To upgrade intake manifold on not?

Which intake?

  • Current Performer

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Performer RPM

    Votes: 6 54.5%

  • LD340

    Votes: 5 45.5%
  • Total voters
    11
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W

Wvbuzzmaster

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This will be a quick opinion thread, as I am debating a manifold change... quick backstory. If I didn’t already have to pull the intake to replace the lifters I wouldn’t be considering changing the current Edelbrock Performer intake, because the trouble of changing it would not be worth it for the insignificant gains I probably won’t feel one a cruiser car. However, since I had inclination to change it before and now have to have intake off... should I change it?

I know this intake topic is beat to death so intend of asking if an intake is better, i already know going from Performer to Performer Rpm is better, and Air Gap is better again. Also know about LD340 is good and in the range of the RPM. So since car is going to be Spring to fall and I do have factory X heads... I am going to stick with an intake with the heat exchanger passage. So that limits me to three intakes, current Performer, Performer RPM, LD340, and I only own one of these three intakes already.

Quick specs and some of these will be close enough since I did not build the engine:
340 with forged crank and forged 10:1 pistons .030 over (nothing special)
Mopar purple camshaft, 284 advertised duration, 484 lift, hydraulic flat Tappet
Edelbrock 750 which may change to AVS2 650 soon
Changing from Hedman long tube headers to TTI shorty headers (wanted more clearance around things in engine bay/steering parts.)
Rebuilt X heads that are most likely just stock freshened, but was told had been mildly ported, which who cares...
talking engine probably makes best guess around 400 horse tops, never dynoed so basing on similar builds and dyno simulator program estimated around 350 horse.
Oh, still have stock torque converter on the 727 trans and a 8-3/4 with 3.91 gears. I know I would benefit from higher stall converter but not going to happen right now.

Going to make this a poll. I don’t want this to become an argument over numbers, cause I am not drag racing, I am back roads driving the car, so flow numbers are cool, but I am seat of the pants performance on this car... and knowing new carb vs new intake I am spending $400 each, do I skip intake and just get the improved carb because changing intakes won’t see as big of a difference? Or will changing to a dual plane with intake runners that are not T intersections a benefit even with better carb for seat of the pants feel?
 
Performer RPM over the LD340 because the runner shape is more conducive to maintaining velocity.
Since the throttle will rarely be at or near fully wide open, the Performer you own is probably not hurting.
Not a fan of the Ed 750 unless the boosters are extended and the tubes checked and fixed if needed.

PS the shorty TTIs are a royal PIA on the driver side.
 
If I were going to change it, I would use an Edelbrock AirGap RPM. Spring and fall won’t be a problem for you. I drive my car year round with an AirGap RPM and don’t have any issues. In the winter it’s not uncommon for it to be in the upper 30’s when I fire my car off to go to work. It might take a little bit longer to warm up, but it’s really not that much of a difference compared to an intake with a heat exchanger.

But you probably won’t notice much of a difference on a street car/cruiser. I probably wouldn’t even bother changing it to anything other than the AirGap RPM unless you happen to have a regular performer rpm just laying around.

As for the TTI shorties, if you’re looking for more clearance under the hood you won’t get it. They’ll improve your ground clearance quite a bit compared t the Hedman long tubes because they stay about the steering linkage. But they’ll still be tight to everything in the engine compartment. I bought a set of TTI shorties to put on my Duster to improved the ground clearance compared to my Doug’s long tubes. They saved a little bit of ground clearance, but they had just as many tight spots and clearance issues as the Doug’s. Just different ones. So I ended up putting the Doug’s back on. I’ll put the TTI’s on my Dart when the engine goes back in it.

My install of the TTI’s is here in my build thread My "new" '74 Duster- or why I need a project like a hole in the head
 
I have the long TTIs in my 72 340 duster with manual steering and power brakes. There not that tight and I don’t have clearance issues. Can easily change plugs, get to the stater, and change the long wix 51510R oil filter with the 90 adapter... we put flowtech longs on my friends 70 Dart and that was a huge PITA; plus he only has about 3.5 clearance from the ground..
 
