Best Trans for Swap

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Dragnut

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So I have decided to go with a 5.9 Mag engine for the 66 Dart...also running an 8.8 Ford rear. I would like to run a 373 gear in that rear, Sooooo my question is what is the best way to go on the trans?, I need a trans with an overdrive unit and I don't have a lot of experience with the newer units out there.
 
C-6 all the way. I prefer a miss match of subpar parts I find they make the best performance.

Jake
 
So I have decided to go with a 5.9 Mag engine for the 66 Dart...also running an 8.8 Ford rear. I would like to run a 373 gear in that rear, Sooooo my question is what is the best way to go on the trans?, I need a trans with an overdrive unit and I don't have a lot of experience with the newer units out there.

Well then you only have four viable choices;1) the Mopar specific A500/A518
2) the GM 4speed, 3)the GVOD, and 4) no overdrive at all. The first three will require a lot of surgery to make fit, and perhaps a bit more effort to make work.
#4) just requires a rethink on the engine combo. I well thought out 5.9 in a streeter,should not need 3.73s in an early A, with an automatic. Change the engine build spec and run 3.55s, or even 3.23s.
Check this;
3.73s with the standard 2.45 low is a starter gear of 9.14.. And 9.14 divided by the 2.74low, A999 ratio, is 3.335.. Bottom line is the engine would not know the difference.

If you are worried about performance, spend your overdrive money, on getting the cylinder pressure up near 200psi, and you will spin any street-tires you can fit into the stock tubs, up to 60 mph.
190psi will take small closed-chamber aluminum heads,hi-compression pistons and, and a torquey fast rate cam. In a a Magnum, I highly recommend a Solid lifter, short to medium period, narrow LSA cam, and a matching TC. This will make a very fun streeter. Maybe not fast in the quarter. Maybe not quick. But can't-stop-grinning first gear blasts to 50/55, absolutely yes.That engine, on the street, will not care about rear gears. Well as long as 2.94s or better
 
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So I have decided to go with a 5.9 Mag engine for the 66 Dart...also running an 8.8 Ford rear. I would like to run a 373 gear in that rear, Sooooo my question is what is the best way to go on the trans?, I need a trans with an overdrive unit and I don't have a lot of experience with the newer units out there.

If your budget allows, the GM 2004R with the mopar adapter bell housing is one that requires the least amount of surgery. (one of the smallest OD transmissions)
It does however pretty much require beefing the trans up to live behind a 5.9.

Next best choice in my opinion would be the A500 out of a 95 and down Dakota.
This one is a direct bolt up to a 5.9
It small enough around to not need a lot of floor cutting and handles the 5.9 pretty good without major mods.
I have this one in my Dart with a mild 5.9, but was able to do all of it myself.
Cost me about 300 including the trans, converter, large U joint yoke, and a stage 2 Transgo shift kit.

Then if you have a lot more money than time and ability, you can go with a Gear venders OD.
It is a bolt on add on for a 904, but whew is it pricey.
You also have to shorten the driveline, but you will with any of the other choices also.
 
Well then you only have four viable choices;1) the Mopar specific A500/A518
2) the GM 4speed, 3)the GVOD, and 4) no overdrive at all. The first three will require a lot of surgery to make fit, and perhaps a bit more effort to make work.
#4) just requires a rethink on the engine combo. I well thought out 5.9 in a streeter,should not need 3.73s in an early A, with an automatic. Change the engine build spec and run 3.55s, or even 3.23s.
Check this;
3.73s with the standard 2.45 low is a starter gear of 9.14.. And 9.14 divided by the 2.74low, A999 ratio, is 3.335.. Bottom line is the engine would not know the difference.
@ 65 mph I want to be at or under 2000 rpms but still have a good light to light performance ... hence the 3.73s maybe the 46H trans would be the best for me...
 
If your budget allows, the GM 2004R with the mopar adapter bell housing is one that requires the least amount of surgery. (one of the smallest OD transmissions)
It does however pretty much require beefing the trans up to live behind a 5.9.

