Axel seal help for my 62 Dodge Lancer

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Bill Boz

Bill Boz

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I believe that the left rear seal is leaking and getting oil on my brake shoes. I don’t believe that there is any problem with the bearings. I’ve been looking on line and can’t find the rear seals. Looking at the exploded diagram in the manual it shows only one seal at the outside end of the housing, when I look on line for parts they show inner and outer seals. I don’t believe that this car has posi traction. Any parts numbers or sources for these seals would be much appreciated.
1962 Dodge Lancer, automatic, 225 slant 6
Thanks, Bill
 
inertia said:
1962 DODGE LANCER 2.8L 170cid L6 Wheel Seal | RockAuto
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Thank you, I looked a rock auto, must have been looking in the wrong place. Also my confusion, I see a listings for rear inner and rear outer seals, on the exploded diagram in the repair manual they only show one seal. In order; the bearing retainer, bearing, collar and seal. Is there some kind of seal in the retainer?
Thanks, Bill
 
That may also have tapered axle shafts with separate rear hubs, note if it has a big nut on the end of the axle shaft after you remove the wheel.
 
bcschief said:
That may also have tapered axle shafts with separate rear hubs, note if it has a big nut on the end of the axle shaft after you remove the wheel.
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I agree, the puller is necessary to get drum off.i bought a snap on one, wasnt horrible expensive but made the job a snap. The big nut is supposed to be 40 foot lbs or something. Lots of people think it holds the entire car together and get carried away. Buddy did it after i told him to be careful tightening it. I have to cut it off.
 
Tooljunkie said:
I agree, the puller is necessary to get drum off.i bought a snap on one, wasnt horrible expensive but made the job a snap. The big nut is supposed to be 40 foot lbs or something. Lots of people think it holds the entire car together and get carried away. Buddy did it after i told him to be careful tightening it. I have to cut it off.
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The axle has a flange, not tapered ends, the drum is held in place by the lug nuts.
So I guess I better plan to get inner and outer seals and new bearings. It looks like the only way to get at the outer seal is to press off the bearings. Does this sound right?

to further confuse the issue, the rear axle bearings listed on Rock Auto are cone bearings with separate races, the bearing shown in the repair manual appears to be a roller bearing, one piece that is housed in a recess at the end of the axle housing. I was hoping to have the parts in hand before I pulled it apart but I guess that was wishful thinking
Thanks, Bill
 
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I am not sure that the 62 and back As had a removable flange axle or not but I am sure someone will chime in and let us know.
 
bcschief said:
I am not sure that the 62 and back As had a removable flange axle or not but I am sure someone will chime in and let us know.
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62 saratoga has. I know this for sure. If its not a tapered axle, likely not original.
 
Bill Boz said:
So I guess I better plan to get inner and outer seals and new bearings. It looks like the only way to get at the outer seal is to press off the bearings. Does this sound right?
Thanks, Bill
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Yep, but before you get carried away. "Oil" on brake pads... is it hypoid oil (that of course stinks like hell) or bearing grease?.. or brake fluid. The inner axle seal keeps the oil in the housing, the outer seal keeps any bearing grease from getting out into the brake system and a leaking wheel cylinder is self explanatory...

Outer axle seal can still be good and if it's hypoid leaking it generally gets past the inner seal and then leaks out between the backing plate and the retainer flange.
 
dadsbee said:
Yep, but before you get carried away. "Oil" on brake pads... is it hypoid oil (that of course stinks like hell) or bearing grease?.. or brake fluid. The inner axle seal keeps the oil in the housing, the outer seal keeps any bearing grease from getting out into the brake system and a leaking wheel cylinder is self explanatory...
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Spray water on it, if it foams, brake fluid. If it beads up, gear oil.
 
The break shoes were a mess and I was hoping that it was leaking break fluid, so I cleaned everything thoroughly, replaced the shoes and wheel cylinders. I’ve only driven the car about 50 miles since and it looks like it’s starting to get some thick grease like substance back into the break drum, that’s why I thought it was the axle seal.
Bill
 
Well figure out which fluid is leaking and from were before proceeding. Could even just be bearing grease leaking out between backing plate and axle retainer flange. Then all you may need is to clean and repack the bearing and new backing plate gaskets. You can't mistake gear oil vs grease.
 
I have a suspicion that it is grease, can I change the backing plate gasket without pulling the axle?
 
NO...
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Thanks, those pictures are a great help, looks just like what is shown, in the manual, although their illustrations are pretty bad. I’ll have to look for those gaskets or make some. if I pull the axle, I might as well change the seal, repack the bearing and change the gasket. Thanks for your help.
Bill
 
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Like I said, just see where the grease or oil is leaking from. If out the retainer/backing plate gasket than yes. If it's coming out the outer seal, which is usually unlikely, you'll have to toast the bearings off and replace to do that retainer plate "outer" seal.
 
I’ll pull it apart again tomorrow and see if I can tell. Is the bearing in your picture a separate race and cone bearing, I assume their held together by the collar.
 
Yes proper Timken cone and cup, retained by the collar... the way Momma Chrysler intended. You have to destroy them in order to change a retainer plate "outer" axle seal unfortunately.
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I’m finding the bearings and seals but not the collar, doesn’t seem to be listed anywhere. Also in pictures 2 and 3 it looks like you’re removing the bearing in pieces with an a cutoff wheel, in the next picture pressing the bearing off, are these two methods, what works best?
 
Bill Boz said:
I’m finding the bearings and seals but not the collar, doesn’t seem to be listed anywhere. Also in pictures 2 and 3 it looks like you’re removing the bearing in pieces with an a cutoff wheel, in the next picture pressing the bearing off, are these two methods, what works best?
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Just following the FSM as you can't get a puller or plates behind the bearing, due to clearance, until you take some rollers out of the cone. Collar has to come off first, drill a partial depth hole in it first before the chisel and it makes it easier to split. Hopefully you don't need to do any of this, as I suspect your leakage is out the retainer to backing plate seal. New inner housing seal and new backing plate seals (metal one is housing to backing, foam backing to retainer) and then back together after a bearing clean and grease.
 
I looked at it pretty closely today, although it doesn’t smell bad, what’s coming out seems to be gear oil, I don’t see any evidence of a gasket under the retainer, and it looks like most of the oil is coming from there. The other end of the axle is dry, and it looks like they used permatex blue there. As you suggested I think I’ll pull the axle, clean things up, grease the bearing, replace the inner seal and gaskets. I’ll see if that solves the problem, if not I can pull it back apart and do major surgery.
Thanks for the excellent advice and detailed explanations, forums like this are fantastic, you all can’t imagine how much I appreciate your interest and help.
Thanks
Bill
 
I don't recommend pressing a tapered roller wheel bearing off by the outer race. Most of the time, this will explode the bearing. I cut the outer race off with a torch, then clamp a bearing splitter to the exposed lip of the inner race.
 
All those pictures i'm seeing are for a 8 3/4 rear. A 1962 lancer would have a 7 1/4 from the factory. The 7 1/4 rear did not use a tapered roller bearing with a inner and outer seal. The 7 1/4 rear used a sealed bearing, on the axle, with a seal that pressed into the axle housing. There is no seal in the bearing retainer. If I remember correctly there were either two or three different size axle bearing used on the 7 1/4, depending on year. This might also make a difference in the seal. After all these years, who knows what year rear is in the car. Best to pull a azle and measure the bearing and seal.
 
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