Thanks for that info about the TTI shorty headers... their pics on their website shows it clearing the oil filter much more than your experience... my passenger side Hedman long tube clears a shorty filter right on the block and if I bash it I could get the tall filter on... so... hope not making mistake over there. On driver side I’m fighting my pitman arm after installing new not demolished engine and trans mounts, solid poly mounts now. I know with any header you trade problems. The shorty headers seemed like a good idea and all my current headers are is in the way... and in driver side the headman blocks the spark plugs on the rear two of that bank... TTI only ones that offered the tubes that go from the header to under the car, the other ones didn’t on their shorty headers... is Dougs headers better on their shorties or am I just making myself crazy...
 
RPM. The AG-RPM will have cold weather issues. It the regular RPM since it has a heat cross over. Your gains will be mild.
 
My set up is similar and use to have an airgap. It was ok I guess. But went to a Victor 340 intake and that really gave the 360 a much better throttle response over the airgap.
 
Wvbuzzmaster said:
Thanks for that info about the TTI shorty headers... their pics on their website shows it clearing the oil filter much more than your experience... my passenger side Hedman long tube clears a shorty filter right on the block and if I bash it I could get the tall filter on... so... hope not making mistake over there. On driver side I’m fighting my pitman arm after installing new not demolished engine and trans mounts, solid poly mounts now. I know with any header you trade problems. The shorty headers seemed like a good idea and all my current headers are is in the way... and in driver side the headman blocks the spark plugs on the rear two of that bank... TTI only ones that offered the tubes that go from the header to under the car, the other ones didn’t on their shorty headers... is Dougs headers better on their shorties or am I just making myself crazy...
Click to expand...

It’s all definitely a trade off. It would have been one thing if I was installing them for the first time on a car, but because the Doug’s already fit and matched the rest of my exhaust and are good headers I just decided to stick with them.

The oil filter was definitely an issue, although part of that is probably my canton plate because it’s definitely thicker than stock. Still there wasn’t much room there.

I didn’t remove my pitman arm to do the install. All I did was separate the pitman from the center link, then then the wheel so the pitman was out of the way. Separating the pitman from the center link is way easier than pulling the pitman from the steering box.

rumblefish360 said:
RPM. The AG-RPM will have cold weather issues. It the regular RPM since it has a heat cross over. Your gains will be mild.
Click to expand...

Have you run one?

Because I have. I’ve got over 25k miles of year round daily driving in my Duster, and like I said when I start my commute in the winter it’s not uncommon for it to be in the 30’s. Occasionally colder than that too. I haven’t had any more “cold weather issues” with the Duster and it’s 340 and air gap than I did with my Challenger and it’s mild 318 with an edelbrock streetmaster, which has a crossover and wasn’t nearly as high strung as the 340 is. And by that I mean nothing beyond the typical old car with a carburetor that needs 5 minutes to warm up kind of thing. If there’s a difference it’s minor, and nothing that can’t be dealt with.


QuickDart360 said:
My set up is similar and use to have an airgap. It was ok I guess. But went to a Victor 340 intake and that really gave the 360 a much better throttle response over the airgap.
Click to expand...

That might be the case with your engine, but I think you’re in the minority with liking the victor 340. I had one and couldn’t give the thing away. The airgap outperforms it everywhere but absolute wide open.
 
72bluNblu said:
It’s all definitely a trade off. It would have been one thing if I was installing them for the first time on a car, but because the Doug’s already fit and matched the rest of my exhaust and are good headers I just decided to stick with them.

The oil filter was definitely an issue, although part of that is probably my canton plate because it’s definitely thicker than stock. Still there wasn’t much room there.

I didn’t remove my pitman arm to do the install. All I did was separate the pitman from the center link, then then the wheel so the pitman was out of the way. Separating the pitman from the center link is way easier than pulling the pitman from the steering box.



Have you run one?

Because I have. I’ve got over 25k miles of year round daily driving in my Duster, and like I said when I start my commute in the winter it’s not uncommon for it to be in the 30’s. Occasionally colder than that too. I haven’t had any more “cold weather issues” with the Duster and it’s 340 and air gap than I did with my Challenger and it’s mild 318 with an edelbrock streetmaster, which has a crossover and wasn’t nearly as high strung as the 340 is. And by that I mean nothing beyond the typical old car with a carburetor that needs 5 minutes to warm up kind of thing. If there’s a difference it’s minor, and nothing that can’t be dealt with.




