Windage Tray Height Location

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YO7_A66

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Windage Tray location up/down:

I am installing my windage tray on my 340/420 bottom end. I now have the ARP main cap studs that have the 3/8”-24 mounting studs for the tray. These are fully threaded so that the tray can be moved up/down to fit under the pan.

My main concern is, do I need to mount the tray as close to the crank/rods that I can, or as far up/away from the crank that I can?

Either way, it looks like it will be a little higher than with the OE main cap bolts with the tapped holes.

Thanks!

IMG_2294.JPG
 
Have you tried to fit the pan?
 
pittsburghracer said:
Does that cheap azz tray keep the oil out, or trap it in. Asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
I fitted the pan last night which caused me to modify the tray. I also had to modify the tray for the pickup tube clearance. Now that I have all the clearances figured out, I just need to set the height.
I figured I would try and make it fit, and if I couldn't, then I would just leave it off.

Good question PBR!

Thanks
 
I set mine low enough to clear the throw and haven't had a problem. Can see how close mine is if you zoom in. Had to grind down one or two studs to clear the pan(milodon) caused a dimple when I tightened it down.

20190302_150845.jpg
 
pittsburghracer said:
Does that cheap azz tray keep the oil out, or trap it in. Asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
On a hard launch...I'd bet it keeps plenty out. Probably doesn't make a huge difference on the dyno but I bet it makes a bigger difference in real life.
 
Uncle Bob said:
It seems like just one more thing to cut down on the splash oiling you need for a flat tappet motor to me, but it's just dinosaurs like me that still build those.
Click to expand...


One of our members had one break this year and almost lost an engine over it.
 
pittsburghracer said:
One of our members had one break this year and almost lost an engine over it.
Click to expand...
I had a guy give me a tray, but no bolts. I was told that changing to the studs to mount it requires machine work (don't remember what). I was past that point already, so I didn't use it. It might be for the best anyway. I'm already a nervous wreck about breaking in that cam (see thread about burnishing the lifter bores).

It's garage art now.
 
Don't believe that the stock windage tray was intended to be used with ARP studs.
This is my Milodon tray. It got tweaked a little here and there to clear a 4" stroke and fit the Milodon pan. That ear that is reinforced, word was that they may vibrate off, so tried a reinforcement. The studs do hit the pan in 2 places, welded 2 cup reliefs in pan.

20230808_181841.jpg


20230807_114515.jpg
 
If you look in the DC/MP bulletins or books you'll find a few paragraphs mentioning when the Chrysler tray is a help with a small block and when it was not. In all instances that it was recommended the openings needed to be increased. My recollection is that it was recommended as a power gain with relatively shallow pans.
There's some pics posted here or in the race forum showing I opened one up and installed expanded sheet metal like the milodon although back then I borrowed the idea from some other company's trays.

My understanding is the tray can do several things, one of which is act similar to a scraper.
 
Mattax said:
If you look in the DC/MP bulletins or books you'll find a few paragraphs mentioning when the Chrysler tray is a help with a small block and when it was not. In all instances that it was recommended the openings needed to be increased. My recollection is that it was recommended as a power gain with relatively shallow pans.
There's some pics posted here or in the race forum showing I opened one up and installed expanded sheet metal like the milodon although back then I borrowed the idea from some other company's trays.

My understanding is the tray can do several things, one of which is act similar to a scraper.
Click to expand...
Like this?

20190224_110736.jpg


20190302_143316.jpg
 
pittsburghracer said:
Does that cheap azz tray keep the oil out, or trap it in. Asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
I just had a discussion with my engine builder today about this. He said he can't assemble it until I get him the right main studs. I told him I did and he said no, he can't install the windage tray with the studs I gave him. I said exactly! He said I should run the windage tray for what I am doing. I thanked him for the advice and said "I'll go with what my buddy John told me". :thumbsup:
 
YO7_A66 said:
Windage Tray location up/down:

I am installing my windage tray on my 340/420 bottom end. I now have the ARP main cap studs that have the 3/8”-24 mounting studs for the tray. These are fully threaded so that the tray can be moved up/down to fit under the pan.

My main concern is, do I need to mount the tray as close to the crank/rods that I can, or as far up/away from the crank that I can?

Either way, it looks like it will be a little higher than with the OE main cap bolts with the tapped holes.

Thanks!

View attachment 1716124820
Click to expand...

