Windage Trays And Etc During Cam Break-In

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12many

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Interesting that the article mentions lifter galley oil restriction and windage trays should not be employed during cam break-in. Along with faster rate aggressive lobes, increased spring pressure and higher rocker ratios, getting all the oil splash you can makes sense at least in theory. Also, we all have read of removing the inner spring of duals but some say that may not be enough, that installing lower ratio rockers during break-in also should be done. Who does or doesn’t do what when they break-in their flat tapper cam? (old slow lobes or faster aggressive) Feel free to opine. Top Reasons and Causes for Camshaft Failure
 
My cam called for stronger springs so I left the single stock springs for break in then changed. As for windage tray not happening while in car. I could see doing it on a stand . Curious if adding an extra quart of oil for more splash would help , then drain it off.
 
Kendog 170 said:
My cam called for stronger springs so I left the single stock springs for break in then changed. As for windage tray not happening while in car. I could see doing it on a stand . Curious if adding an extra quart of oil for more splash would help , then drain it off.
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I’ve got the MP tray that’s been in there since the first go round (with a slower lobe cam and softer single springs) but when swapping cams you have to loosen and drop the pan at the front in order to fit the timing cover, but I was planning on removing the pan (I have unobstructed access) to reseal everything properly. Never thought of removing that tray for break-in but I like the idea of additional splash and the added cooling it would likely provide, especially for an aggressive lobe cam, stiffer springs and increased rocker ratio. Certainly can’t hurt.
 
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The last time I broke in (or used) a HFT cam I used a heating pad on the oil tray and hot water in radiator. Not sure if it helped but the cam survived .
From here on though I will only use roller cams.
 
12many said:
Interesting that the article mentions lifter galley oil restriction and windage trays should not be employed during cam break-in. Along with faster rate aggressive lobes, increased spring pressure and higher rocker ratios, getting all the oil splash you can makes sense at least in theory. Also, we all have read of removing the inner spring of duals but some say that may not be enough, that installing lower ratio rockers during break-in also should be done. Who does or doesn’t do what when they break-in their flat tapper cam? (old slow lobes or faster aggressive) Feel free to opine. Top Reasons and Causes for Camshaft Failure
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I didn't think of tht when I broke in my solid flat tappet 273. It has the valley tray and the crank windage tray. That was 10 years ago. No issues.
 
I had a cam wipe a lobe years ago with a comp hydraulic cam (XE295HL), did everything right (removed inner springs, etc), but I lost that engine. I went roller with the next engine with a small solid roller (XR286R). All was well...but I wanted more out of the engine. It was running 10.7's-10'8's normally, but the heads had low 10 second potential...unfortunately my rockers could not take any more spring pressure, so a bigger cam was not a cheap option. The cheapest solution for me was to switch to a solid cam, rather than drop over a grand for a bigger solid roller and new rockers. I ended up with Howards EDM lifters (oil through down to the cam face) and a nice healthy Hughes solid cam. Did the break in with break in oil and removed inner springs (same as always)....and I'm happy to say that I had no issues with this one. I used Lucas Hot Rod oil after break in. I probably won't go back to another roller unless my rockers kick the bucket. I good solid cam can get you similar performance to a roller if you build the combo right.
 
Seems like I had an argument with someone last year, they said that the crankshaft oil fly off wasn't a main contributor to lubricating camshaft lobes, now we are saying that it is?
 
Knock on wood! I have probably only done 6 cams in my lifetime . Luckily no issues. 2 had windage trays
 
I don’t have time to read the article right now, but I will later. I can’t image that beating the oil into a foam without the windage tray is a good thing.

In fact, Kevin at Ishishira-Johnson told me the opposite now that I think about it. He said run the tray and the scraper on break in.
 
