69 Valiant dyno numbers, and video

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dusterdragracer

dusterdragracer

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Here is the dyno video:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ew3qLqwqf9s&feature=share"]Chris White's Valiant on the Dyno 3/29/12 - YouTube[/ame]


441.86 H.P @ 6500 RPM
388.87 FT. # torque
That would be 565 H.P. Appox. at the flywheel.
Thanks to Performance Dyno
It would have taken all the test and tune time trials, and the car wouldn't be where it is now.Chassis dyno is the way to go

P.S. Picked up 15 H.P. since the motor was in my Daytona, just from freshening it.
:newb:
 
I wish I could watch videos on teh work PC...lol.
The chassis dyno can be a fun tool. But it's still not the real deal. So while you can find power there, a track session is still the best way to get tuning and log book data.
What does the car have for trans and rear and what figure are you using for a driveline loss there? I come out around 520hp at the flywheel but I know a lot of people use different percentages.
 
You would be my lost brother Chris....Bad *** Valiants rule! This ain't your grandfather Plymouth.
 

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just gotta love dem' Valiants!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

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Brad426 said:
Gotta love those DARTS too. Rear tire should be like a woman's breast.....large and soft....LOL
Click to expand...
BpRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR, just needed to throw in some sound effect to go with the DARTS
 
To Brad426
Your ride is bad.I didn't realize how rare Valiants are. Then I looked it up yesterday
1969 Dart 600,000 total built, mostly 2 drs because of the different body styles
1969 Valiant 75,000 only 35,000 were 2 drs.These numbers are approx.

To Moper:
489 gears, which I will be switching to 430's (car came with 4:89's). J.W. Ultra bell 'Glide w/brake. We use the 28% factor which is farily close, but things like converter etc. can make a big diff. I have engine dyno'd, then chassis dyno'd the same motor and this number seems to work. With that said if it is 520 HP or 720 HP it doesn't really matter to me, as long as it is consistant.I am a die hard drag racer, looking only for consistancy.
Which brings me to the chassis dyno. I have had this motor in 3 cars (freshened each time), it has been on the dyno 1st in each car before racing, and after hundreds of runs, and more wins then I can count in each car, I never turn a wrench or barely open the hood while at the drags.
Each time on the dyno,I also found little issues I.E. leaks, loose this, loose that, that would have been a bummer at the track.
When I changed the motor from my Duster to my ' glass S/G Daytona I added aluminum heads, and changed to the JW 'glide. 1st race I bent a pushrod in the 3rd round, second race I went 5 rounds and won . And not to brag, the car and I won it, no give me's from the other lane I.E. red lights break outs.This was our Pro Gas acc. and they are all tough guys.
I then raced all summer (never doing any thing but servicing it) then took it to Arizona with me while working there durning the winter. I also ran S/G against some killer opponents at both Firebird, and Speedworld.Firebird I lost 1st round, because I crapped the tree, Speedworld I ran S/G, against the Arizona Pro Gas Acc. only to loose to the #1 points guy in the final by a 1 ten thou break out on my part 9:89.9 on a 9:90 dial (he had a 0.20 light, I had a 0.22 light).
I would say the dyno works, at least for me. Things like finding out, 1 degree timming can kill 9 H.P.And 83 jets are too rich,79 too lean. How many trips down the track, pulling plugs, burning my fingers, and wearing out the motor to look at time slips to see which thing made it faster or better? How many to find out what makes it consistant?
When I go out the 1st time, I will be looking at the tree, and gathering those types of data along with my 60 fts, which have to do with the chassis.All the while not messing with the motor, I have full confidence in it now.
This is why I said, I would have burned up all my test and tune laps, and the car wouldn't be where it is at now.
Lastly, I actually richened it up, and lost 6 HP. I did this because it was a bit lean, and even though on some test and tune laps I would have been fooled by a faster E.T.
That would have not helped me win a race on a cold night, later in the summer, when it wouldn't run that same number again. let alone I was hurting the motor all that time.So looking at data like faster time slips to me,or messing with the motor at the track, is not the answer to tunning a car properly.
Thanks For commenting, I know everybody has their own opinion.
 
