This tire vs. this tire...

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ckj688

ckj688

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Okay, torn between two tires, help!

Which would you suggest?

Yokohama S. Drive

yo_sdrive_ci2_l.jpg


or

Direzza Sport Z1 Star Spec

du_dir_spt_z1_starspec_ci2_l.jpg
 
I can't help you because I know nothing about either one, but for the guys who can, what are they going on and what are you going to do with them?
 
Sorry for the lack of info, the Dunlops are $20 more, and is an extreme performance summer tire, the Yokohama's are a ultra high performance summer tire, they will be put on my Dart for street and occasional track use
 
Unless you are doing a bunch of suspension upgrades you won't ever be able to get the potential out of those tires on the twisties and they won't work well on the strip either.
 
Never heard of the Direzza before, but the Yokos I've owned on my past little cars ran quiet and seemed to outlast their predicted life.
 
1968FormulaS340 said:
Actually, some would argue that tires are the single biggest upgrade you can make for handling.
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Very true but to a point. You just aren't going to get the full potential of those tires on a stock suspension mopar from the 70's. BUT, I did check them out on Tire Rack's web page and they are very reasonably priced so if they have a size that's fits what you are trying to do then why not.

I would recommend reading the Tire Rack reviews on them. Seems some of the reviews say the Dunlap is scary on wet roads.
 
dgc333 said:
Unless you are doing a bunch of suspension upgrades you won't ever be able to get the potential out of those tires on the twisties and they won't work well on the strip either.
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I did do a major suspension upgrade which is why I'm looking for a good tire to make it worth it
 
ckj688 said:
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Can't see that. You have to be a member of that site.

For the front tires, if you are going with 5.72 backspace you can get a 17x8 rims. Then run a 245/45/17 tire. That tire has some more sidewall meat than a 225/45 also. ALWAYS check the front lower fender lip to tire clearance while having someone else turn the tires. Cars vary because of production variation and past collision work. You may cut/roll this area back.

In the rear a 17x8 with 4.5 backspacing with 245/45/17's.

MUST READING:

http://www.moparfins.com/CLAIRDAVIS/Cobra_Wheel.htm

What upper ball joints do you have in your car. You have to have the flat type for 5.72" backspace rims. Read here: http://www.moparfins.com/CLAIRDAVIS/1969_front_end.htm


You can run 275/40/17 in the front of your Dart if you cut the front lower fender lip. Picture here: http://www.cpwclub.com/images/fronttirewheel.jpg BUT I don't think you could fit a 275/40/17 in the rear of a dart with the the car lowered for handling without moving spring and/or rolling the rear fender lips back.
 
One thing I know is tires.Michelin Certified Tire Tech/Manager here.


I have NEVER heard of Direzza,you say they are made by dunlop?

The Yoko is a great tire.Great Dry traction performance,and good treadware for what kind of tire they are.Wet performance will not be the best,but you drive a RWD muscle car,so I take it you know to go easy in the rain?


As far as:dgc333 Unless you are doing a bunch of suspension upgrades you won't ever be able to get the potential out of those tires on the twisties and they won't work well on the strip either.

This is so wrong I dont even know where to begin.

You will never see the full potential of your 360 in your 3,000 lbs. Mopar,so unless you are going to build an aluminum full frame chassis for it,its a waste of time.

Does that bring it into perspective for you? Just because you dont drive a Porsche,does not mean you will not benifit from a better tire,NO MATTER WHAT! In fact if all of our old Mopars had light weight aluminum wheels,with low pro performance tires on them,they would be faster,stop quicker,steer better,and save some fuel economy.I am not trying to be an ***,just trying to get you to see why what you said was wrong.

As far as bad for the drag strip,true.But, that is why they make slicks/drag radials. Dont know about anyone else on here, but usually I run the best street tires I can,drive to the track and bolt on slicks/competition tires(autox,road race)race and when I am done bolt my street tires back on and drive home.I would NEVER pick a street tire because it was not drag friendly.A good drag tire is the complete opposite of what you want on the street.
 
ckj688 said:
Sorry about the pics!

Here they are...so you can see em!

View attachment 80547

View attachment 80548

View attachment 80549
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If you spend all the money and time on a Alterkion front end for handling reasons, I'd sure as hell would get something bigger than a 225 wide tire to give the rest of those upgrades the most grip possible.

5.72 backspacing shouldn't be an issue with an alterkion. It's an issue with stock spindles, and really a problem with the dropped spindles.

Forget the pissing around, what can you do in the rear to fit 275/40/17's in a 72 Dart to match 275/40/17's in the front!
 
autoxcuda said:
If you spend all the money and time on a Alterkion front end for handling reasons, I'd sure as hell would get something bigger than a 225 wide tire to give the rest of those upgrades the most grip possible.

5.72 backspacing shouldn't be an issue with an alterkion. It's an issue with stock spindles, and really a problem with the dropped spindles.

Forget the pissing around, what can you do in the rear to fit 275/40/17's in a 72 Dart to match 275/40/17's in the front!
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I always thought that 225 would be too wide for the front? I'd also need to get wheel spacers for the back, didn't know it would be capable of fitting that wide a tire
 
ckj688 said:
I always thought that 225 would be too wide for the front? I'd also need to get wheel spacers for the back, didn't know it would be capable of fitting that wide a tire
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The factory backspace on a 15x7 rallye/cop rim is 4.25. When you run 7" wide rim with 5.72 backspace you are pulling the tires in an 1.5" inches. That give you room between the fender lips for more tire. But you have to keep the diameter down.

