Big horsepower 318 builds

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fishmens67 said:
What gear ratio and 4sp or convertor would we use on this 500 HP 318. :lol:
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Don't think I'd ever would build a 500 hp 318, The only ride I could think of putting one behind if I was gonna build a gutted corner carver with a six speed and at least 4.56 gears, but I'd probably hold out for a 340 block still. To me once you start going over 425-450 hp I'd start thinking Big Block.

To me power ranges
/6 150-250hp
273 200-350hp
318 250-400hp
340/360 300-450hp
408/416 400-550hp
383/400 400-550hp
440-499 450-650hp
500 plus 600 plus hp
 
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273 said:
To me sbm power ranges
318 250-400hp
340/360 300-450hp
408/416 400-550hp
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Those are easy going daily driver ranges.
(340 @ 300hp? Stock engine!)
Street strippers add another 50hp on the big end.
 
j par said:
Oh I forgot if I'm not actually building a 500 horsepower 318 I'm a troll...
Wait a minute that would make everybody who's ever posted on this thread LOL...
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Yes cause you keep on posting **** like this, then rather what the OP wants.
I never called you directly a troll so you must instinctively know what you are.
 
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PRH said:
My basic plan would be...... the top end I’d use to make around 600hp on a 416...... and put it on a 12:1 318.

Pretty much just like what they did in the Ford/Chevy 302 video.
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Not saying a 416 vs a 360 can't squeeze more power out, "I just have no theory how it would" ?, to me torque is a factor of CR, chamber shape, VE%, displacement etc... Torque is a snap shot of one power stoke which defiantly tied to displacement and efficient. HP is all the power strokes added up. I'm guessing it would have something to do with port velocity and size that these 302 ish cids can't use up the cfm's. Cause I find cam size don't very a lot when it comes to serious street/strip 230 to 250 engines, 400hp, 500hp, 600hp only mainly difference with heads ability. How would you build a 500 hp 318-328 vs a 500 hp 408-416 ? Obviously you stated the 302-318 side but what would be the difference for the 408/416?

The only thing why I can think of why some small displacement can't scale up in hp as larger displacement engines sometimes, is it's become harder as rpm rises.
 
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That’s a nice job on that 273!!

At 323ci, you’d be at 522hp, and probably at a few hundred rpm lower.
 
273 said:
Yes cause you keep on posting **** like this, then rather what the OP wants.
I never called you directly a troll so you must instinctively know what you are.
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273 said:
Not saying a 416 vs a 360 can't squeeze more power out, "I just have no theory how it would" ?, to me torque is a factor of CR, chamber shape, VE%, displacement etc... Torque is a snap shot of one power stoke which defiantly tied to displacement and efficient. HP is all the power strokes added up. I'm guessing it would have something to do with port velocity and size that these 302 ish cids can't use up the cfm's. Cause I find cam size don't very a lot when it comes to serious street/strip 230 to 250 engines, 400hp, 500hp, 600hp only mainly difference with heads ability. How would you build a 500 hp 318-328 vs a 500 hp 408-416 ? Obviously you stated the 302-318 side but what would be the difference for the 408/416?

The only thing why I can think of why some small displacement can't scale up in hp as larger displacement engines sometimes, is it's become harder as rpm rises.
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^^^ see even this is a bunch of troll garbage! you're not going to build a 318 that makes 500 horsepower everybody knows it. Nobody is! This whole entire subject is just food for entertainment that's it.. you quote prh with some eloquently put figures but he's already said no one's going to do it... He's already said why would someone do it when you can make more for less. I myself even started out years and years ago to make the fastest 318 known to man but quickly figured out it was more expensive than making more horsepower with a 360.. because nobody does it... Nobody who doesn't have a magazine backing them. So just like I said every last person who posts on this thread is a complete troll because no one is going to actually follow through and build this motor.... is it going to be on pump gas or is it not is it going to be Streetabal or is it not, why someone would be talking about gears or transmissions does not make any sense at all. What in the hell does that have to do with 500 horsepower 318. I could give my formula for it but it would just be another fart in the wind like everybody else is formula that's not going to happen....
 
