Getting power out of a 63 /6?

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philstad28

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Hello, i have a 63 dart with a 225 /6 in it thats bone stock. I would like to get more power out of it so it could be better on the street. I drive it everyday so fuel economy is kinda important lol. I have headers for it and an offy 4 barrel intake manifold too. The carb i plan on using is a holley 390. Right now it still has the single barrel and stock exhaust and everything. What power could i see from these mods and what other mods are good as a starting point?

Thanks, Phil
 
4 barrel aint going to help with the mpg shave the head 30 and some 198 rod and some other stuff but im to sleepy to think that hard good night
 
Welcome to FABO! More power=less mileage for the most part. It's hard to get both but not impossible. Gearing is about the only way to dramatically do it. An overdrive trans with a low ratio rear is the best way. That way you have power on take off but reasonable RPM on the freeway. Cam and carb improvements can help also but are limited in what they can do for both desires. A low restriction exhaust can help also if it's done right.
 
Well, first make sure it's in top-notch tune. Tune-up parts and technique suggestions in this thread. If the motor's got some miles on it, check for timing chain slop, too; see here for instructions.

Once it's time to move on to upgrades, a good electronic ignition swap is an excellent starting point; I like the HEI upgrade . A 2bbl carburetor swap should be on the docket. It's not as easy to do on a '63 as it is on a later car with cable- rather than rod-operated throttle, but it's certainly not impossible. You can either swap in a later cable-type accelerator pedal or do some fabrication and adapt your 1bbl intake manifold and rod-type throttle linkage; see here. When it's time to replace the exhaust system, put in a 2¼" headpipe and a larger-than-stock, stock-type muffler for much better flow without annoying noise.

The next round of upgrades is more involved and costly. See for example Dutra Duals and header options discussed in this thread and this one, Erson custom cams, HEI ignition upgrade, Mike Jeffreys windage trays, Hurricane intakes, other exotic intakes. Hi-perf engine buildup here, high-perf parts and build info here.
 
I think the 2.25 head pipe is s great start. Its probably the least expensive after the electronic distributor. The original headpipe is hugely restrictive at the weld, its like a 50¢ piece size in there.
 
On this same thread I have a question. One thing I know in late model cars can really make a difference is a cold air intake. What about on our older cars? I realize as you introduce more air it needs to go somewhere so the exhaust needs to be done as well. Will a less restrictive air intake and exhaust help increase power?
 
cudamark said:
Welcome to FABO! More power=less mileage for the most part. It's hard to get both but not impossible. Gearing is about the only way to dramatically do it. An overdrive trans with a low ratio rear is the best way. That way you have power on take off but reasonable RPM on the freeway. Cam and carb improvements can help also but are limited in what they can do for both desires. A low restriction exhaust can help also if it's done right.
Click to expand...

this can go either way depending on how you do it... if you throw parts together and hope for the best then yes, hp+ mph down...

MPG is directly connected to VE, volumetric efficiency...

slants with there poor cyl head and compression is a great place to start...

a slight port job to increase the amount of A/F charge will help increase power. now becasue of your new increase of power you can get better MPG becasue it takes less fuel for the same volume becasue it is more effecient...

my slant with a 600cfm Mechincal secondary carb, 246 degree duration @ .050 with 10:1 comp. and a 3500 stall converter/3.91 gears get 20mpg. did it to vegas and back...

you have to build a combo for the best VE and make sure when it is operating it is in that area of highest VE.

as far as carbs a mech secondary carb can get better MPG if you can keep your foot out of it. you dont have to change a spring so it will open later for MPG, or sooner for power... with a mech secondary carb you dont have to worry about the secondaries opening unless you tell it to...

so use the 390, probably skip on the headers, you will lose heat thru the headers unlike a stock manifold... get it to 9.1:1 -9.5:1 compression and give the head a nice work over...
 
jhdeval said:
On this same thread I have a question. One thing I know in late model cars can really make a difference is a cold air intake
Click to expand...

No, that is marketeering BS from the people who sell "cold air intakes". Fact is, all cars have had factory cold-air intakes for decades. Most Mopars have had them since '76 (and an earlier version since '70). An aftermarket "cold air intake" on a late-model car increases intake noise and increases the amount of dirt getting into the engine (K&N "filters") and that's it.

I realize as you introduce more air it needs to go somewhere so the exhaust needs to be done as well
Click to expand...

You're not introducing more air with a "cold air intake". The restriction in the system is the throttle plate, not the air intake.

Will a less restrictive air intake and exhaust help increase power?
Click to expand...

A less restrictive exhaust is a much, much better place to spend money and effort on the car in question. The intake is already quite nonrestrictive, though there is some driveability and economy benefit to swapping on a '70-up thermostatic air cleaner -- see this post.
 