Baj - I wasn;t trying to belittle you and I'm sorry you seem to take it that way. I ran a chassis dyno shop for a time and we never used 28% for driveline loss. It never worked when compared to actual track figures and weight. The reason I bring it up is because the dyno can't simulate things like G forces on the fuel and fuel system, air through a scoop, etc. You're right, the number doesnt matter in the big picture if the car repeats and you want bracket wins. But it does if you are looking for validating your expense and keeping peak performance. I learned from record holding Stock Eliminator guys and if you race the gas class you know how they get. They did use a dyno for the engine to get tune info, power curve and overall output info, but the track and weather station provided the data for the log book. They could tell a piston was scuffed by running the car down the track and these were stick cars. I consistently tell customers a race car shouldn't need the hood raised once the weather and track is known and to concentrate on their own process in the car. So my apologies if I came off "dissing" you.
We simply disagree on the driveline loss. If I use the info about the driveline - an ultraglide and Dana (guessing on the rear) - the true loss through the drivetrain should be a much lower number. What does it weigh and what's been it's best speed? (I don't expect an answer...lol.) Have a great and safe season!
 
To Moper
Hey man, I didn't take it negative, you were very polite. I just get this all the time about the dyno, I truely believe in it, because it worked for me.So I defend it.Most people really have an issue about the cost, that really is what bugs them.I think it's cost affective myself, that's why I got so long winded about it LOL.
I can tell your well educated and well versed on the matter.I hope I didn't come off too arogant about the wins, I was just trying to make a point. The car was the biggest part of why the car won, and I feel it was because of the dyno. It also was the same factor when it was in my Duster (w/cast heads and a 727 Grinner with brake).Dyno, no hood up, lots of wins!
It's an 8 3/4 with 4:89 gears now, way to low, but we will see.I have to consider tire growth (they are 29.5") I am considering 4:30's. I think it weights about 3,000 LBS. or less.
This same engine tranny combo in my 'glass tube chassis 4 link Daytona, which was 2200LBS w/o me in it. I am 210 lbs. had 4:10 gears and ran 9:70's @ 142 MPH.
Important part is, car runs great, it has more power compaired to the past (based on my past info on the same dyno) and I am tickled!
Take care, Chris
 
Good discussion - :glasses2:

FWIW I think both approaches have their merits....I like using the chassis Dyno to get the state of tune in the ballpark - check AF and experiment with timing.

We get a limited number of runs at the local track so its difficult to start from 1st base - thats where the Chassis dyno time helps.

I also agree that you learn things quickly - like the time I discovered a 1/4 turn on a Thermoquad metering tree yielded an extra 12 RWHP!! :shock:

That said - I took my "perfect tune" to the track one night - and ended up ruunning 1.5 MPH more after going one stage richer than the Dyno tune...in similar temps!

............so there's no replacement for real world.

On losses - We have a guy who's buit a few 10 second SB mopars in my city..... he swears that a 727/4000 stall/9" combo will lose appx 120 HP from the Crank,

He reckons you can "set your watch" by it.... and he's always engine dynoed his builds...so he's been able to compare.
 
68 valiant post post car, well over 500hp
 

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To Brad426
Your ride is bad.I didn't realize how rare Valiants are. Then I looked it up yesterday
1969 Dart 600,000 total built, mostly 2 drs because of the different body styles
1969 Valiant 75,000 only 35,000 were 2 drs.These numbers are approx.
Thanks for the numbers. I did not know that. I felt bad hacking it up cause I'm a #'s guy. But, it was a slant-six-o-matic....
 
To Rat Patrol:
Here is another name, a friend has on his Cuda for a lis. plate "decon"Took me a minute to figure that one out.....Thanks for the dyno support, yes it is not real world, and one can't go around kicking their chest out bragging about their big H.P.(mines not big for sure)
Here is some info I do agree with, because it is real world. We have 2 different B.B. Dusters at our track, both switched from 727 Grinner tranny's to 'Glides so they could go into the 9's (which they were both knocking on the door at), and they both ran 3/10th's quicker by switching. I have been told by several people, a 727 takes 30 more H.P. at the flywheel to turn, then a 'glide.
With that said, I did not go with a 'glide for this reason. I had the tranny which came in my Daytona, with the JW ultra bell, and 2 converters, so it was cheaper to set the Valiant up with it, then to switch and start over.Other wise I would had went with a
727/Grinner. Because actually, I don't want to go in the 9's (been there done that) Bottom line, it would have cost about $2500.00 more to build this car to be a legal 9 sec. car.Plus the long term costs,even though I still am lis. to go 9's, and have all the clothing etc.
P.S. Where are you in OZ? Been there 4 times, have real good friends in Brisbane area.