When I started this thread I was thinking 400+ horse. A horse/cube is fairly easy. A 400 horse teen is 1.25/cube. Hot Rod did it with cast Magnum heads back in the day. It should be fairly easy to do with the cam/valve train and heads now days. I should have posted 400+ as a guide. I don't know where the 500 horse thing came from. It can be done but it will have to be pretty sophisticated, expensive and probably not pump gas friendly and streetable.
 
toolmanmike said:
When I started this thread I was thinking 400+ horse. A horse/cube is fairly easy.A 400 horse teen is 1.25/cube. Hot Rod did it with cast Magnum heads back in the day. It should be fairly easy to do with the cam/valve train and heads now days. I should have posted 400+ as a guide. I don't know where the 500 horse thing came from. It can be done but it will have to be pretty sophisticated, expensive and probably not pump gas friendly and streetable.
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when you started this thread, you shouldn't have said "318". :poke:
 
toolmanmike said:
When I started this thread I was thinking 400+ horse. A horse/cube is fairly easy.A 400 horse teen is 1.25/cube. Hot Rod did it with cast Magnum heads back in the day. It should be fairly easy to do with the cam/valve train and heads now days. I should have posted 400+ as a guide. I don't know where the 500 horse thing came from. It can be done but it will have to be pretty sophisticated, expensive and probably not pump gas friendly and streetable.
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Well that's a different story! I think a 400 horsepower 318 is very doable... I don't even think you would need trick flow heads or any of that stuff but it's still going to wind up a little bit LOL..
 
j par said:
Well that's a different story! I think a 400 horsepower 318 is very doable... I don't even think you would need trick flow heads or any of that stuff but it's still going to wind up a little bit LOL..
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Exactly! I think the Hot Rod/ Magnum head/400 horse 318 should be a minimum for this thread and discussion.
 
toolmanmike said:
Exactly! I think the Hot Rod/ Magnum head/400 horse 318 should be a minimum for this thread and discussion.
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I've got those well sorted out 596 heads sitting on my shelf now that I put the speedmasters on and always wondering what I can put under those to make go a little faster..
 
How would you build a 500 hp 318-328 vs a 500 hp 408-416 ? Obviously you stated the 302-318 side but what would be the difference for the 408/416?
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Post #204.
That’s a 10:1 410 with mildly reworked Ede heads, tested on pump 93.
The motor got a cam that is very smooth and easy on parts.
539hp
Another 1/2 point of compression and a more aggressive cam and it would have made another 20-25hp.
The best one of those I tested was 589hp. Rpm heads flowing 280.
A subesequent cam change during a freshen up netted 2 tenths lower ET’s(not re-dynoed), so it should have tested at over 600hp.
That engine had an unported Victor on it....... so there was some left in it.

A 500hp 408/416 is a bonafide pump gas street motor with a small enough cam that it can be satisfactorily operated with a streetable converter and gearing.

One of the 416’s we did was very basic.
Flat tops, bowl blended J heads(240-ish), rpm a/g, hp750, small-ish SFT cam(with .842 lobes!!).
Didn’t quite get to 500hp(490’s), but it did make over 500tq.
A little more duration, or maybe a victor intake and I’m sure we could have found another 5-10hp out of it.
 
I am far from a pro builder but how about some zero deck flat tops or slightly dished with the Speedmaster/Edelbrock design heads. You could use 920's or 302's but they are cast and obviously require porting to make them as good as the aluminum's.
 
toolmanmike said:
I am far from a pro builder but how about some zero deck flat tops or slightly dished with the Speedmaster/Edelbrock design heads. You could use 920's or 302's but they are cast and obviously require porting to make them as good as the aluminum's.
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might be better starting with a magnum.... work with the magnum heads, have better deck height and a lighter rotating assembly and roller cam. I'd think a good running stock 5.2 with just some mild head work, RPM intake and 750 dp, and a stout regrind cam would get ya about 400 hp, shop smart and spend about 1300 total ?
 