Good morning Dan, Quote =No, that is marketeering BS from the people who sell "cold air intakes". Fact is, all cars have had factory cold-air intakes for decades. Most Mopars have had them since '76 (and an earlier version since '70). An aftermarket "cold air intake" on a late-model car increases intake noise and increases the amount of dirt getting into the engine (K&N "filters") and that's it.

I have to disagree Dan :coffee2: introducing 75 degree air to the carb will help mpg :sign7:
So you say 200 degree air to the intake is better :hello2:
You are kidding aren't you..
These early A's with /'s in them are hot under the hood.
4.0 jeep cool air box and bigger filter, cooler air and less hp to suck air in the intake. Just me. :hello2:

And remove the washers from these plugs if you have drool tubes
I am by no means a tech Dan, But this seems likely to help.

It helped my performance and mpg.
I stayed with the MoPar electronic just because I understand it and it's easy to find parts in any area on the earth :cheers:
But you have to remember :cheers: I am just an ol hillbilly and colder air/ gas is a good thing :hello2:
 

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no your right memike... cold air induction is not marketing... the colder the air is the more dense it is. if it is more dense you can have bigger jets in the carb to offset a lean condition.

more fuel and air goes in, more power....

mark got a .1 from just an cold air system... i havn't got to try mine yet
 
805moparkid said:
this can go either way depending on how you do it... if you throw parts together and hope for the best then yes, hp+ mph down...

MPG is directly connected to VE, volumetric efficiency...

slants with there poor cyl head and compression is a great place to start...

a slight port job to increase the amount of A/F charge will help increase power. now becasue of your new increase of power you can get better MPG becasue it takes less fuel for the same volume becasue it is more effecient...

my slant with a 600cfm Mechincal secondary carb, 246 degree duration @ .050 with 10:1 comp. and a 3500 stall converter/3.91 gears get 20mpg. did it to vegas and back...

you have to build a combo for the best VE and make sure when it is operating it is in that area of highest VE.

as far as carbs a mech secondary carb can get better MPG if you can keep your foot out of it. you dont have to change a spring so it will open later for MPG, or sooner for power... with a mech secondary carb you dont have to worry about the secondaries opening unless you tell it to...

so use the 390, probably skip on the headers, you will lose heat thru the headers unlike a stock manifold... get it to 9.1:1 -9.5:1 compression and give the head a nice work over...
Click to expand...
I was going by the OP's original definition of his engine as "bone stock" and that MPG was important to him. Bolting on headers and a 4bbl won't help either HP or MPG in my opinion. I would add the better air intake to my list so it receives a colder air charge but as Mike and Dan pointed out, you can get one off any later Mopar and adapt it rather than spending big bucks for some whiz bang aftermarket system. Put the money saved into a rebuild fund for the engine where you can do more serious mods as you suggest.
 
slantsixdan said:
Read what I actually wrote. It's not the same as what you're arguing against my having written.
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I see, You ar talking about the junk after market cold air systems they have out on the market :coffee2:
Did not mean to come off as arguing Dan, I just voiced an opinion on colder air verses air in the engine bay area, and running a bigger filter for less restriction and still get filtered air. :coffee2: no disrespect intended Dan.
You have helped me allot and I am glad you spend time here and share your knowledge :cheers:
 
memike said:
I see, You ar talking about the junk after market cold air systems they have out on the market :coffee2:
Did not mean to come off as arguing Dan, I just voiced an opinion on colder air verses air in the engine bay area, and running a bigger filter for less restriction and still get filtered air. :coffee2: no disrespect intended Dan.
You have helped me allot and I am glad you spend time here and share your knowledge :cheers:
Click to expand...

With an eye toward performance, with SOME MPG benefits thrown in, here would be my recipe for a fun car:

230/230 cam @ .050" lift, .445" total lift
390 4bbl carb
headers into duals, 2.25" tailpipe,glasspacks
.100" off the head for a 9:1 compression

This combination should give you a high 15 second car, that will still get 20 mpg on the road.

Just my 2-cents... and probably overpriced at that....
 
I did not mean to indicate that the overpriced "cold air intake" systems. I was simply pointing out the idea behind them. As 805moparkid the colder denser air can help increase hp and mpg some. But as pointed out more air needs to get out also so a large exhaust. I am getting ready to do the exhaust on mine and I like the idea of 2.5 inch.

My idea at least in my case is bringing the intake out through the radiator walls. I think it would be out of the way and a flexible hose like a dryer hose would work well.
 
When you change the intake and exhaust you'll find you'll need to work the head to get ride of that bottleneck and make better use of your new add-ons.
 
Thanks again for all the responses. Hopefully i could get the headers on when i have the time. I won some new pipes mufflers from a door prize at a show a while ago so im going to try putting them on. Hopefully it would sound nice :)
 
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