73 dart
Your car is really nice. Valiants really grow on you.
My wife has a71 Dart 360 727 drag car.

brad426...It's just a Valiant Chryslers answer to the Rambler!!! HEE HEE
Mine was already cut up. It was a 6cyl. stick, so it still ha a pedal. If I ever street it, I plan to put a cogger in it (aussie talk for stick)
 
tuff valiants and sb ,love them mine runs 143 mph at 3550 lbs street car
 

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P.S. Where are you in OZ? Been there 4 times, have real good friends in Brisbane area.
Click to expand...

LOL! I'm about 1250 miles south from Brisbane.

There's some very tuff Mopars running in that town.....and about another 1000 miles further North as well .

Australia's "North" is like your "South"...cyclones, mosquitos and crazy Mopar men! :)

FWIW I didn't read Moper's comments as being "one vs the other"....which I think you also understand?

From my humble position owning a 12 sec car....I know how much the Dyno helped me - but I also know we race at the track.

Mines a Valiant also...like Ian's they came out under the "Chrysler" badge...no Dodge or Plymouth manufactured in Oz.
 
Nice car.What engine and tranny?
I wanted to get a Charger sent over here, but by the time I made the decision, the values had gone up, and our dollar went in the toilet.
My buddy Ray in Brisbane (Loganlea), has a 73 Cuda 440 converted to right hook. He turns 11:06 on street tires and mufflers. I got to race it at Willowbank 2/2/02.
His son has a Charger like yours. 6 cyl. hemi with a 3 sp cogger.Very original and nice.
Ray also has a Pantara (left hook) which is fun to go throught the toll plaza's!
He also has another 73 Cuda (they call it the crappy Cuda) because it is un-restored, he just brought it over.
Yes, I know about the north south thing, they call those from Melbourne "Mexicans" LOL He was raised in the table lands himself.
You must be around the Sidney area.
Ray is a mobile mechanic, has tons of friends with hottie cars. When I was there one time,a Valiant Ute came over with a B.B. in it, it was such a sleeper and bad 'A'.
We were there last year durning the floods, and barely got out of Brisbane.We did get to go to Willowbank to the New Years drags, before they rained out.
I just love Oz, my favorite is Fraized Island. We had some really great adventures camping there.
When I go to Oz, we don't tend to do the tourist thing, because Ray and Jen blend us right in with the working class people.We ride Harelys a lot too.
I will try to upload some oz pic.s of his cars if they are not too large.
You are right about bugs etc. I just think of everything as deadly, especially the red back spiders!
Ta Ta
Chris

Click here:

Me at Willowbank

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.2254870897561.2105287.1421974018&type=3&l=ead974b239


Aussie cars and drags 2011 trip

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.1520068007948.2070709.1421974018&type=3
 

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O.K. I rest my case on facts. This should get a few panties in a wad! LOL
After 3 passe's at 3,000 alttitude adjusted E.T. is:
11:17 @ 119 MPH= 468 H.P. rear wheels, 560 H.P. at the wheel.
Now, I will say I was running 489 gears, and could barely make it to the finish line. My engine is out of wind at 6300 RPM'S and I was crossing at 7200.We will see next week, as I broke the 489 rear end on the 4th pass. (I wicked it up to 5000 RPM's and 9 psi tire pressure.I am changing to 4.30 gears and a 742 case. More to follow. It would appear that my friends chassis dyno, is a little stinggy on the H.P.It said 437.

P.S. At Seattle, this would be 10:77...Fact as whenever we go to Seattle, we run 04.00 faster.

http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...09983734910.2121378.1421974018&type=3&theater


http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...09983734910.2121378.1421974018&type=3&theater
 
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