wayneswirld2
I need a vacation...
Thinking of maybe installing a turbo, anyone make an aftermarket manifold?
Wayne
Austin, TX
Wayne
Austin, TX
Aftermarket turbo exhaust manifold?
- Thread starter wayneswirld2
- Start date
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grumpuscreature
Resident Curmudgeon
www.aussiespeed.com.au has a kit for an Eaton supercharger if you want to go that route. Turbo exhaust manifolds/headers are pretty much a roll your own deal.
my68barracuda
Well-Known Member
contact these guys
they had a slant turbo header in the works at one time
http://www.stormcomm.net/moparsnmore/
they had a slant turbo header in the works at one time
http://www.stormcomm.net/moparsnmore/
When we were looking for a turbo /6 header,we found ONE, in Australia for $1,200.00.Thinking that was too pricey, we built one.... ended up spending $1,000.00 on it and WE did all the work!
My advice? Take a late-model /6, cast iron exhaust manifold and attach a turbo mounting flange to the bottom of it and forget the tubing header. Take the thousand dollars you'll save and buy some really good Wiseco forged pistons and a set of forged K-1 rods. They have matched sets of rods/pistons for this application..065" over.
The late model exhaust manifolds have more strengthening ribs cast into them as insurance against cracking, I am told.
slantsixdan
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Bill, that sounds like good advice (put a turbo flange on a stock type exhaust manifold). Or maybe put a turbo flange on each half of Dutra Duals. But I gotta know, where's the Aussie turbo header from? These pics, are they the Aussie header or your own? If they're your own, I'm completely impressed; that's some terrific craftsmanship. Looks like an O2S port at the turbo flange...but what's the 2-bolt flange connection facing the sky for? Intake heat...?
Thanks for the kind words!!!!
I'll have to do a search to find the website that offered the Aussie turbo headers; can't remember,now.... but they had pictures.
The pictures in my last note are of the header that my racing partner (Freddie Nielsen) constructed BY HIMSELF,this summer, at age 72, after never having built a header in his life. That is the only one. Maybe he missed his calling,huh? NINE people have I-M'd me wanting a copy of that header,but Freddie says "never again"... He has a pacemaker and a defibrilator in his chest and cannot weld, (R F) so, he had to use adhesive tape to tape the pieces together 'til we could get a friend who CAN weld, to stop by and spot weld them togewther, so we could take them toa weld shop and get them T.I.G-welded. We probably could have gotten them M.I.G-welded, 'cause they're just mild steel, but we thought T.I.G. looked a little better. Then, we took them to a shop that does ceramic coating and had them done in a chrome-looking finish.
I think ol' Freddie did himself proud (I never touched them) for a first-ever effort. I wish I could take credit for them, but he did it all...
The vertical standpipe you asked about is there to mount an external wastegate to control boost levels. The hole we put in the collector, next to the wastegate standpipe, is for a F.A.S.T. oxygen sensor probe bung, and in my ignorance, was located in the WRONG place! It needs to be on the other side (downstream) of the turbo. It will overheat in the present location and come apart, and end up in the turbo blades.... DUH! We'll plug that hole and reattach the probe bung in the downpipe, downstream from the turbo. Beginner's luck.... Never built a turbo ANYTHING before,much less a /6...
Here are some more pix of that header... and one of the '64 Valiant 4-door that engine and 904 is going into.
Thanks for your interest, Dan!
slantsixdan
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Wow, that's dedication. Not sure I agree/understand why the O2S placement is no good. What makes you think it'll overheat in its present location? If you do stumble on that Australian site, gimme a shout, willya?
I read a lot, and after these headers were built (timing is everything in a deal like this...) I discovered that everyone that WAS anyone, was recommending that the O2 sensor be located in the post-turbo (downpipe) section of the exhaust system. I got to asking around, and experienced, knowledgable, people like Gerry, at the G-Pop (turbo) Shop told me of the possibility that excessive exhaust gas temperatures could damage the sensor and it could become a two (or, more) piece missile, destroying the vanes of the turbo in the process.... Who am I to argue with folks like that???? I am 72 years old, and have been hot rodding since I was 15, but I have never had experience with turbos, and their various appurtenances.... I am an old man, but still, a turbo neophyte!
I will try to find that Aussie header for you, now...
Well, the only turbo /6 subject in my "Favorites" was a website/business called "PentaStar Parts and Restorations," in Australia, but they are not listing that header, so I'm not positive that that was the placeI found that one (for $1,200.00).
Sorry; I'll keep looking (I'm not making this up...)
Just asking but with the location of the turbo it doesnt look like it will fit before the front of the radiator, or am I confused on the distance.The reason I ask is I have built many custom headers and I want to build one for this application.thanks ben
slantsixdan
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Well, I certainly wouldn't argue with expert consensus. Seems a little odd to me; O2 sensors are routinely subjected to much greater heat than it seems likely you'd have at that location with that engine, but I wouldn't want to be the one paying to clean up the results of being wrong on that point.
I share that concern about where the turbo's gonna wind up in that '64 Valiant.
I share that concern about where the turbo's gonna wind up in that '64 Valiant.
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
Are you going to purge the waste gate in the engine bay or have it plumbed out of it?(Since it's on the exaust side) I've only seen them on boost side not the exaust is why i ask?