That might be the case with your engine, but I think you’re in the minority with liking the victor 340. I had one and couldn’t give the thing away. The airgap outperforms it everywhere but absolute wide open.
Click to expand...
Yeah at 1st I was hesitant to try victor. But was pleasantly surprised how well it did!! Your right it's all about the combo I guess.
 
I had same 340/X/284-484/3.91 rear in my 65 and I went with a Holley Strip Dominator. Hauled *** with a 650 Demon and before that a 750 spreadbore holley DP:ugly carb but ran great! . 3.91 really makes the car feel light and the motor/cam/2800 convertor responded to the higher RPMs nicely.
 

“rumblefish360:” said:
RPM. The AG-RPM will have cold weather issues. It the regular RPM since it has a heat cross over. Your gains will be mild.
Click to expand...
Have you run one?

Because I have. I’ve got over 25k miles of year round daily driving in my Duster, and like I said when I start my commute in the winter it’s not uncommon for it to be in the 30’s. Occasionally colder than that too. I haven’t had any more “cold weather issues” with the Duster and it’s 340 and air gap than I did with my Challenger and it’s mild 318 with an edelbrock streetmaster, which has a crossover and wasn’t nearly as high strung as the 340 is. And by that I mean nothing beyond the typical old car with a carburetor that needs 5 minutes to warm up kind of thing. If there’s a difference it’s minor, and nothing that can’t be dealt with.
Click to expand...
An AFB & a RPM-AG?
Ahhhhhhhhhhh, yea, I have. That’s why I said what I said. I’m not talking out of my *** here. Why would you think (via your questioning) that I would be doing so.
Though I really see the need to proof read what I write. LMAO!

Allow me to Clarify something(s).
A bit of a more detailed response as well.

I suggest the regular RPM for the heat crossover.
I don’t suggest the regular RPM-AG during the winter.
You will Most likely if not certainly (geographical location dependent) almost definitely, 100% have cold weather issues. Why?

The most common set up’s are a basic carb & 1/8 - 1/16 thick gasket on top of intake with an open air cleaner. There is no heat in the intake or carb. It is possible to have icing issues as well. (again geographical location can have an impact on this.)

There are ways to help avoid the incoming freezing cold air from closing the choke even if the engine temp gauge says your warmed up.

A closed air cleaner like a factory unit.
Adding a heat stove off of the manifold or header.
While heat is a power looser, it does help drivability in the cold winter days.

@72bluNblu - While I live on Long Island, about as far south in New York as you can be, the winters can fluctuate in severity. On the low end, winter days can be in the teens with overnights well below zero. Other times it can be mild in the low 40’s. The mild temps do not apply here.

Also....
@Wvbuzzmaster Did not say much in order of how he is running his set up which leaves me to fall back on the worst thing, assumption, an error on the cautious side that someone will always find room to comment on how there stuff runs great and mine doesn’t with a side poke of I must have ether no idea what I’m doing or I have never done that.

At what exact temperature the problems started at, I do not remember. But I do know West Virginia can get pretty freakin cold! (Been there done that.)

This has been my experience with the RPM-AG intake and AFB carbs with an open air cleaner up top during the winter.

At what outside temp your running your car at with whatever set up you have, IDK. From where I stand, it sounds like you have magic air for your car.:poke:

How is your set up done?
OH! 25K yearly?
NICE! Very nice.
:thumbsup:
 
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I think the later intake, either Performer or RPM, will probably make a little more tq & hp than the LD. That's because more knowledge gained over the intervening years about airflow has been incorporated into later designs.
Whether the gains are worth the expense of a new manifold is another matter...
 
Amazing as I’ve been using cold air intakes since 1980 and haven’t had an issue. That’s all I use. If you can’t get the fuel atomized without that power robbing heat, use a different booster.
 
yellow rose said:
Amazing as I’ve been using cold air intakes since 1980 and haven’t had an issue. That’s all I use. If you can’t get the fuel atomized without that power robbing heat, use a different booster.
Click to expand...
It’s really of a choke issue. A quick reacting choke will close quickly and grab the high idle.

I know... I know... no stinkin chokes for you....
 
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