them in my engine.

Yeah so; best of luck to you
 
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Did you retorque intake manifold check for vacuum leak around runner those metal gaskets can leak over time they usually leak on the end cylinders
 
Take the breather off. hold the carb open and listen for air including at the exhaust at the end of the pipe. Take out the spark plug and air up the cylinder. Listen where the air is coming from . If its the intake then its the intake valve, The exhaust its the exhaust valve or the breather its the rings or a piston. Now you know what it is. I am guessing it needs the heads redone and new head gaskets
 
230 at the pipe is almost perfect the rest are Lean...
 
SOLVED

I threaded a pipe plug into the floor of the intake and now she idles like a kitten. So much smoother, vacuum is up to 19.5 inHg and temperatures are much closer.

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bad exhaust valve.
Check for suction at the tailpipes, with engine idling, obviously.
Or do a Leakdown test,
Funny how your first mention is super similar to the effect he was having with the open EGR ports on the floor. Nice guess AJ! Well done.
SOLVED

I threaded a pipe plug into the floor of the intake and now she idles like a kitten. So much smoother, vacuum is up to 19.5 inHg and temperatures are much closer.

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I was reading the thread but I could not figure this out in my head. I didn’t notice the OEM intake. Also to be honest, I would not have guessed the floor jets making this kind of ruckus. I e always sealed them up from the get go figuring…. WHY-O-WHY would I want them open in the first place?!?!?!

Glad you got to the issue and ….. (LOL) plugged up the problem!
 
Swapped the intake for a fresh blue painted one. Wonder if I need to plug the hole in the floor? People say no need to plug, but I left the upper plane threaded hole unplugged and those 4 cylinders were running like dog **** until I plugged it. Lower plane hole is still wide open.
Is there an EGR valve on the manifold? If yes is the valve leaking or stuck open? Is there vacuum going to it at idle?
 
Are you sure it's blocking it off? I can't remember how it is configured. On some chevys a flat plate won't block it off.
 
The plate will separate the half’s on the intake. It’s impossible for the exhaust gas to travel to under the intake. The EGR valve has a vacuum operated valve that is open under idle to mid-ish throttle. It will close under a heavy throttle, approximately 3/4 of the way down. I don’t remember the exact reading I took on my EGR valve, but it was something like 9-11 inches.

When the WGR valve is open, it allows the exhaust gas to travel from one side of the intake to the other side. The plate blocks it off, period. Unless there is a bad gasket under it. Even then, it’s a very low amount.
 
You have an EGR valve block off plate on that intake manifold so you should not have needed to install that plug. Although it fixed the problem, you probably should remove that block of plate and inspect it for leaks there. With the block of plate installed and sealing properly, there would have been no need for the plug.
 
The plate will separate the half’s on the intake. It’s impossible for the exhaust gas to travel to under the intake. The EGR valve has a vacuum operated valve that is open under idle to mid-ish throttle. It will close under a heavy throttle, approximately 3/4 of the way down. I don’t remember the exact reading I took on my EGR valve, but it was something like 9-11 inches.

When the WGR valve is open, it allows the exhaust gas to travel from one side of the intake to the other side. The plate blocks it off, period. Unless there is a bad gasket under it. Even then, it’s a very low amount.
I'm sure you mean impossibly for exhaust to travel under the intake as in into the intake valley, right? Because exhaust DOES travel under the intake VIA the EGR passages and the exhaust cross over. Right?
 
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