I've run 15x7 4.25 bksp cop rims with 225/60/15 on my 68 Dart. And 15x8 4.5 bksp rallyes with 245/50/15's. You just gotta really watch the lower front fender lip to tire clearance.

The rear of the 67-69 Dart have that fender skirt design that hurts clearance. And the 70-72 have it too. A buddy of mine had a 71 Swinger that had to lip the rear fender to fit 245/50/15 road race DOT tires with 15x7 4.25 cop rims. Those tires are a little wider then regular street tires.
 
ckj688 said:
I always thought that 225 would be too wide for the front? I'd also need to get wheel spacers for the back, didn't know it would be capable of fitting that wide a tire
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i run a 225/50-17 on the front with the same suspension.


i am running a nitto 450 tore. it has been great in the rain and dry weather. i'm sure on a road course i would want something stickier but they have been great on the street.
 
Grinder said:
As far as:dgc333 Unless you are doing a bunch of suspension upgrades you won't ever be able to get the potential out of those tires on the twisties and they won't work well on the strip either.

This is so wrong I dont even know where to begin.

You will never see the full potential of your 360 in your 3,000 lbs. Mopar,so unless you are going to build an aluminum full frame chassis for it,its a waste of time.

Does that bring it into perspective for you? Just because you dont drive a Porsche,does not mean you will not benifit from a better tire,NO MATTER WHAT! In fact if all of our old Mopars had light weight aluminum wheels,with low pro performance tires on them,they would be faster,stop quicker,steer better,and save some fuel economy.I am not trying to be an ***,just trying to get you to see why what you said was wrong.

As far as bad for the drag strip,true.But, that is why they make slicks/drag radials. Dont know about anyone else on here, but usually I run the best street tires I can,drive to the track and bolt on slicks/competition tires(autox,road race)race and when I am done bolt my street tires back on and drive home.I would NEVER pick a street tire because it was not drag friendly.A good drag tire is the complete opposite of what you want on the street.
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The design of the old mopar suspension was good for it's day but by today's standards it's not very good. The caster & camber change through the suspension range of motion and the amount of body roll don't allow for the tire to remain flat on the road. The bump steer in the front, rear steer introduced by the layout of the leaf springs and the generally soft bushings and flexible suspension parts induce instability that doesn't inspire confidence during high speed driving in the twisties.

With a stock suspension car you will reach the limits of the suspension (either because it can't keep the tire in contact with the road or the handling is spooky enough that you won't go faster) before you do of the tires. That is why I said you won't see the full potential of the tires without suspension modifications. I still stand by by my statement.

Personally I can't see spending the up to $200 or more that the typical "Ultra Performance" tire costs in that situation. However, if you looked at my second post after I had gone to the Tire Rack site and the tires ckj688 has mentioned are well under $100 each right in the same price range something like a BFGoodrich Radial TA and suggested that he should go for it.

Then after seeing the upgrades he has down to the suspension the tires are right in line with what would be appropriate.

As far as my being able to get the full potential out of my 360, I do almost every time I drive it. I have done a lot of suspension upgrades, to my car not as extensive as the coil over Alterkation kit cjk688 has done but I have made a very significant improvement in the handling.
 
dgc333 said:
The design of the old mopar suspension was good for it's day but by today's standards it's not very good. The caster & camber change through the suspension range of motion and the amount of body roll don't allow for the tire to remain flat on the road. The bump steer in the front, rear steer introduced by the layout of the leaf springs and the generally soft bushings and flexible suspension parts induce instability that doesn't inspire confidence during high speed driving in the twisties. .
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The new Mustangs with MacPherson strut suspension have worse camber gain in compression and roll. Same for the FWD strut cars.

4 links have rear steer too.

I don't have bump steer numbers on modern cars nor older ones, but I would not assume just because it's newer it has less bump steer. I believe they sell bump steer corrector kits for modern cars, so they must not be perfect.

Personally I can't see spending the up to $200 or more that the typical "Ultra Performance" tire costs in that situation. However, if you looked at my second post after I had gone to the Tire Rack site and the tires ckj688 has mentioned are well under $100 each right in the same price range something like a BFGoodrich Radial TA and suggested that he should go for it.

Then after seeing the upgrades he has down to the suspension the tires are right in line with what would be appropriate.

As far as my being able to get the full potential out of my 360, I do almost every time I drive it. I have done a lot of suspension upgrades, to my car not as extensive as the coil over Alterkation kit cjk688 has done but I have made a very significant improvement in the handling.
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I agree, that going from a $130 tire to a $230 tire is not going to give you much bang for the buck if you haven't done many of mods and refinements to the rest of the chassis.
 
get yourself some offset rear spring hangers and run 275s. i have 255s on my 69 dart with springs i nstock location, ive seen guys with 275s but its real tight. i have 245s on the front of the duste ron bullit rims. i bought fairly cheap high performance sumemr tires. summitumos they are some sticky mf'ers, made ahuge difference in the way the car drives.
 
So what would you all say is the widest I could get away w/ stock everything except the disc's on the rear?
 
245/45R17 Front 255/45r17 rear - depending on space / do the rear discs move anything outward? I run P245/45r17 rears on 17x8 5.72" BS bullets with 1967 8 3/4" no spacer just clears the outer inner fender on the rear. Any bigger on the front & I would rub. I will post photos of mine after the weekend.
 
ramcharged, what body 1967 rear are you runnin? im guessing b body? i have the same rims, same size tires on a duster and needed a 1" spacer with an abody rear. not that it effects the tire width.
 
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