Swinger 340
Well-Known Member
Bewy, I think that is what I said.
Does This Debunk the "Coolant Can Flow Through the Radiator Too Fast" Idea???
- Thread starter harrisonm
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Swinger 340
Well-Known Member
Let me say it differently. The longer the water is not in the heated engine, the cooler it would be going back in. Yes, air movement and radiator size is also a factor. Fast moving coolant would not be as cool as a slower moved coolant. Now, there is a limit on how slow or fast the movement is. Think, as in an AC in a car. A low-speed fan would make the air colder coming out of the vents, then it being on a high speed. Yes, you would have more air movement but not as cold.
No, because the longer the water stays in the radiator the longer the water before it stays in the engine heating up.
Swinger 340
Well-Known Member
True Rusty, but then the water moving into the engine would be cooler to start. Almost like what came first, the chicken or the egg? Air movement, radiator size, fan clutch, speed of water movement or volume all play a part in cooling the engine. Kind of like building a motor, everything needs to work together.
I'll put it like this. I know what I've had success with and it's not slowing down water flow.
So if your radiator can do it’s job, move the coolant as fast as you can just short of cavitation and let the thermostat dictate temperature.
Why bother with a thermostat. What do you think the thermostat does. Please tell me if it does not slow down the flow what is it there for. according to everything I've read here and all the so-called studies if the water goes thru fast enough you don't need a thermostat or a fan for that matter just change out your rad and pulleys. Why do you think a thermostat opens at a certain temp. Why would it restrict how much coolant it allows thru. Make some sense off it all. I understand if it's in print or on the computer it must be true. DO YOUR OWN TEST!
I don't care what you do with pulleys and pumps, if thermostat opens at 180 or 195 degrees it still restricts the flow of coolant. You can only push as much coolant past the thermostat that it will allow yes it may move faster but, the coolant must remain in the block for a certain amount of time in order to transfer the heat from the block to the coolant.
That's how cooling systems are designed! People always try to reinvent the wheel. It usually doesn't work.
I agree. What we're saying is, there's no need to restrict flow further than what the thermostat does. But I do recommend a high flow thermostat in any event.
Now that makes sense and that's all I was asking.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
Right. And the LONGER the coolant stays in the block the more heat the exchanger (radiator) has to reject.
You’ve already been shown that what you believe is wrong and you flat refused to even acknowledge you might be wrong.
You ARE wrong. And now that you know that, every time you advise to the contrary you are lying.
I am so old I remember articles decades ago, where people argued which is better cooling....oem 2 row vs 3 row radiators!!!!!! I won't even go there!!!!!
The answer to all this is which came first..the chicken or the egg!??
The answer to all this is which came first..the chicken or the egg!??
mopowers
Well-Known Member
Here's a graph of a given automotive radiator application that describes the rate of heat transfer as a function of coolant flow at a few different air speeds. The takeaway is - flow is your friend when it comes to improving heat transfer rate. Graphs like this are all over the net. I doubt you'll find one that shows heat transfer rate decreasing as coolant flow rate increases, yet the myth just won't die.
So, I guess you both don't have thermostats in your cars you just flow it thru as fast as possible. If that works for you the go for it. Like I said if it's on paper or the web you believe it to be true. But you won't run your own tests on your cars or trucks. I have done the test and I'm happy with that. Tell me than why when a thermostat opens up it's not the same size of the rad hose or any inlets. I could make up my own graphs and write a story about this. Half would agree the other half {you} will disagree. I think therefore I am.
I've said multiple times in this thread and elsewhere that I've proven it through my own experience. I've also said I run a 160 high flow thermostat here and lots of other places on this forum. It's not my fault you've either missed that or are too obtuse to get it.So, I guess you both don't have thermostats in your cars you just flow it thru as fast as possible. If that works for you the go for it. Like I said if it's on paper or the web you believe it to be true. But you won't run your own tests on your cars or trucks. I have done the test and I'm happy with that. Tell me than why when a thermostat opens up it's not the same size of the rad hose or any inlets. I could make up my own graphs and write a story about this. Half would agree the other half {you} will disagree. I think therefore I am.
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
So, I guess you both don't have thermostats in your cars you just flow it thru as fast as possible. If that works for you the go for it. Like I said if it's on paper or the web you believe it to be true. But you won't run your own tests on your cars or trucks. I have done the test and I'm happy with that. Tell me than why when a thermostat opens up it's not the same size of the rad hose or any inlets. I could make up my own graphs and write a story about this. Half would agree the other half {you} will disagree. I think therefore I am.
I’d take the thermostat out but I can’t. Why you ask?
Because it won’t get to 140 degrees without it. That’s too cold to run a heater.
If I didn’t care about a heater I’d run the engine colder and it would make more power.
You are confusing a thermostat with flow.
trapster
Well-Known Member
The thermostats job is only to keep the engine from running too cold, that's all, nothing else.
First rusty I agree with you. Second how does the thermostat stop a motor from running to cold. It opens at a predetermined temperature and then controls how much coolant goes thru the motor to keep that temp. There is no two ways about it. Face it. It all has to work together to get the job done. With all the research done at the manufacturing plants don't you think the engineers used the right formulas to figure these things out. If you run without a thermostat chances are you will not pull enough heat out of the block causing the oil to run too hot and burn up your bearings and cam. If your car runs to cool what happens to your oil it heats up and breaks down.
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slantsixdan
=..=
You'd almost be right about that, if only you weren't completely wrong about it (…and the "NO CLUTCH FANS" thing, and much of the rest of what you said).
The thermostat sets the engine's minimum operating temperature, not its maximum. Read and learn about how engine thermostats actually work. Subsequent chapters cover radiators, fans, radiator caps, and coolant.
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Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
The thermostat sets MINIMUM OPERATING TEMPERATURE.
If the cooling system can’t maintain that temperature the cooling system is deficient.
I’m not sure WTF you are even arguing.
Edit: I started reading one of the links. Pretty basic stuff but it says what I said.
What do you know. where did you get your degree. I have read and learned, did my own tests and research. But I just thought of something. Have we been talking about race cars that only run a short time or the average car that runs for hours. I can understand all the talk about pulleys and fans and rads. in race cars but why go thru all that for a daily driver. Again you believe all you read without doing the tests and that's ok. I understand your arrogance MUST BE WHY YOU DECIDED TO PUT IT IN CAPS. I guess you are pissed off. My job is done thanks!
Newbomb Turk
Well-Known Member
I’m talking about daily driver cars. Not race cars.
I’m glad you’re done because nothing I say will convince you how wrong you are.
Now that's a true statement If I ever heard one.
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