CRUZE 418 said:
Seems like I had an argument with someone last year, they said that the crankshaft oil fly off wasn't a main contributor to lubricating camshaft lobes, now we are saying that it is?
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More of "here's an article" that includes a few "recommendations" as well as other statements. And asking for opinions, and insight into what others here do or don't do. Is it possible that if pulling a windage tray prior to or installing one after break-in was in fact a piece of cake it would be just another preventative step taken to ensure everything possible was done to help keep the cam well lubed and cooled in order to prevent a wiped cam? Some here have never pulled springs and have had no issues, but on the other hand there are those that did everything recommended and still wiped lobes. Or had one wiped down the road. Just an interesting article I ran across and caused some thought
 
We will be on the dyno and using a windage tray when we break in the solid flat tappet for the 400/450 we're building. But I promise I won't put the windage tray between the crankshaft and camshaft.....so I think it will still get some splash oiling from the crank. My plan is to use the windage tray between the oil pan and the crankshaft and I think we'll survive without any oil whipped up out of the oil pan. I'll accept the blame if my plan doesn't work out.
 
So how do folks that run dry sump oil systems break in their cam?
Those are specifically designed to not allow for any extra splash oil to be flinged around inside of the crank case.
 
You break in a cam at 3000 RPM with the car sitting still. You are not going to whip up and excessive windage doing this. That happens at higher RPM with the oil sloshing around.
So removing the windage tray is silliness.

Use a dedicated break in oil, not shelf oil with additive.
Make sure the lifters rotate
Use weak springs if you have a big cam.
varying the RPM between 2500-3000

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Ok, read the article and I totally disagree with their assessment of using a windage tray. The windage tray has ZERO control of, or affect on camshaft lubrication.

The cam and lifters are oiled from the oil escaping the rod bearings. The oil slinging off the rods is incredible, even at an idle.

So that part of the article is straight wrong.

Even when running roller lifters I keep the idle speed at 900-1000 RPM because the oil throw off the rods is what lubes the rollers as well.
 
Another article written by writers.

This is 2021. If you're running a flat tappet cam so wild it can't handle a break-in with a windage tray (??), you have no business putting an engine together.
 
As far as who the writer is all it says in the article is "Tech Tips courtesy of Crane Cams" and written by Engine Builder. So who knows the exact provenance of those particular statements. Who wants to opine on plugging, tubing, restricting the lifter galley and any effects on cam break-in? I know plenty have and do. That statement pretty much would rule out doing any of that especially after break-in. Likely not an agreeable statement there either

Quote: "It is not recommended to use any type of oil restrictors to the lifter galley, or use windage trays, baffles, or plug any oil return holes in the valley. Oil has a two-fold purpose, not only to lubricate, but also to draw the heat away from whatever it comes in contact with. The cam needs oil splash from the crankcase and oil run-back from the top of the engine to help draw the heat away. Without this oil flow, all the heat generated at the cam is transferred to the lifter, which can contribute to its early demise."
 
The problem with the article, among others, is it is a general set of tips being applied to all engines. It is a shotgun approach which might apply in some cases, not in others.

If your cam is so devoid of oil that it is transferring damaging heat to the lifter, you have bigger problems at hand.

In most engines, there is plenty of oil coming down out of the lifter bore itself to keep the cam lobe oily.
 
I have installed 3 different cams into my street-367.
Not one got break-in oil.
Every one was run in it's final assembled configuration with dampered springs, with a windage tray, and with the 7qt Milodon road-race pan but with only 5 quarts in it.
After break-in, I installed a new filter and just DROVE it, no mercy.
The cams were;
292/108/.508 Mopar
270/276/110 Hughes
276/286/110 Hughes
I pulled the 292 measured it and sold it to a racer
The 270 cam dropped lobes 4 years later, right after an oilchange; yeah you guessed it,due to lack of ZDDP.
The 276 has been in there since 2004 or 05, not sure. This cam is the most heavily sprung on account of I like the sound of dual 3" pipes screaming at 7200, for 5 to 7 seconds atta time, competing with the howling tires.
Maybe I'm just lucky..........
 
