440 blocks stroked/bored to 528 @ 13-1?

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airwoofer

airwoofer

Drivetrain limit explorer
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What is the story on the main webs on a 528 based on a 440 block? I have seen special caps that can be used with a cross bolt from the side of the block but they really don't look like much.

Any experience in a 528 with 13-1 CR running 110 race gas?
 
the block you are mentioned must be the mega block, it uses 3/8" side bolts. i used a stock block for my first build at 512" which is a 4.375 bore and a 4.250" stroke. i don't see why a 4.375" stroke wouldn't fit also. on my motor i used aluminum rods and had to clearance the bottom inside of the cylinders. you may have to do this also. the mega block comes with the clearance notches and i didn't need to do any more clearancing. you may not need to do any more clearancing with steel rods with a 4.375" stroke. you need a minimum of .060" clearance for the rods. by the way i set the motor at 14-1 compression by milling the heads .090" with flat top pistons.
 
Yeah, this will be the "next thing" for the drag Demon after I shake it down with the street 416/904. That is the rotating kit that will be used. Cam ain't crap either and neither will be the rest of the valve train. Builder is kinda a HP freak who likes big cam lift. He is already talking alum caps and that girdle. I am worried about the stock block holding up.

WARNING: Our stroker kits have been known to cause the following adverse effects, even when used properly: Please read this section fully before ordering.
Many customers have reported the following issues:
1. Extreme tire wear, especially in the rear.
2. Premature driveshaft failure.
3. Speeding Tickets.
4. Increased dry cleaning bills, especially for underwear.
5. Premature U-joint failure.
6. Learning to drive with tires boiling in all gears.
7. Unexplained smiling at the thoughts of taking your ride out next.
8. Plastic surgery bills to remove your "perma-smile"
9. Premature axle failure.
10. Annoyed neighbors from loud exhaust, screeching tires, late night wrenching sessions, etc.

If you experience any of these effects, please do not attempt treatment yourself. Do not call a medical professional for treatment advice. Proceed immediately to the nearest drag strip. Apply maximum acceleration repeatedly for 4-8 hours. Warning: This is only a temporary cure. You may find more frequent trips to the drag strip will become necessary. In test subjects, this behavior has been proven to become extremely habit forming. Frequent consultations with Visa and/or Mastercard may temporarily ease pain and suffering, however "the bug" will almost certainly return with increased intensity. If this happens, reapply Visa, Mastercard and drag strip, in that order. Don't say we didn't warn you!!
 
you probably wont need to run 7000 rpm lol. gonna put down tons of power on the drivetrain. only other thing (bob up there knows lots about this) is the oiling. lots of guys cap off the #4 cam journal oiling and come up through the back to oil the rocker shafs. it keeps the back main/rod journals nice and oiled that way. especially if you plan on runnin 7k.

this is gonna be a beast lol. you gonna need to keep a broom in the car to keep the chicks off the hood posing in their bathin suits
 
airwoofer said:
WARNING: Our stroker kits have been known to cause the following adverse effects, even when used properly: Please read this section fully before ordering.
Many customers have reported the following issues:
1. Extreme tire wear, especially in the rear.
2. Premature driveshaft failure.
3. Speeding Tickets.
4. Increased dry cleaning bills, especially for underwear.
5. Premature U-joint failure.
6. Learning to drive with tires boiling in all gears.
7. Unexplained smiling at the thoughts of taking your ride out next.
8. Plastic surgery bills to remove your "perma-smile"
9. Premature axle failure.
10. Annoyed neighbors from loud exhaust, screeching tires, late night wrenching sessions, etc.

If you experience any of these effects, please do not attempt treatment yourself. Do not call a medical professional for treatment advice. Proceed immediately to the nearest drag strip. Apply maximum acceleration repeatedly for 4-8 hours. Warning: This is only a temporary cure. You may find more frequent trips to the drag strip will become necessary. In test subjects, this behavior has been proven to become extremely habit forming. Frequent consultations with Visa and/or Mastercard may temporarily ease pain and suffering, however "the bug" will almost certainly return with increased intensity. If this happens, reapply Visa, Mastercard and drag strip, in that order. Don't say we didn't warn you!!
Click to expand...
Gotta love salesman.....
 