Next best choice in my opinion would be the A500 out of a 95 and down Dakota.
This one is a direct bolt up to a 5.9
It small enough around to not need a lot of floor cutting and handles the 5.9 pretty good without major mods.
I have this one in my Dart with a mild 5.9, but was able to do all of it myself.
Cost me about 300 including the trans, converter, large U joint yoke, and a stage 2 Transgo shift kit.

Then if you have a lot more money than time and ability, you can go with a Gear venders OD.
It is a bolt on add on for a 904, but whew is it pricey.
You also have to shorten the driveline, but you will with any of the other choices also.
Thanks for the info... yes I did look at the GV product but the is really pricey and what if you need parts down the road...The A500 might be my best shot..
 
What tires?
In stock tubs?

You cannot get down to 2000 with 3.73s and 25.5s with any known overdrive. This would require a .625overdrive. I don't know of any.
 
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For me, "if and when" it boils down to an A-500 (904 based OD). Seems to require the "least" surgery while not being as expensive as a 200R4. It DOES require extensive crossmember rework, there are at least a couple of threads on here with great photos.

The little GM seems to be nearly impossible to find at least around here
 
For me, "if and when" it boils down to an A-500 (904 based OD). Seems to require the "least" surgery while not being as expensive as a 200R4. It DOES require extensive crossmember rework, there are at least a couple of threads on here with great photos.

The little GM seems to be nearly impossible to find at least around here
Thanks for the info....
 
26.6s will get you 65~3065@zero-slip with 3.73s
the A500 would bring that down to 2110,still zero-slip.(loc-up).
This gets you a final-drive ratio of; 3.73 x .69~2.57.
The starter-gear would be 3.73x2.74~10.22. It would not take much engine to make this a tire-fryer, in an Early-A. The hard part will be limiting the cam-selection to actually take advantage of the 2110 cruise rpm.
35mph will be about 4750 so it won't take much more than the stock cam to make her a potent stop-lite bruiser.And that is a good thing, cuz the 2110 cruise rpm also wants the stock cam, to be fuel efficient.
At the factory 9.2Scr this would be a fairly nice combo for your stated useage. The only improvement I could imagine, would be slightly bigger .050, solid lifter cam, with similar-to-stock advertised specs, with a tighter LSA, paired with headers; for the One-Gear blasts to 40 mph/5500rpm. Second will get you 72/5500.
Yur gonna need to fix your traction issues first tho.
____________________________________
FYI
I think I would run that A500 with 4.30s for a 2-gear blast to 60/65 and cruise at 65=2440 in lock-up. This would allow a bit more cam and a bit more cylinder pressure, which would require a bit more tire and a bit more finessing off the line. 4.30s would get you 65=5700rpm in second so a 5400 peak power, so about a 225/230@050 cam. It will like those 4.30s alot. But..... you might as well leave the 2bbl on her cuz you won't hardly get to use the secondaries .... for all the tirespin on the primaries,lol. I ran this combo with a totally stock Lo-compression LA318 long block, with nothing more than headers and a big ThermoQuad,in my 3650 pound 68 Barracuda, and it was a flippinUge blast. But first gear was a bit short lol, with the stock cam. 295/50-15s gave up right away with a 2800TC, even with the SureGrip.I revved that teener to 5500 regularly.
I only ran it that way for a few weeks, cuz that 318 was my winter engine.It usually ran less than 3.23s; as low a 2.73s. And usually studded winter tires once the snow came,usually in December, to March/April. The Barracuda was not a very good winter car, but it's all I had. Mostly it was front-heavy.If the front decided not to roll, I wasn't going anywhere.
 
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How does the 46RH compare to the A500 ?

A500 is 904 based, 46 series is 727 based. It is said you have to chop up the rear floor area some to allow clearance for the 46, and can get away with "not" on the A500 (42/44Rx) You probably know that rh means hydraulic, and needs no computer, but I've been told that you can convert an re (electronic) to an all-manual valve body.
 
A500 is 904 based, 46 series is 727 based. It is said you have to chop up the rear floor area some to allow clearance for the 46, and can get away with "not" on the A500 (42/44Rx) You probably know that rh means hydraulic, and needs no computer, but I've been told that you can convert an re (electronic) to an all-manual valve body.
Got it... thank you for all the info..
 