What we (actually, Freddie) did, was to re-install the 170 motor, on its original mounts, with the head sitting on a 7/8"-tall, wooden spacer (on top of the block), back into the car, as a "mock-up" for the header build, since clearances were tight, some places. I'm afraid the camera angle is distorting the relationships in the picture,because we worked on turbo placement to ensure that we had sufficient room for the turbo and all the plumbing before we settled on a final configuration. I'll admit, it LOOKS like the turbo is too far forward,but trust me; it's not. It's about 4" behind the radiator support.
I'll have more (and,better) pictures, later....
I think they call that "The Parallax View" in photography.
To answer your queston, first, yes, we'll run a pipe down beside the engine for the waste gate exhaust.
One thing.... Waste gates are ALWAYS on the exhaust side. The plumbing on these things can get a little complicated.
I think what you're referrring to, is a blow-off valve, OR a boost controller that works on the intake side. Both of them are plumbed into the intake system, on its way to the carb or injector throttle body.
There are boost controllers that have a butterfly in the intake system, that closes, or partially closes when the maximum set boost level is approached. The old ACCEL units used these, but I haven't seen one since. Nobody seemed to think that they worked particularlly well.
Additionally, "blowoff valves" are on a lot of setups to protect the turbo (or centrufugal supercharger) from the buildup of boost that occurs when the turbine is spinning really fast, and the throttle snaps closed,as in a burnout. It opens and lets the built-up boost escape to the atmosphere. I have heard of that "boost air" with nowhere to go, being routed to the intake side of the compressor, too.
But, wastegates are always a function of the exhaust system, as far as I know. They are boost-controllers, and open to deprive the turbine of excessive exhaust flow that could over-boost the engine.
Hope this helps (and, I hope it's RIGHT.) This is the first "turbo" car I have ever built.
I am FAR from an expert....
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
Thanks for the clerafication, I'm working with a centrifigal so it's all boost side stuff for me right now. Sorry to clutter up the thread.
My "other car" is a '72 Valiant with a 360 Magnum that I installed a ebay, Vortech V-1, S-trim, centrifugal on. Picked it up from a 13.35 @ 103 to an 11.50 @ 116. Made a different car out of it. :cheers:
I can only imagine what it would do for a /6!!!
Tell us about your car, please.
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
It is a 225 bored 30 over, Erson 270 465 lift, Arias forged high comp pistons( Piston deck hieght is .130 taller than a stock piston.) With my uncut head it will be 9.5-1 comp blowing 8 psi. If it holds together well may go to my big valve head that will put my compression at 10-1.
I have some tunning ahead of me but thats the fun part!! I'll put up a post for it when i get some pics just lost my old phone's contents and it had alot of my photo's on it.
TF
I have some tunning ahead of me but thats the fun part!! I'll put up a post for it when i get some pics just lost my old phone's contents and it had alot of my photo's on it.
TF
That sounds like a plan, but two things caught my attention...:read2:
Supercharged engines, as a rule, don't much like long-duration cams... most turbo cams have duration numbers in the 220-degree range @ .050," and I doubt that supercharged engines are much different.
You might want to look at that issue, if you haven't thought about it....
The compression ratios are another thing that deserves attention. Personally (and, I am certainally not any kind of an expert,) I don't think that anything over 9:1 works very well in view of the quality of the mouse milk they call gasoline, these days....
What kind of a blower it that you're going to use? Seems to me that 8 pounds of boost would probably to be very workable in the setting you describe.
Please keep us informed on your progress! That's going to be an interesting car!!! :cheers:
6pakattack
Well-Known Member
Well I'd LOVE to take credit for them, but my partner in this mess, Freddie Nielsen did ALL the work... all of it. All I did was order the U-bends, flanges and collectors. It was his first effort; he says there won't be a 2nd.... He, (like I) is 72.... ALMOST too old for this s**t...
Thanks for the kind words....
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
Hey Bill,
The blower is a coolcharger unit off a chevy tahoe, got it for free. If it boost to ten i think i would be lucky, why i plan for eight. The cam is a piece i picked up for cheap and is what i have to use for now, other than a stock cam. The slants like the duration and with alittle boost i don't see it being to detrimental.
I plan to run high test with the engine at 9.5-1 , i have a chassis dyno in town for true tunning. If no problems there i will jump to 10-1 and a meth injection set up to stay in the pump gas.
It's a new direction for me as well and i know nothing, but experiance is the best knowledge in my mind so ahead i trudge!
TF
The blower is a coolcharger unit off a chevy tahoe, got it for free. If it boost to ten i think i would be lucky, why i plan for eight. The cam is a piece i picked up for cheap and is what i have to use for now, other than a stock cam. The slants like the duration and with alittle boost i don't see it being to detrimental.
I plan to run high test with the engine at 9.5-1 , i have a chassis dyno in town for true tunning. If no problems there i will jump to 10-1 and a meth injection set up to stay in the pump gas.
It's a new direction for me as well and i know nothing, but experiance is the best knowledge in my mind so ahead i trudge!
TF
I don't know what that blower is. Is it an aftermarket unit? I assume it is since the G.M cars and trucks I have seen with forced induction all have positive displacement blowers.
Fill me in....
And thanks for the information!
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
Yup after market. I think they went out of buisness so no parts to fix it! I found the front bearing for 6 Bucks!!! Now the belt may be a differant story... still going to go for it!!! I don't think i'm putting to much stress on it!
TF
TF
wicked/six
Well-Known Member
Some pic's on the bench...
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