HP goals, dunno. I am just a passenger on this ride writing the checks. Reqt's are 110 race gas compatible 1/8 mile drag engine in the Demon. Will use fenderwell headers - need a source and Mazzolini ( http://www.bobmazzoliniracing.com/ ) doesn't show their any longer so need some ideas for them. Gonna use this rotating assy and 440-1 heads that are CNC machined by Indy. Gonna sell the rockers, lifters and pushrods that are in the kit and use other stuff.

http://www.racingjunk.com/Engines-Components/2894676/BB-Mopar-Indy-Heads-and-440-SOURCE-.html

Even at 2900# and 700 HP it still calculates out to under 6.00 for the 1/8th. Car may be lighter, don't know yet. Should be fun and I suspect will need wheelie bars. 8 3/4 ladder bar w/ coil over, old race car being restored.
 
bOb shingler said:
the block you are mentioned must be the mega block, it uses 3/8" side bolts. i used a stock block for my first build at 512" which is a 4.375 bore and a 4.250" stroke. i don't see why a 4.375" stroke wouldn't fit also. on my motor i used aluminum rods and had to clearance the bottom inside of the cylinders. you may have to do this also. the mega block comes with the clearance notches and i didn't need to do any more clearancing. you may not need to do any more clearancing with steel rods with a 4.375" stroke. you need a minimum of .060" clearance for the rods. by the way i set the motor at 14-1 compression by milling the heads .090" with flat top pistons.
Click to expand...

How did the mains hold up in that build Bob? This kit has chebby main journals I think for clearance - 440 source 528 kit with -4cc pistons.
 
the main bearings held up just fine. i didn't rebuild the balancer in time, i missed that part of the maintenance, my fault, and the #2 main webbing in the block cracked up to the #2cylinder. at this time i decided to go with the supercharger and purchased an unbored mega block and used the main bearings in it. to lower the compression i used a 1/8" shorter rod. this put compression at 10.5-1, perfect for blown alcohol for a larger tuning window. all was well until an aluminum rod decided it didn't want to stay inside for what ever reason. i then went to a kb stg 10 solid aluminum block with a new set of rods. i used the some 7 pistons and a new one. i had to get a new set of rings as that one had piston captured the 2 compression rings and i couldn't get them loose. oh ya i had to get the crank welded up and turned .010" under. the bottom end is doing just fine now. such is life in the fast lane, oh well.
 
So the root cause of the #2 web in the stock block failing was the dampener was worn out? Was it then allowing the crank to vibrate (harmonics) and that failed the #2 web? What were the cockpit symptoms of the web cracking? Oil pressure dropped? I doubt it would make much noise due to being constrained and the lack of mufflerage.

Is this the first block to fail of the one that had a blower on it with alum rods? I see cross bolted steel caps kinda like the ones I saw being installed into a 440 block locally.

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That KB block looks nice, same with the alum World block.
 
the balancer was a take apart unit the you put silicon lube in it. it didn't fail it was because i didn't pull maintenance on it. the crack was just a hair line one and i didn't even see it until the light of the sun hit it just right as we were loading in the back of the truck to go pressure wash it. no symptoms at all while it was running. this was my nos motor.
 

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No symptoms of a main web cracking is scary. Guess that kinda puts the kybosh on my idea to paint the block black.

How much HP is the blown motor putting out and how fast is the beautiful Demon with it? What class / index were you running? Weight, gears, tires, rear end specs? Using a glide or a 727?
 
airwoofer said:
HP goals, dunno. I am just a passenger on this ride writing the checks. Reqt's are 110 race gas compatible 1/8 mile drag engine in the Demon. Will use fenderwell headers - need a source and Mazzolini ( http://www.bobmazzoliniracing.com/ ) doesn't show their any longer so need some ideas for them. Gonna use this rotating assy and 440-1 heads that are CNC machined by Indy. Gonna sell the rockers, lifters and pushrods that are in the kit and use other stuff.

http://www.racingjunk.com/Engines-Components/2894676/BB-Mopar-Indy-Heads-and-440-SOURCE-.html

Even at 2900# and 700 HP it still calculates out to under 6.00 for the 1/8th. Car may be lighter, don't know yet. Should be fun and I suspect will need wheelie bars. 8 3/4 ladder bar w/ coil over, old race car being restored.
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Honest opinion - as the check writer you need to have a goal before you start or you'll be writing checks well beyond what you need to. Be it ET, MPH, or horsepower. You've stated some parts you want to use - not a goal.
IMO - if you want to bracket race at 700hp - buy a good block and don't look back. Some engines make more steam than that N/A but it a simple matter of time before they give up. Girdles, caps, and the best machining still won't make as much power as a good block and the cost will end up within hundreds of a better new unit. Last 512" block prep I had done was $3200 to the customer and that was simple main studs - no caps, sonic test, all the std machining, and oil system mods. It makes 580hp/600tq on pump fuel. A new iron block that needs some work to bring to similar standards but will have room to grow and rebuild and never break will run $2800. An aluminum new block that needs nothing and will never break is $4800.
 
moper said:
IMO - if you want to bracket race at 700hp - buy a good block and don't look back. Some engines make more steam than that N/A but it a simple matter of time before they give up. Girdles, caps, and the best machining still won't make as much power as a good block and the cost will end up within hundreds of a better new unit. Last 512" block prep I had done was $3200 to the customer and that was simple main studs - no caps, sonic test, all the std machining, and oil system mods. It makes 580hp/600tq on pump fuel. A new iron block that needs some work to bring to similar standards but will have room to grow and rebuild and never break will run $2800. An aluminum new block that needs nothing and will never break is $4800.
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This is probably the best advice you will get. When you look at the big picture of it all, the bottom line $$, a good block will not add that much to the cost of it all.......if you are to the point of needing/wanting aftermarket caps, girdles and pouring concrete in it.....
 