Press the click to expand to see all of my replies.
Well then you only have four viable choices;
1) the Mopar specific A500/A518
A-500 is the 904 based OD trans and requires the least cutting/modification.
The 518 is 727 based and big requiring some good work.

2) the GM 4speed,
A little pricey with the adapter plate

3)the GVOD,
Very pricey
and 4) no overdrive at all.
So not helpful
And below is so not helpful. Here, rethinking the combo is dumb and IMO states your dumb.

The first three will require a lot of surgery to make fit, and perhaps a bit more effort to make work.
#4) just requires a rethink on the engine combo. I well thought out 5.9 in a streeter,should not need 3.73s in an early A, with an automatic. Change the engine build spec and run 3.55s, or even 3.23s.
Check this;
3.73s with the standard 2.45 low is a starter gear of 9.14.. And 9.14 divided by the 2.74low, A999 ratio, is 3.335.. Bottom line is the engine would not know the difference.



If you are worried about performance, spend your overdrive money, on getting the cylinder pressure up near 200psi, and you will spin any street-tires you can fit into the stock tubs, up to 60 mph.
190psi will take small closed-chamber aluminum heads,hi-compression pistons and, and a torquey fast rate cam. In a a Magnum, I highly recommend a Solid lifter, short to medium period, narrow LSA cam, and a matching TC. This will make a very fun streeter. Maybe not fast in the quarter. Maybe not quick. But can't-stop-grinning first gear blasts to 50/55, absolutely yes.That engine, on the street, will not care about rear gears. Well as long as 2.94s or better
One day AJ will realize something .....
 
26.6s will get you 65~3065@zero-slip with 3.73s
the A500 would bring that down to 2110,still zero-slip.(loc-up).
This gets you a final-drive ratio of; 3.73 x .69~2.57.
The starter-gear would be 3.73x2.74~10.22. It would not take much engine to make this a tire-fryer, in an Early-A. The hard part will be limiting the cam-selection to actually take advantage of the 2110 cruise rpm.
35mph will be about 4750 so it won't take much more than the stock cam to make her a potent stop-lite bruiser.And that is a good thing, cuz the 2110 cruise rpm also wants the stock cam, to be fuel efficient.
At the factory 9.2Scr this would be a fairly nice combo for your stated useage. The only improvement I could imagine, would be slightly bigger .050, solid lifter cam, with similar-to-stock advertised specs, with a tighter LSA, paired with headers; for the One-Gear blasts to 40 mph/5500rpm. Second will get you 72/5500.
Yur gonna need to fix your traction issues first tho.
____________________________________
FYI
I think I would run that A500 with 4.30s for a 2-gear blast to 60/65 and cruise at 65=2440 in lock-up. This would allow a bit more cam and a bit more cylinder pressure, which would require a bit more tire and a bit more finessing off the line. 4.30s would get you 65=5700rpm in second so a 5400 peak power, so about a 225/230@050 cam. It will like those 4.30s alot. But..... you might as well leave the 2bbl on her cuz you won't hardly get to use the secondaries .... for all the tirespin on the primaries,lol. I ran this combo with a totally stock Lo-compression LA318 long block, with nothing more than headers and a big ThermoQuad,in my 3650 pound 68 Barracuda, and it was a flippinUge blast. But first gear was a bit short lol, with the stock cam. 295/50-15s gave up right away with a 2800TC, even with the SureGrip.I revved that teener to 5500 regularly.
I only ran it that way for a few weeks, cuz that 318 was my winter engine.It usually ran less than 3.23s; as low a 2.73s. And usually studded winter tires once the snow came,usually in December, to March/April. The Barracuda was not a very good winter car, but it's all I had. Mostly it was front-heavy.If the front decided not to roll, I wasn't going anywhere.
Thanks for the reply AJ...I do have 11" wide rear tires and a 4 link under this car so hopefully I can keep it stuck a little bit, The guy who is building my 8.8 says he has a guy who just does Chrysler transmissions and he is recommending the 46RH...would that trans be a good candidate for my Dart in your opinion?
 
Pretty close to what AJ posted @ .625......

