727 no reverse

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WARLOCKII

WARLOCKII

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We are finally are at a point where we can drive the car around the block. We started it, checked the fluids, put it in reverse and nothing. It does go into drive and the car will move. We put it on jack stands and in reverse the wheels didn't move, they turn in drive but the trans seemed to only shift one time. We dropped the pan to check the low/reverse band adjustment and the actuator piece between the arm and the band had fallen out. I reinstalled thebar and adjusted the band according to a motor manual (72 in/lbs, back off 2 turns and tighten jam nut. Put everything back together and checked again, now the tires turn and still have drive. Put the car on the ground and still know reverse(It sounds like there is an rpm drop but it also feels like its fighting itself to try and move).I bought a rebuild kit and a "trans guy" who is now the invisible man put it together. I would like to try and fix it myself. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The trans is a 727 out of a 69 B-body, it's going into a 72 Swinger with a 383. :banghead:
 
is it a floor shift car?? i was going to say check the lowe reverse band but sounds like youh ave that covered... they only other think i can really think of and i am no pro. but maybe if you have a floor shifter in it or any type of shifter really the cable is not adjusted right and it might not be going fully into reverse? idunno just a thought
 
WARLOCKII said:
We are finally are at a point where we can drive the car around the block. We started it, checked the fluids, put it in reverse and nothing. It does go into drive and the car will move. We put it on jack stands and in reverse the wheels didn't move, they turn in drive but the trans seemed to only shift one time. We dropped the pan to check the low/reverse band adjustment and the actuator piece between the arm and the band had fallen out. I reinstalled thebar and adjusted the band according to a motor manual (72 in/lbs, back off 2 turns and tighten jam nut. Put everything back together and checked again, now the tires turn and still have drive. Put the car on the ground and still know reverse(It sounds like there is an rpm drop but it also feels like its fighting itself to try and move).I bought a rebuild kit and a "trans guy" who is now the invisible man put it together. I would like to try and fix it myself. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The trans is a 727 out of a 69 B-body, it's going into a 72 Swinger with a 383. :banghead:
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If it is only shifting once sounds like you don't have 3rd gear also. The front clutch pack is not engaging if that is the case.

The front clutch pack only engages in "R" and "3rd Gear"
 
B&M floor shifter with a Lokar cable, we have adjusted it twice but I,ll check again. Could the forward band be out of adjustment and cause this problem?
 
that i personaly dont know..i have only built 1 727 and it has worked flawlessly for about 2 years the only problem i ever had was cable adjusment when i installed my shifter... that beiing said if your shifter is fine and you have checked and rechecked your band adjustments then unfortuantly it sounds like an internal issue i know when i built my trans i tested all the clutch packs with shop air at the valve body to make sure they where engageing
 
You may have a Valve Body Problem too. Did somebody put a shift kit in it? Those directions need to be followed to the letter or you will have issues.
 
WARLOCKII said:
We are finally are at a point where we can drive the car around the block. We started it, checked the fluids, put it in reverse and nothing. It does go into drive and the car will move. We put it on jack stands and in reverse the wheels didn't move, they turn in drive but the trans seemed to only shift one time. We dropped the pan to check the low/reverse band adjustment and the actuator piece between the arm and the band had fallen out. I reinstalled thebar and adjusted the band according to a motor manual (72 in/lbs, back off 2 turns and tighten jam nut. Put everything back together and checked again, now the tires turn and still have drive. Put the car on the ground and still know reverse(It sounds like there is an rpm drop but it also feels like its fighting itself to try and move).I bought a rebuild kit and a "trans guy" who is now the invisible man put it together. I would like to try and fix it myself. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated. The trans is a 727 out of a 69 B-body, it's going into a 72 Swinger with a 383. :banghead:
Click to expand...

If you're going to try to rebuild this trans by yourself, make sure you get a manual for it. You want to get the ATSG manual. The company that you bought your kit from should be able to get you the manual, if not, check with W.I.T. They supply transmission parts to shops, and do sell to individuals. Don't attempt to do the rebuild without the manual. It's sad that you've joined a group of car buffs that have had their transmission rebuilt by "trans guys" who for the most part don't have a clue on the hydraulics and how a transmission works. Most of these "trans guys" I found when I worked in the industry were clueless and when trouble happened disappeared as you have sadly found out. I wish you the best of luck.
 
The very first thing I would chk would be the reverse servo and lip seals.
If the strut fell out then the servo had to do something abnormal.

The rest, if I had to take a guess would be cut or broken stator rings.
(Slight posibility of a loose valve body)

You may want to pull the cable linkage loose from the trans to be sure that it is actually going all the way into the selected position too.

If it is verified that it does not have reverse or third, it coming back out.
 
Thanks for all of the help,I'm going to bite the bullet, buy a manual and pull the trans out. I'm tired of laying on my back trying to figure it out. Thanks again.
 
