Sway bar tutorial

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OleNatesOlds

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Would like some input on the differences in mounting and shape over the years to document changes in front sway bar configurations. Include pics to illustrate, please! When addressing lca mounts, I would like to see measurements in anticipation of adding them to a non-sway lca. Also, discuss pros/cons of each (lower c.o.g. versus tire/wheel clearance versus aftermarket support). Thanks
 
It would be one hell of a lot simpler if you'd give us some idea of what you are starting with

For example, my 67 Dart now has a 73/ 4 K member and a 73/4 factory sway which is inside the K as opposed to underneath for 67--72

"It might be" that this doesn't matter for some aftermarket bars
 
It would be one hell of a lot simpler if you'd give us some idea of what you are starting with

For example, my 67 Dart now has a 73/ 4 K member and a 73/4 factory sway which is inside the K as opposed to underneath for 67--72

"It might be" that this doesn't matter for some aftermarket bars

I think he's asking for a all inclusive answer.
The Book Of A-body Stabilizer Bars written by.... ?
 
I think he's asking for a all inclusive answer.
The Book Of A-body Stabilizer Bars written by.... ?



Here it is.
"The Book Of A-body Stabilizer Bars", written by FABO members:

(dead link deleted)

Edit - I guess you can't post a search result thread... If you search 'sway bar tab', entire posts under 'suspensions...' most of the info is there.
 
I have a '69 Dart Custom stock k-member and non-sway lca (that I will add boxing plates to the undersides of and hopefully sway bar brackets). But not just looking to get info for my benefit. I think a collective thread would be good for all as a one-stop reference. At the very least, if it's already somewhere let's get it together here as relevant post/thread links, not just a search of 'sway bar' or whatever. A thread could be dead months ago with a good post on the 5th page and someone might remember it. Still, a discussion would be useful. Maybe this could turn into a sticky at some point.

I think he's asking for a all inclusive answer.
The Book Of A-body Stabilizer Bars written by.... ?

Basically.

And this is a dead end for me:

Here it is.
"The Book Of A-body Stabilizer Bars", written by FABO members:

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/...archid=7435436
 
Ok, well here's the thing.

72/ later LCA uses different sway bar tabs than 73/ later

Aftermarket probably have their own complete "kit" unless it's made to replace a factory one, in which case you'll need to know what you HAVE. How can we possibly account for what all aftermarket was, is, or will come?

Seems to me you are asking us to do your searching, to repeat what has been posted before, and I will agree that it should be stuck. As in, a sticky.

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1969916173

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=259706

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?p=1969969774

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=231939

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=44747

http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=124741

http://www.hotchkis.net/press_release.html?ID=32
 
Sorry, I guess you cant post a search result. Worked right after I posted, but now it doesn't. :eek:ops:See my edit.
Not saying a single thread wouldn't be great, but there is a lot of info already posted. If you run the search I did, I think most of what you are asking is answered in the first several threads.
I was going to make tabs for mine with measurements given in one of the threads, but found all the factory parts from other members here.:prayer:
 
I have a '69 Dart Custom stock k-member and non-sway lca (that I will add boxing plates to the undersides of and hopefully sway bar brackets). But not just looking to get info for my benefit. I think a collective thread would be good for all as a one-stop reference. At the very least, if it's already somewhere let's get it together here as relevant post/thread links, not just a search of 'sway bar' or whatever. A thread could be dead months ago with a good post on the 5th page and someone might remember it. Still, a discussion would be useful. Maybe this could turn into a sticky at some point.



Basically.

And this is a dead end for me:

So you want to add factory brackets to your LCA's? Or add brackets that might come with an aftermarket kit?

If you are going to add factory brackets, just swap the entire LCA's over. Put new LCA bushings in replacements and reinforcement plates if you like. The LCA reinforcement plates are not necessary for a mild upgraded suspension. But if you can weld yourself and make the plates yourself it's cost effective (1" wide plate just as effective).