Well, I guess you’ll just have to rebuild the entire engine again because your off according to AJ!
:rofl:

Well hell, I'm screwed now.:D
Actually I had seen before where it was .67:1 but after looking it up again everything says .69:1 for the 42 series.
It stretches over time I guess.


The guy who is building my 8.8 says he has a guy who just does Chrysler transmissions and he is recommending the 46RH...would that trans be a good candidate for my Dart in your opinion?

More extensive mods to the floor for the 46, when the 42 almost bolts right in.
Basically like the difference between a 904 and 727 with the parasitic loss being higher on the 46 just like the 727.
 
Well hell, I'm screwed now.:D
Actually I had seen before where it was .67:1 but after looking it up again everything says .69:1 for the 42 series.
It stretches over time I guess.

So the 42 will bolt up to the 360?


More extensive mods to the floor for the 46, when the 42 almost bolts right in.
Basically like the difference between a 904 and 727 with the parasitic loss being higher on the 46 just like the 727.
 
No way AJ I’m just asking ..,,
OK well, I questioned the need for the 2000 rpm cruise speed.
The fuel-economy difference is said to be about half the percent difference in mpgs. So from 2000 to 2200 is a difference of 10%, ergo fuel economy may change 5%. if you were getting 16 before the gear change, the new number looks like 15.25..
BUT this assumes; firstly, that the stall is lower than your cruise, and secondly that you are not trying to cruise with the intake in reversion.
OEM 340s are a prime example; Mine always got better fuel mileage at a little higher rpms.I won't say85mph is where it got the best mpgs.
The point is most of the time, your cammed up 360 will not get any better fuel mileage at 2000, than at 2200 or maybe even 2400. It's all in the combo.
Therefore, to sacrifice performance in the name of sticking to 2000, is, IMO, somewhat misguided.
After your engine is built, and tuned; rev it up in Neutral to about 3000,while watching the manifold vacuum. The vacuum will rise to a peak, plateau there, then begin to fall. The lowest rpm when it hits the plateau, is where you want to cruise at. Now start cranking in timing by pulling on the Vcan. Again the vacuum will rise to a peak. Put the light on it.That is the timing you will try to cruise at. You may find this to be 52* at 2200rpm. Or 56* at 2400. Or 48* at 1800. Every combo is different. The point here is that getting the timing right for your combo is far far more important than 200 cruise rpm.
The biggest deal is TRYING to keep the rpm down; BETWEEN 2000 and say 2600, rather than 3000 plus.
Now. having said all that, I can give you a combo that, for me, went 32mpg at under 1600 with timing approaching 60degrees, and at cylinder pressure approaching 200psi....... and still went 12.9/106 in the quarter, with zero tuning; and with a 60ft in the 2.4xs @3650 pounds.And it did it all with 87E10. It's all in the combo.

With ladder bars, and big sticky tires,and an overdrive;I would certainly exploit the 3.91 to 4.30 gears......... And keep the TC tame, to cruise 65@ under 2600.Then I would tune the chitoutofit. And the fuel economy will be what it will be. You will need a dash-mounted,dial-back,timing device, to sneak up on the cruise timing, because it is almost impossible to give the engine what it wants with the factory systems. Say you end up cruising at 2500. And say you end up with 25* mechanical timing,there. And say you finally find a 22* Vcan. And say your engine makes enough vacuum to fully bring it all in. Ok that totals 47*@2500. It ain't enough. The dial-back has a range of 15*. If you set it to full advance, the new total is 62*.
But more than likely you will try to run more than 25@2500, and more than likely you will not find a 22* can, or will not be able to run your 22* can at full timing; so say you manage only 42*, see what I'm saying? it's a long way from 42 to optimum.
Now one more thing, as you put more and more timing into it, it will be possible to take more and more fuel out of the cruise circuit. And this is where the true fuel savings will be.
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From 55* to 62* is where mine plateaued, that is to say the MPG was very hard to improve in that zone. So I just set it in the middle,about 58*, and called it done. During the following 10 years I tried it from time to time, but the results were always inconclusive.
So 42* will not be nearly enough, and 58* is about right in my combo. Your results may vary. My 367 likes a 2250 cruise rpm. It has a happy sound in the pipes. I have it geared for 65=2236 mathematically speaking,lol.
 
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