440 Harmonic Balancer Timing Marks Off

[AJ/FormS]

Just to reiterate
The cam has a certain timing requirement, and the ignition has a certain timing requirement, and the crank has a certain timing requirement.
And they all need to be synced up to the #1, or to the #6 piston TDC.
The reason we can use either, is because both are supposed to arrive at TDC at the same time; the one on the compression stroke, and the other on the exhaust stroke.
Now, it is best to use the #1 cylinder, on account of we usually have no idea if in fact they (1 and 6)are truly doing what they were designed to do.
Like someone said; TDC is TDC. The piston TDC is not related to where the cam is installed . In fact you can take the cam right out and still find TDC.
In fact, this is how the cam is degreed-in, without the balancer. It is the first step in degreeing the cam;finding true #1 piston TDC. Then you sync the cam to that. Later you sync the balancer to true TDC.And later still you sync the ignition timing to the balancer TDC which has already been synced to true TDC.
There are two piston-stop methods of determining #1piston-TDC; the one for if the heads are off, and the other for if the heads are already installed. Since your heads are on, you use the screw-into-the-plug-hole-stop method, and that has already been explained,namely;forwards,backwards,split-the-difference, and Shazzam! there it is mark it. If that mark is not where it is supposed to be, then it will be impossible to accurately set the IGNITION timing, beginning with the 1piston at true TDC, now, that's NOW on the compression stroke .
The camshaft can become 180* out of sync anytime you turn the engine over exactly 180*. After the cam has been degreed-in, this is not an issue, because the cam is tied to the crank via the chain. You can make it out of sync from 1 to 360 or 720 degrees out of sync, simply by turning the crank.After the cam is synced and the chain is on, it does not matter where what is. At least not until the dizzy is to be installed.At that time, the cam has to be in a certain position, usually #1-TDC-compression stroke.
If it should happen that the TDC mark on the balancer, is not synced to true #1TDC, then IMO throw it away.If the ring has moved,it will move again.If it has a balance weight on it, and the weight has shifted, then it is no longer a balancer at all.
>Now just in case you screwed the piston-stop in and turned the crank up to it, and saw the 20* and stopped there, you are only at step #1 of finding TDC. Remember;Forwards,Backwards,split-the-difference, Shazzam there it is mark it.

 

[67Dart273]

.................The camshaft can become 180* out of sync anytime you turn the engine over exactly 180*. After the cam has been degreed-in, this is not an issue, because the cam is tied to the crank via the chain. You can make it out of sync from 1 to 360 or 720 degrees out of sync, simply by turning the crank.After the cam is synced and the chain is on, it does not matter where what is. ...........................

I would explain this a different way. You degree the cam with the piston at TDC. WHEN you degree the cam on the no1 lobes, this will NORMALLY put the sprocket timing marks at 12 O'clock and 12 O'clock which is normal. The sprocket marks are normally "matched" with no6 "ready to fire" (compression stroke)

Once the cam is IN TIME or DEGREED IN with no1 TDC, then there IS NO "out of sync."

It simply "is" the way it works.........One stroke, with both no1 and no6 "up" to TDC, no1 fires, and the next rotation, no6 fires. BOTH THESE happen with the balancer mark "up" at TDC (negating timing advance) AT THE TIME this is happening, on one firing (no 6) the cam sprocket marks will be matched, and at the other firing (no1) the top sprocket will be at 12 O' clock

.................If it should happen that the TDC mark on the balancer, is not synced to true #1TDC, then IMO throw it away.If the ring has moved,it will move again.If it has a balance weight on it, and the weight has shifted, then it is no longer a balancer at all.
.

This is very true except in one case: You MAY have a mismatch balancer and timing cover. I BELIEVE some of the motor home balancers used a different mark / setup. If you can verify that "all the parts" meaning the timing marker, front cover, and balancer came from the same source, and THEN it is off then yes.....garbage can the balancer

..............The above is an example of why this software sucks

 

[furyus2]

I would explain this a different way. You degree the cam with the piston at TDC. WHEN you degree the cam on the no1 lobes, this will NORMALLY put the sprocket timing marks at 12 O'clock and 12 O'clock which is normal. The sprocket marks are normally "matched" with no6 "ready to fire" (compression stroke)

Once the cam is IN TIME or DEGREED IN with no1 TDC, then there IS NO "out of sync."

It simply "is" the way it works.........One stroke, with both no1 and no6 "up" to TDC, no1 fires, and the next rotation, no6 fires. BOTH THESE happen with the balancer mark "up" at TDC (negating timing advance) AT THE TIME this is happening, on one firing (no 6) the cam sprocket marks will be matched, and at the other firing (no1) the top sprocket will be at 12 O' clock



This is very true except in one case: You MAY have a mismatch balancer and timing cover. I BELIEVE some of the motor home balancers used a different mark / setup. If you can verify that "all the parts" meaning the timing marker, front cover, and balancer came from the same source, and THEN it is off then yes.....garbage can the balancer

..............The above is an example of why this software sucks

Definitely do not throw that balancer away. If it is the mid 70s cast crank balancer, you can't just call Summit for a new one. I tried. That's why I had mine rebuilt. I have one to sell if yours turns out to be defective.