There are aftermarket conversion sway bar kits that give you good LCA sway bar tab replacements. Firm Feel, Hotchkis, and Helwig. Hotchkis sway bar tabs are welded onto the LCA. The Firm Feel and Helwig are bolt on. All three of those brands are hollow tubular sway bars. But Helwig offers are solid one also for a little less money than their tubular kit.

The Addco 67-72 A-body aftermarket sway bar kits have very poor LCA sway tab hardware, very poor sway bar to k-member attachment hardware, and the general fit is not as good as the three other brands listed above. Addco's are also the least expensive ones you'll find for sale in general.

I don't think the Hotchkis 67-72 sway bar kits use the factory LCA tabs. So don't bother to add factory tabs to your LCA if you buy that kit. Their kit moves the tab inward to a new spot. Nice thing with that is it gives you room to mount your disk brake calipers in the forward position easily if you choose.*

The Firm Feel and Helwig kits give you options to use the factory sway bar tabs or use provided well built hardware to mount the LCA sway bar tab. If you use their provided LCA tab hardware you can mount the caliper in the front easily.*

*You can mount the caliper in front with the factory 67-72 sway bar tabs IF you run shortened sway bar end links.

So look at those three brands: Helwig, Hotchkis, Firm Feel. Look at the details of their construction, installation instructions, and hardware. Then choose the one that fits your budget the best.

I personally would not spend the time and money putting factory sway bar tabbed LCA's on the car if you are going with one of those three better quality kits.
 
The aftermarket starts to get a little confusing with their different methods of mounting and providing clearance. It's interesting though.

(All in reference to my '69 here - sorry)...
Judging at least from Summit's site, it looks as though the Addco is bent inward more (than Helwig's at least) right before the ends, but mounts rather low on the arm, so this is necessary for clearance(?). The frame mounts look higher on the Addco and so doesn't require the kink in the middle to clear the k-member-to-rad-support bracket.

I really like the clearance provided by the Hotchkis setup - kind of a hybrid piece (as mentioned) that brings the bar inside the strut rod just slightly and mounts similar to the 73-76 bars, but geez - 1 1/2" diameter !? Are they really hardcore or something? I don't see any other diameters listed. Has anyone had a smaller bar made on request?

What bar(s) do the Energy brackets fit? Just stock? Because they look a lot like the FF, Helwig, and Hotchkis brackets but with smaller diameter bushings.

Personally, I'm not looking to change the K-member or LCAs out, so aftermarket it is. I agree - Addco bracketry looks sucky. Ultimately, I will have rear facing calipers with 225/50-16 in front which means 5" backspacing (w/ factory bar at least). Perhaps that wouldn't put factory type brackets out completely as I have welder, some skill, and materials... Just looking to be very cost efficient yet effective in my case - which will be mostly street duty w/ slant 6 by the way.
 
The aftermarket starts to get a little confusing with their different methods of mounting and providing clearance. It's interesting though.

(All in reference to my '69 here - sorry)...
Judging at least from Summit's site, it looks as though the Addco is bent inward more (than Helwig's at least) right before the ends, but mounts rather low on the arm, so this is necessary for clearance(?). The frame mounts look higher on the Addco and so doesn't require the kink in the middle to clear the k-member-to-rad-support bracket.

The frame mounts are a joke on the Addco. Best way to fix that is with the Energy conversion brackets/bushings 5135 and buy the appropriate sized bushing.

I really like the clearance provided by the Hotchkis setup - kind of a hybrid piece (as mentioned) that brings the bar inside the strut rod just slightly and mounts similar to the 73-76 bars, but geez - 1 1/2" diameter !? Are they really hardcore or something? I don't see any other diameters listed. Has anyone had a smaller bar made on request?

The sway bar is mounted further inward than the 67-72 wide style and Hotchkis and Firm Feel. So that decreases the affective rate of the sway bar so it needs to be thicker. Also Hotchkis stuff is high performance oriented side.

What bar(s) do the Energy brackets fit? Just stock? Because they look a lot like the FF, Helwig, and Hotchkis brackets but with smaller diameter bushings.