I would bring that way down, how will it will fit with the stroker crank and main studs I don't know. But get it as close as you can get "within reason" mine ended up like this:
20221008_153806.jpg


pittsburghracer said:
Does that cheap azz tray keep the oil out, or trap it in. Asking for a friend.
Click to expand...
That was something that crossed my mind during the install - I added extra drainage slots & holes to help get oil back to the sump quicker.
 
-Boosted- said:
I just had a discussion with my engine builder today about this. He said he can't assemble it until I get him the right main studs. I told him I did and he said no, he can't install the windage tray with the studs I gave him. I said exactly! He said I should run the windage tray for what I am doing. I thanked him for the advice and said "I'll go with what my buddy John told me". :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Thank you everyone!

My first issue was when I tried installing the stock windage tray with the ARP studs. But, I just opened up the mounting holes on the windage tray to accept the 3/8” studs which fixed this issue. The ARP stud kit came with (8) 3/8"-24 mounting nuts to locate and mount the tray.

Then the next problem was the windage tray won't sit down as low on the ARP studs as the stock main studs would allow, so when I put the stock pan over it, the stock oil pan would hit the tray in one corner. So, I trimmed out the windage tray to allow the pan to fit properly and now the pan drops onto the oil pan mounting studs with clearance.

The picture I posted originally, show the nuts on the studs up a little bit from the lowest mounting height. I have since lowered the tray as far down as the studs would allow before I started trimming out the tray. The first picture shows the area that I had to trim out to clear the stock oil pan once I had the tray as low as possible. The second picture shows the clearance around the pickup tube that was required at this new height.

I should be back on this Thursday night to clean up the cuts that I made on the windage tray and rotate the crank to see if everything clears.



Thanks again!

IMG_2296.JPG


IMG_2301.JPG
 
Last edited:
I'm a little late to the party here but while searching FABO threads on windage tray info I came across this one. I am also getting ready to tear down my 340 and was thinking of installing ARP main/rod bolts. I planned on using the original windage tray for the rebuild, assuming there is one in it now. Engine has been gone through before before I bought the car. Not sure by whom. Are the big problems here the aftermarket stud/bolt kits used with factory trays or there issues with the stud/bolt kits no matter using a stock or aftermarket tray?

Looks like folks are having to slice/dice up both styles in order to make'm work with some cutting larger and possibly extra drain back areas in them. I saw that the tray "Matts440" posted has has larger openings and expanded wire welded in over them.

Are windage trays a good idea? I could see where they may restrict oil from getting back to the pan/pickup. Maybe that's more of an issue at higher rpms, especially with shallow factory oil pans?? Someone here mentioned possibly under hard acceleration as well. Ma Mopar engineers put them there for some reason, maybe they help power in other ways but starving for oil seems like a bad idea. If you need to open up existing oil drain holes and cut in additional holes, would it be best to just leave it out? Just curious.
 
Matts440 said:
Like this?

View attachment 1716125123

View attachment 1716125124
Click to expand...
Yes.
Sorry it too awhile to respond.
Here's the links to my post with the pictures of mine
www.forabodiesonly.com

Opinions on windage screen

Just curious to hear some opinions on this set up. Motor is a 3.58 stroke 360 that turns 7000 on gear change and 7200 or so out the back. Can't go wrong with the crank scraper IMO, but the windage screen is debatable. The screen should keep the crank from pulling the oil up out of the sump...
www.forabodiesonly.com www.forabodiesonly.com

and some more info on factory trays.
www.forabodiesonly.com

Small Block Windage Trays Exist in Different Profiles?

Gimme 5 . Hey 4spd. The only way I can get the top one to fit my 340 is with a torch and a welder . lol Are the holes in the bottom tray slotted. My phone blurs the picture when I enlarge it. If not a slot is the measurement the same across both trays center to center?
www.forabodiesonly.com www.forabodiesonly.com
 
Evidently, the factory thought they did something.
 
The windage tray was put in the 340s to keep splashing oil of the the crank shaft in order to reduce friction. A lot like engine builders knifing the crank weights. The engineers rated the 340 for 6,000 rpm’s from factory. If decently serves a purpose. And the oil drain should be suffice for any street car. As for a stroker, I don’t know. Lowering the tray into the oil may restrict some flow back to the pan, but at higher rpm may not be much oil to restrict the holes
 
I just made sure the one on my current slant build didn't hit the crank or pan.
 
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