Timing Chain-moving the Crank

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equium

equium

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Shingle Springs, CA
70 Valiant, 318
Replacing timing chain. Old chain/gears were aligned with dots at 12 and 6 prior to removal.
New Mopar P5249267 double roller set purchased.
When I try to install, the crank gear is off by a few degrees.
The old chain was loose and had 10* of play, so I think some teeth may have jumped.
So, can I move the crank back an inch or so to align the new gears?
Thanks
Danny
 
Gears need to be aligned to make it chooch. So the answer to your question is yes.verify your balancer is correct also,slip on tining cover and make sure mark is at zero. Paint the timing mark while you have it off, its easier.
 
P5249267-2.jpg

Is this the part?
 
So I just took a closer look at the new and old crank gears (photo attached). The new gear has what appears to be a very noticable DOT. but does not match the old gear (on the left). If you look very close at the new gear, there is a faint "dot" that matches the dot on the old gear.
Should I go with this faint dot?

timing gears.jpg
 
The noticable dot is the keyway you use to install with no advance or retard. Look to left (3 teeth) of that keyway and you will see a smaller dot on the outer edge.
 
Uh oh. Did I buy the wrong part? I just looked a little closer at the applications for this part. can I still use this?
 
Thanks for the replies. I ordered the wrong part and just now ordered the correct one. sorry for crying wolf. Hope this may eventually help someone from making my mistake in the future.
thanks everyone
 
In my opinion cam sprockets (they are not gears in this case) should be replaced in sets with the chain. I've replaced "just chains" on DD back in the day, but never on anything performance, or unless it's a used used "junker" that "just runs"

'N yeh. What you have there is a sprocket for advance/ retard use. They normally have three symbols, one for each keyway. Round for "stock" square for one setting, and triangle for the third. The corrosponding mark will be on the matching keyway, which will be somewhere around 1 O'clock when "right."

So far as moving the crank, just MOVE it. The timing marks only align at one point. Sometimes you have to "juggle" the crank a bit to align it. I ALWAYS use a straightedge to make darn sure my old eyes are not "crossed" LOL
 
Yup, went through it on a chevy 3 days ago. Three keways and the dot depicts the oem position. As mentioned above there is an additional small dot adjacent to the correct tooth-valley actually.
 
equium said:
So I just took a closer look at the new and old crank gears (photo attached). The new gear has what appears to be a very noticable DOT. but does not match the old gear (on the left). If you look very close at the new gear, there is a faint "dot" that matches the dot on the old gear.
Should I go with this faint dot?

View attachment 1715079488
Click to expand...
It sure looks usable to me.
 
69_340_GTS: I thought so too. The new gear is slightly larger than the old one. I'm not sure if this is 'cause it's a double roller set or not. I don't want to risk it. I already didn't want to do this timing chain, let alone have to do a full rebuild; lol
 
The difference between the new set and the replacement sprocket you got is the old set was an aftermarket type with 3 keyways cut on the crank sprocket to allow you to advance or retard the cam timing. I think the new part will work even though the listings didn't include your 1970 318. An LA timing set is an LA timing set as far as function. It just doesn't have that adjustment feature your original set had. You just turn the crank sprocket to line up the marks and your good
 
you got a new double roller crank cog and an old silent type cog, they are not interchangeable with your old silent type chain
<< disregard, I see you bought the double roller set>>>>>
 
Last edited:
fishy68 said:
I think the new part will work even though the listings didn't include your 1970 318. An LA timing set is an LA timing set as far as function. It just doesn't have that adjustment feature your original set had. You just turn the crank sprocket to line up the marks and your good
Click to expand...
The other way around... the old set did not have the adjustment feature.....

OP this chain is good for the LA 318's of all years, including yours. It is a much better chain than you had.

If you want to use it: Look at the crank sprocket; each of the slots will have a small dot just under the gear teeth between 2-1/2 and 3-1/2 teeth to the left of each slot. If you want stock cam timing, then pick the small dot that is exactly 3 teeth to the left of the nearest slot. Use that small dot at 12 o'clock and the cam sprocket dot at 6 o'clock. BTW, there should have been a paper with the chain set that told you which stamped symbol (that appears over each slot) is for 0 cam timing change or standard cam timing, for advanced timing, and for retarded timing.

Once you get it on but before putting on the timing cover, accurately lay a straight edge from the center of the cam bolt to the center of the hole in the crank; those dots should line up along that edge. It is a good check on you eyeballing the dot-to-dot alignment.

Use some lock-tite on the cam bolt after cleaning the oil off and cleaning the oil out of the cam snout hole, and make sure you torque that cam sprocket bolt to spec.
 
nm9stheham said:
The other way around... the old set did not have the adjustment feature.....

OP this chain is good for the LA 318's of all years, including yours. It is a much better chain than you had.

If you want to use it: Look at the crank sprocket; each of the slots will have a small dot just under the gear teeth between 2-1/2 and 3-1/2 teeth to the left of each slot. If you want stock cam timing, then pick the small dot that is exactly 3 teeth to the left of the nearest slot. Use that small dot at 12 o'clock and the cam sprocket dot at 6 o'clock. BTW, there should have been a paper with the chain set that told you which stamped symbol (that appears over each slot) is for 0 cam timing change or standard cam timing, for advanced timing, and for retarded timing.

Once you get it on but before putting on the timing cover, accurately lay a straight edge from the center of the cam bolt to the center of the hole in the crank; those dots should line up along that edge. It is a good check on you eyeballing the dot-to-dot alignment.

Use some lock-tite on the cam bolt after cleaning the oil off and cleaning the oil out of the cam snout hole, and make sure you torque that cam sprocket bolt to spec.
Click to expand...
This is great advice, especially the locktite part. Mine loosened,eccentric for fuel pump slipped and i ran out of gas. In my power wagon breaking a trail in 3 feet of snow.
 
with the #1/#6 pistons at TDC the crank keyway will be at ~1:30 & the marks closer to the center of the cam gear (lower) are for picking the correct keyway slot on sets that have advance/retard & straight up (3 keyways) & the dot up closer to the tooth root are for getting it dot to dot (6/12 o'clock). yes the various mfrs combos of dots/triangles/squares/rectangles etc can be confusing plus some ain't stamped evenly so they can be even more in disarray. If the "dot" for 6/12 "dot to dot" is in the same relationship to the tooth that is above it (under it/near under it/halfway or partly inbetween teeth) as the old one & the dot is the same distance around an imaginary arc from the crank keyway as the old one then you are golden.
 
nm9stheham said:
Hopefully you weren't be followed by a bunch of Ford and Chevy guys .... Your only defense would have been "Well, look who had to break trail!" LOL
Click to expand...

Chevy dragged me out, after we filled the box with 8 foot firewood. Took a lot of tugging. How embarassing.
 
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