12many said:
As far as who the writer is all it says in the article is "Tech Tips courtesy of Crane Cams" and written by Engine Builder. So who knows the exact provenance of those particular statements. Who wants to opine on plugging, tubing, restricting the lifter galley and any effects on cam break-in? I know plenty have and do. That statement pretty much would rule out doing any of that especially after break-in. Likely not an agreeable statement there either

Quote: "It is not recommended to use any type of oil restrictors to the lifter galley, or use windage trays, baffles, or plug any oil return holes in the valley. Oil has a two-fold purpose, not only to lubricate, but also to draw the heat away from whatever it comes in contact with. The cam needs oil splash from the crankcase and oil run-back from the top of the engine to help draw the heat away. Without this oil flow, all the heat generated at the cam is transferred to the lifter, which can contribute to its early demise."
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The issue with that quote is the cam is NOT lubricated by “oil splash from the crankcase”. That’s just wrong. The very last thing you want is oil splashing out of the pan and back up on the cam and lifters.

Neither is the cam lubricated by oil flow back to the pan from the top end. What oil does come down that way ends up getting bashed around by the crank and rods and that’s not good for the oil. That’s some of what windage trays and crank scrapers do...keep the oil in the pan and off the crank. That’s a huge power savings and it keep air out of the oil.
 
Like I’ve said, I found it interesting as I never have read or heard about windage trays and restrictions in the lifter galley etc not being recommended “during break-in” until I stumbled on that particular article. It seems though after searching a little that there are others out there on many forums asking, others opining on the merits or theory as well as articles where the same things are mentioned. Here’s one taken from Comp Cams that essentially say the same thing: The Dragtime News - Flat Tappet Camshaft Basics
This all has just raised an eyebrow and on the surface seemed to make sense. And a somewhat interesting topic. Problem for me is I’ve never been in an engine crankcase to actually see what really is taking place during a cam break-in and it’s doubtful I’ll ever get around to putting a GoPro in there either so:realcrazy:
 
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The factory not having 26-27-28 degree major intensity, higher lift cam lobes or the spring open pressures/rates that we have today maybe? Idk
 
It's probably fair to view all of those articles created by cam companies as part truth and part cover-their-***. If they can point the finger at some other cause, it alleviates their culpability in cam failures.

I think it's fair to say that the cam business is like every other business in today's world....they suffer from a loss of talent, expertise, dedication, and an overage of bean counters and liability concerns.

I'm getting to be a cranky old bastard regardless, but it's starting to bother me that I notice more and more when I call a tech line I'm talking to someone who clearly sounds 25 or 30 years younger than me. And, they tend to be a little long on swagger and a little short on substance. You come to realize they're reading you the party line, not offering sound guidance.

Then again, the world is a different place. 50 years ago, if you wiped a cam...you pretty much figured you did something wrong and tried again. And you kept it quiet, because you didn't want to embarrass yourself. Now, when it happens, you get on the internet and tell 3.2 million people what a shitty cam XYZ Cams they made for you.
 
The problem with FT cam/lifter failures over the last 25 yrs has nothing to do with oil, & everything due to poor quality lifters. Soft [ Chinese ] metal & incorrect radius, or no radius, on the lifter face. We know this in this country because for DECADES, we have re-surfaced FT lifters due to the high cost of new ones. When done properly, they are as good as new & can be re-faced 2-3 times if not severely worn. We know about the problems because the people re-surfacing the lifters were finding soft metal, wrong or incorrect radiusing on new lifters. Not the oil, but the oil companies saw a marketing opportunity & went for it....

For the last 20+ years, I have been grinding a groove down the side of the lifter, from the oil band to within about 1/8" of the base. The lobe/lifter gets a positive oil supply & is no longer reliant on splash. I use a Dremel with a cut off wheel, go about 0.015". Takes 15-20 min to do 16 lifters. Is it really necessary? I don't think it is because of all the oil flying around, but I sleep easier knowing I don't need to worry about lifters/lobes failing from lack of oil.
 
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