318willrun said:
might be better starting with a magnum.... work with the magnum heads, have better deck height and a lighter rotating assembly and roller cam. I'd think a good running stock 5.2 with just some mild head work, RPM intake and 750 dp, and a stout regrind cam would get ya about 400 hp, shop smart and spend about 1300 total ?
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When are you starting.:D
 
fishmens67 said:
When are you starting.:D
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6 years ago. I bought a 5.2 and it was intended to go in my '74 Duster. Instead, I did the low dollar 318 build (under 500) for newbies here on FABO. 5.2 is still on the stand. LOL I'm such a nice guy, such a NICE guy... :D
 
toolmanmike said:
I am far from a pro builder but how about some zero deck flat tops or slightly dished with the Speedmaster/Edelbrock design heads. You could use 920's or 302's but they are cast and obviously require porting to make them as good as the aluminum's.
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i think 400ish hp the max any body get with the 302s and 920s! thay run outta material to grind outta them heads for thay open up enuff to make any more! the 302s HR ported for there junkyard jewel cracked up shortly after there artical was printed! now id love to see a 318 with a well ported streetmaster head and a max effort build! heads make the HP! bore an stroke determine when in rpm range it makes it!!
 
273 said:
Don't think I'd ever would build a 500 hp 318, The only ride I could think of putting one behind if I was gonna build a gutted corner carver with a six speed and at least 4.56 gears, but I'd probably hold out for a 340 block still. To me once you start going over 425-450 hp I'd start thinking Big Block.

To me power ranges
/6 150-250hp
273 200-350hp
318 250-400hp
340/360 300-450hp
408/416 400-550hp
383/400 400-550hp
440-499 450-650hp
500 plus 600 plus hp
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I tend to agree, but only if those figures are for unported head engines.
 
RustyRatRod said:
I tend to agree, but only if those figures are for unported head engines.
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I like the list 273 put up for street engines. Not that more HP isn’t doable or becoming to rowdy. They are good ranges to use without getting very large with the camshaft, which can be undesirable.

The best plan for power, no matter the displacement would be to use the best head (and intake) you can afford up top followed by a exhaust system to suite. This can be varied and dependent on the type of car being built. For a street car, I really like how D. Vizard thoughts work on this subject.
 
rumblefish360 said:
I like the list 273 put up for street engines. Not that more HP isn’t doable or becoming to rowdy. They are good ranges to use without getting very large with the camshaft, which can be undesirable.

The best plan for power, no matter the displacement would be to use the best head (and intake) you can afford up top followed by a exhaust system to suite. This can be varied and dependent on the type of car being built. For a street car, I really like how D. Vizard thoughts work on this subject.
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I do too....and honestly, more than what he has posted for each engine family is about all you have room for on the street anymore. Where can you unleash 700 HP anymore without runnin into somethin? A lot more crowded out there than it used to be. lol
 
I think a 13.5:1 W2 headed 318 could make 600HP with the right stuff in it. I've always wanted to find out.

But then how many people would discount it saying "but it's got W2 heads, so it doesn't count"? A lot I bet and just because it's a 318.
 
harrisonm said:
One other thin about the 318. Many years ago, Hot Rod or Car Craft magazine (I don't remember which), printed an article that challenged builders to get maximum HP with a $2500 budget from a Mopar 318, 350 Chebby and a Small block Ford (351 Windsor I think). The 318 won. I don't remember any other details, but the 318 won.
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LA - benefits
High nickel alloy [pre-1977]
High cam centerline height of 6.125"- Much higher than other small blocks and also higher than
the Mopar big blocks including the Hemi 426
Stock 6.123 inch rods the teen offers a rod ratio the competition would die for [1.85:1]
Valves are inclined at a advantageous 18 degree angle
Higher cam centerline clears long strokes easily and therefore allows more displacement
Chrysler engineers made a Master piece.
 
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