WHAT IS THIS??

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jfive

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Hi all,

I will start off by saying i have 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger 2 door. 318/904. I have been lurking and gathering info for a while now. i have made purchases on recommendations as well as found other advise that pertains to my Dart. i purchased from another FABO user, when i got the car home we had a freeze that night and i busted a freeze plug as the PO had just filled with water after a water pump replacement. Figured i would replace all them, so i have remove the engine sent the trans to a shop for rebuild as it wasn't working properly, and since i had it out......when i was able to get to the freeze plugs i could see several were very rusty, 2 were replaced with rubber compression plugs, and another was weeping water ever so slightly. so i knocked them out and found this, what could i do to clean out the passages to make sure all of this sludge and what feels like sand out of engine? this is a picture of what came out of the freeze plug in trans area on the left. i have dug out as much as i could and then i used a wire to break loose the stuff that was up and around the plug. all plugs have been removed and i wanted opinions on what i should do next?? any help would be appreciated.

engine.jpg
 
jfive said:
Hi all,

I will start off by saying i have 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger 2 door. 313/904. I have been lurking and gathering info for a while now. i have made purchases on recommendations as well as found other advise that pertains to my Dart. i purchased from another FABO user, when i got the car home we had a freeze that night and i busted a freeze plug as the PO had just filled with water after a water pump replacement. Figured i would replace all them, so i have remove the engine sent the trans to a shop for rebuild as it wasn't working properly, and since i had it out......when i was able to get to the freeze plugs i could see several were very rusty, 2 were replaced with rubber compression plugs, and another was weeping water ever so slightly. so i knocked them out and found this, what could i do to clean out the passages to make sure all of this sludge and what feels like sand out of engine? this is a picture of what came out of the freeze plug in trans area on the left. i have dug out as much as i could and then i used a wire to break loose the stuff that was up and around the plug. all plugs have been removed and i wanted opinions on what i should do next?? any help would be appreciated.

View attachment 1716209194
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Casting sand in the bottom of the cooling jackets. Pull all the plugs out and get the garden hose out. It will take a long time to flush it all out. Straighten a coat hanger to get in and loosen the stuff up. You will be shocked at how much you get out of it.
 
Casting sand from when the block was poured.
When I was at that point, I used coat hangers and whatever else and just scraped everything I could get to. Regular hose nozzle flush, and that was about it. Finished up with a full set of brass plugs & a bit of RTV.
 
i do appreciate the quick reply, i thought it was sand, but why would there be so much in there? Was it just not cleaned well during casting? the engine ran but i am assuming this could make it run warmer than it should?, any way to run a filter to catch what i may have missed? or is it just stuck in there? sorry for all the questions i just dont want any issues going forward once i get this cleaned up and plugged.
 
After you spend a little while, there won’t be enough left in there to worry about. It’s been fine in there for all these years so far.
 
jfive said:
i do appreciate the quick reply, i thought it was sand, but why would there be so much in there? Was it just not cleaned well during casting? the engine ran but i am assuming this could make it run warmer than it should?, any way to run a filter to catch what i may have missed? or is it just stuck in there? sorry for all the questions i just dont want any issues going forward once i get this cleaned up and plugged.
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The casting sand didn't get shook out at the foundry. That's all it is.
 
Temporarily seal the engine back up if you can (I usually do this before I knock all the plugs out) and fill the block with vinegar; and let it sit for a day or two. Then knock out all the plugs and flush thoroughly as described above. This helps loosen the sand and all the rust that has accumulated over the years. My driveway smells like pickles when I'm done...
I've heard of people using Draino for this, but it's a little too caustic for me to get soaked with when I flush it out.
 
i guess i didn't think of it being that way for over 50yrs, and i will NOT be using vinegar, that stuff is worse that my dogs getting spayed by skunks, lol. i will clean as best as i can and plug it up. thanks again to everyone for the quick responses
 
That “sand” might be calcium and mineral dropout. Same stuff that forms in your home water heater over time.

Spending your time and effort now trying the reach and clean the furthest from the freeze plug holes will just resist overheating in future.

Your time is very well spend cleaning the passages out.
 
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Don't forget, the block was probably NEVER flushed during its life either. It should be done every few years to clean out the crud that builds up in the cooling system. Antifreeze will turn acidic after a few years & will slowly eat away at the cooling system (Cast iron, aluminum etc.) if not changed once every couple years. You will probably find rust scale & such in that gunk too.
Thats why core plugs rot from the inside out. Not many people do this.
 
jfive said:
i do appreciate the quick reply, i thought it was sand, but why would there be so much in there? Was it just not cleaned well during casting? the engine ran but i am assuming this could make it run warmer than it should?, any way to run a filter to catch what i may have missed? or is it just stuck in there? sorry for all the questions i just dont want any issues going forward once i get this cleaned up and plugged.
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Poor quality control
 
Flushed many blocks over the years. Incredibly messy job! I don't envy you a bit! Do it outside on grass or gravel if you can. It can sure stain concrete and asphalt.
 
Brooks James said:
Poor quality control
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Well, yes and no. That's the way things were done back then. Right or wrong. I bet the technology has changed now days for shaking sand out of cores.
 
It has been 20 some years since I worked in machining cast metals but we still found sand in them. The tool coolant spray would often bring it out. In this case, lower back of an engine block, it's not going to travel. There is no turbulence. Only circulation. The small stuff might lift and travel a little but will return to the same place again when circulation stops. Get a clear jug of sanding creek water and see for yourself. Swirl the filled jug to cause circulation the set it down unlevel. Come back tomorrow to find clear to lowest point.
Having said all that, I couldn't resist breaking some of the slag from left rear of my 273 while the starter and knock out were removed.
 
jfive said:
Hi all,

I will start off by saying i have 1970 Dodge Dart Swinger 2 door. 318/904. I have been lurking and gathering info for a while now. i have made purchases on recommendations as well as found other advise that pertains to my Dart. i purchased from another FABO user, when i got the car home we had a freeze that night and i busted a freeze plug as the PO had just filled with water after a water pump replacement. Figured i would replace all them, so i have remove the engine sent the trans to a shop for rebuild as it wasn't working properly, and since i had it out......when i was able to get to the freeze plugs i could see several were very rusty, 2 were replaced with rubber compression plugs, and another was weeping water ever so slightly. so i knocked them out and found this, what could i do to clean out the passages to make sure all of this sludge and what feels like sand out of engine? this is a picture of what came out of the freeze plug in trans area on the left. i have dug out as much as i could and then i used a wire to break loose the stuff that was up and around the plug. all plugs have been removed and i wanted opinions on what i should do next?? any help would be appreciated.

View attachment 1716209194
Click to expand...
Well, I'll be the 1st to say it here, but those aren't 'freeze plugs'. They are simply core-hole plugs, which is where the casting sand is supposed to exit the casting when cooled, and for Your sake I hope that nothing in the block cracked. Those plugs rarely "save" a block from damage if all of the water truly freezes solid, get the plugs in & pressure test the system thoroughly, best of luck.
 
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