My buddy had the same problem.........he removed the tranny pan and a hole was plugged up with crap in some part of the tranny body where the tranny fluid would flow thru. He drilled thru the crap in the hole and out came clean tranny fluid.........this was why he didn't have reverse gear........drop the pan and have a look to see if any holes are plugged up anywhere fluid would flow thru..........hope this might help you out.
 
Also check the reverse servo piston(I think that's what it's called) Mine split in half and I had to have a billet one installed.
 
dart1 said:
My buddy had the same problem.........he removed the tranny pan and a hole was plugged up with crap in some part of the tranny body where the tranny fluid would flow thru. He drilled thru the crap in the hole and out came clean tranny fluid.........this was why he didn't have reverse gear........drop the pan and have a look to see if any holes are plugged up anywhere fluid would flow thru..........hope this might help you out.
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You would have to pull the valve body to find anything like that.
BUT, pulling the valve body to air chk the clutch packs and servos wouldn't be a bad idea.

furyus2 said:
Also check the reverse servo piston(I think that's what it's called) Mine split in half and I had to have a billet one installed.
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Good idea!!!
 
TrailBeast said:
pulling the valve body to air chk the clutch packs and servos wouldn't be a bad idea.
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That's exactly what I'd do. It's possible it's just a valve body problem that would not require yanking the trans. An air pressure test would also tell for sure if it is a front clutch pack/reaction shaft sealing ring issue so you'd know right where to look for the problem instead of just yanking everything apart looking blindly for the problem. I believe the ATSG manual Transman mentioned earlier shows how to do air pressure tests. If it doesn't I can post pics and a description of what needs done.
 
This is a 904 air test. The 727 Air Test is exactly the same. The Air Pressure should be regulated to 25-30 PSI when performing this test per the books instructions.

[ame="http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jvzSpMuCvgM"]904 Torqueflite Air Check - YouTube[/ame]


View attachment phpGKbyBUAM.jpg
 
fishy68 said:
Good vid Louis. A visual explains things better than trying to write it out.
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Yeah sometimes the guys doing the Videos get excited and move along too fast for me......that or I am getting old, Lol
Good thing they have pause and rewind or I would not know what to do with myself.
 
I have a repair manual on the way and as soon as the SNOW melts and the weather warms back up (I don't have a heated garage) I'm going to drop the pan and start making some checks. Everyone is right, I don't want to pull the trans unless I have to. If there is a problem will the low/reverse servo piston can it be changed/repaired in the car?
 
WARLOCKII said:
I have a repair manual on the way and as soon as the SNOW melts and the weather warms back up (I don't have a heated garage) I'm going to drop the pan and start making some checks. Everyone is right, I don't want to pull the trans unless I have to. If there is a problem will the low/reverse servo piston can it be changed/repaired in the car?
Click to expand...

You can download an awful lot of stuff for nothing

72 shop manual

[ame="http://www.abodyjoe.com/pictures/Misc.%20car%20info/1972%20Plymouth%20Chassis%20Serv%20Man.pdf"]http://www.abodyjoe.com/pictures/Misc.%20car%20info/1972%20Plymouth%20Chassis%20Serv%20Man.pdf[/ame]

70 shop manual

http://www.mymopar.com/downloads/servicemanuals/1970_Plymouth_Service_Manual.zip

Trans service manual and other info:

http://www.mymopar.com/index.php?pid=22
 
I dropped the pan and the actuator piece had fallen out again. The servo piston is cracked, would this cause the actuator to fall out? Where is the best place to find a new piston, none of the local parts houses have it. What is the correct way for the actuator to go in since its rectangular?
 
WARLOCKII said:
I dropped the pan and the actuator piece had fallen out again. The servo piston is cracked, would this cause the actuator to fall out? Where is the best place to find a new piston, none of the local parts houses have it. What is the correct way for the actuator to go in since its rectangular?
Click to expand...

Yeah it probably had a bunch of slop in it with the cracked piston so it let the strut fall out. If I remember right the strut will only fit one direction. The sonnax piston MadDart posted the link to works good or if you want a super duty piston contact Mr. RandyJ over on Moparts. He makes a 1 piece billet servo that is about indestructible. Cost about $75 if I remember right. Pricey but a fantastic piece.
 
Well I finally had time to work on the car again. I installed a new low/reverse piston, removed, checked and reinstalled the kick down piston. Adjusted the bands, disassembled, cleaned and reinstalled the valve body. Put the pan on, filled it full of fluid. Started the car and I now have REVERSE. YEA. I drove the car up the street and have firm 1-2 shift but not sure about the 2-3 yet. The police didn't like me driving with open headers and no plates on the car. I'll check it again when I get the exhaust on. I want to say thanks to everyone who helped with suggestions, pictures and videos. It's nice to have a site like FABO to turn to when you need help. :blob:
 
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