They fit a stock sway bar. But they will also fit an Addco sway bar to get a better mount. But you will have to put the right sized bushing in there. That Energy kit still is not as beefy at the FF, Helwig, and Hotckis brackets. But they will work and tons better than the Addco brackets or a smashed original bushing/bracket



Personally, I'm not looking to change the K-member or LCAs out, so aftermarket it is. I agree - Addco bracketry looks sucky. Ultimately, I will have rear facing calipers with 225/50-16 in front which means 5" backspacing (w/ factory bar at least). Perhaps that wouldn't put factory type brackets out completely as I have welder, some skill, and materials... Just looking to be very cost efficient yet effective in my case - which will be mostly street duty w/ slant 6 by the way.

The Hellwig sway bars are made with a kink in the arms to fit high backspace tires. There are pictures on FABO of this. I think FF's have room for high backspace too. Call and check.

5" backspace rims and a factory wide 67-72 may rub the sway bar. It will be close. The Addco sway bar I believe it wide like the factory and does not have the kink in the arms for tire clearance.
 
This Addco bar looks to have a kink in it - I assume for tire/wheel clearance:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aco-150/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

And summit shows two Hellwig styles:

With kink: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-5906/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

No kink: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-55906/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

(These all look to use the same end link mount technique using a 90-degree bracket at the lower shock mount, so at least in overhead view they are all located the same)
 
This Addco bar looks to have a kink in it - I assume for tire/wheel clearance:

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/aco-150/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

And summit shows two Hellwig styles:

With kink: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-5906/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

No kink: http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hel-55906/overview/year/1969/make/dodge/model/dart

(These all look to use the same end link mount technique using a 90-degree bracket at the lower shock mount, so at least in overhead view they are all located the same)

It's the design, quality, and rugged-ness of the attaching hardware that make the Hellwig, Hotchkis, and Firm Feel sway bars much better than the Addco.


The sway bar on the top of this picture is a special part number Hellwig made for using a 67-72 A-body sway bar with 5.72" backspacing 17x8 etc Mustang Rims. Now I don't know what that part number is though. You'd have to ask Mopardude318 or Dave@Hellwig

What looks like a sway bar on the bottom is just a mock up Mopardude318 made from PVC tubing. Read Mopardude318's thread on his 67-72 A-body front end rebuilding and detail pictures of the Hellwig sway bar hardware here: http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=92816&page=4

These are Mopardude318's pictures and car using the :

nn3xtt.jpg


11gn47c.jpg


5ecndw.jpg
 
Not to hijack this thread , but it seemed a good place to get some info I looking for and add it to the thread.

I am looking for some measurements from a factory 66-72 lower control arm sway bar brackets.

It seems that the b-body brackets can be bought, but not the a-bodys.

Any help would be appreciated.
 

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  • A-body lower controll arm with sway bar tab dems.jpg
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We do offer two kits for the 67 - 72 A-body.

P/N 55906 is a 1-1/8" tubular FSB that will mount to the factory tabs or our tabs provided.

p/n 55917 is a 1-1/4" tubular FSB set up for Pro-Touring style wheel and tire combinations. It actually kicks under the strut rod so it only works with the tabs provided in our kit. It will not work with factory tabs.

One of the features that sets our bars apart is our frame brackets. We have dedicated lh and rh brackets that are laser cut and cnc formed from 3/16" steel. They tuck the sway bar up as close to the k-member as possible. THe pictures also show our end link tabs which are made from 3/8" thick spring steel. THe endlinks are shown with the wheels hanging and will straighten up once the weight of the vehicle is on the ground.

394071648.jpg


394071649.jpg
 
Dave,
2 Q's:

Is the 55917 what I see as mopardude318's setup?

Would using the factory mounts or shortening your provided end links tuck that area closer to the strut rod and give more wheel clearance on the 55906?

Thanks
 
The 55917 is similar to mopardude318's setup

If you are having wheel clearance issues with p/n 55906, end link attachment and length are not going to solve the problem as the point of contact is farther up the bar than where the end links are attached. You will need to get the 55917
 
I have heard the PST solid bars are re-branded addcos (?). Did they improve on the mounting hardware then? And are their tubular pieces Hellwigs w/o hammertone finish?
 
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