Yup, that is my quandry. Builder thinks that a stock 440 with alum caps and a good girdle will support 800HP+. I am looking to run 6.0 index and calculators have me needing almost 800 HP at 2800#, 800', 80*, 80%.

What iron block is $2800 and what alum block is 4800? The cheapest AVAILABLE block seems to be the Koffel KP-440 at $3900.

http://www.moparmax.com/tech/2007/ii_10-block-2.html
 
Why run such a long stroke when you can make that power with a much shorter 4.15" stroke and its less stress on the block. I just built a 11/1 pump gas 500" 440 stroker and it made 750hp with a small 950hp carb. I'm using stock caps with a Hughes girdle. Time will tell how long the block holds it but balancing and proper machining is key to a long lasting motor.
 
That is what the crank is in the parts I bot. That is really good power with the 500 CI motor. Especially on pump gas. What heads are you running?
 
Indy EZ's ported by Modern Cylinder Head. We bolted on an Indy tunnel ram with 2 750hp carbs and made 773hp without much tuning. I'm sure with more compression, cam and carb it would be well into 800's.
 
airwoofer said:
No symptoms of a main web cracking is scary. Guess that kinda puts the kybosh on my idea to paint the block black.

How much HP is the blown motor putting out and how fast is the beautiful Demon with it? What class / index were you running? Weight, gears, tires, rear end specs? Using a glide or a 727?
Click to expand...

i haven't even got a full pass yet, something always seems to go wrong, it might have something to do with the name but the last time out i got a half 1/8 mile in and the ticket read 6.00 on the first pass. the second and last one the high pressure oil line blew out and i had to abort the ran, it's hard to see out with the windows covered in 50wt. :eek:ops:

i'm trying to do the 10.5 heads-up stuff plus the 4.80/5.00 head-up bracket. i think those et's are within reach someday. the hotrod is 3500lbs, dana with 4.10 gears, right now it has 10.5x31's on it but i'll have to get a true 10.5 later. the trans is a 727 with an aluminum clutch drum with 6 clutches in it and a bunch of tricks, no brake and a turbo action valve body. it's a ladder bar car with coil-overs in the four corners, rack steering with stock "k" and parts and plastic front end. i don't have any idea :dontknow: how much hp it's making yet but those supercharged motors will make a batch of them.
 
My buddy Jim made 730hp with pump gas, stock block and stock heads in a 500CI BBM.

Wolf, I sent you some pms with links to parts. Its up to you. Im saying with a good tune, 800hp is not an issue with aluminum caps, girdle and 1/2 fill. Is it the best way to go? No, but its the most economical. The upcharge to the MP block is not huge, it will be around $1500-1750 more over a worked over stock block. And you can sell/trade the girdle to help offset the cost. Im up for that.
 
I wish they still ran ORSCA 10.5 here at our track (Huntsville Dragway). I think my Demon may have been a 10.5 car. It has a back braced, coil over 8 3/4 with 4.10 on a spool. Haven't been into the axle yet. I got the car from S.C. - you ever see a hemi orange Demon racing with a big block and spray, pro mod scoop, with a black Duster stripe? - I hate that stripe! This car has Lexan windows so the weight should be pretty low.

Mike, still chewing on things. Indy alum block looks nice also. [ame]http://www.indyheads.com/images/news9.pdf[/ame]
 
no i haven't seen the hemi orang demon as i only have been to roxboro dragway up here and i only got out 6 or 8 time last year. this is my 3rd year living here so i haven't had the time to get to any other tracks yet.
 
Suffering some major suckage here today. A friend from the track with a 68 Road Runner big block has been through 3 iterations on his motor and ended up with a World block. I had sent a PM to him Monday after seeing a 440 being converted to 4 bolt caps at the local speed shop (he tried that - it also failed) on Saturday and hearing that the Father he lived with had just passed. The unanswered message said I was sorry about the Father and that I wanted to talk big blocks with him. Damn, my friend then died Monday night from the flu, or maybe a broken heart.

This was the guy I wanted so badly to race with the BB powered Demon. Major.Suckage.Here.

Some guys are talking about buying his 68 RR and parking it at the track where he was a fixture. If they do that I will try to buy the engine/727/shifter/electronics and they can park a roller.

RIP Wild Bill
165188_183488295009066_484007_n.jpg
 
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