Help understanding my odd timing?!?!

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Well see... That was kind of the point of my post. It seems screwed up and i don't know why??

Or the distributor is off a few teeth huh?
 
myasylum said:
If the distributor is off a few teeth wouldn't the timing mark be off?
Click to expand...

First off a mopar distributor can't be off a few teeth because the tip is like a chisel blade. They can only be correct or off 180 degrees. Even if it were designed like a GM or Ford where you can install it a few teeth off when you adjust the timing to lets say 20 degrees it's exactly that, 20 degrees. If the dist. was installed off kilter you just turn the dist. more one way or the other to set the timing.
 
I guess... I should have thought of that.

I guess I could make sure that the #1 cylinder is at TDC, and see if the balancer is on 0.

That should be right, right?
 
myasylum said:
I guess... I should have thought of that.

I guess I could make sure that the #1 cylinder is at TDC, and see if the balancer is on 0.

That should be right, right?
Click to expand...

Yep, that's what you need to do now. That way you'll know for sure where the timing is.
 
holy cow.. 35 initial? i would thing around 15-17 would be more then enough at idle. something doesn't sound right here.

what kind of balancer does this motor have on it?
 
Stock 360 balancer. The engine was internaly balanced though, so they ended up turning the balancer on a lathe to keep it zero balanced. (For what its worth?)
 
Never heard of that one. If it's really internally balanced, they should have just put a 318 blancer on it. Maybe the timing marks were machined off and then replaced in the wrong spot. I would find out FOR SURE if it's internally balanced. If it is, get you a good SFI approved balancer for an internally balanced small block. They are under a hundred bucks for a good one. That will make sure the timing mark is in the right spot and the balancer will be neutrally balanced. That whole balancer thing sounds like a bunch of hooha to me. never heard of anybody turnin one down in a lathe.
 
I haven't heard of turning one down either. I wonder if when they turned it on the lathe it hung up and spun the outer ring? Just a thought. I'd do what Stroker said and get a good aftermarket balancer to replace the stock one.
 
Is it a big deal to take the balancer off? Do I have to take out the radiator and all that?

Can someone post a link to a "good" balancer? There is a lot out there and prices are all over the map.

It is possible the cut down the outer ring? I brought in a stock 340 balancer, and they said not to worry about it because they machined to old one. So they said?!

When I got the new tranny I said it was a neutral balanced 360, and that's what they set the converter up for. It seems ok?!
 
myasylum said:
Stock 360 balancer. The engine was internaly balanced though, so they ended up turning the balancer on a lathe to keep it zero balanced. (For what its worth?)
Click to expand...


really? never heard of that. personally i would take that thing off and trash it. put a nice sfi approved one on it. on a stock one the outter ring could move on the rubber and cause false timing readings.
 
First things first... Sorry, might be wordy here... If you have to run 35° initial timing, you have tuning and/or mechanical issues that need to be addressed before any balance/dampener issues are. A new engien needs to run well immediately or there may be issues with ring seal down the road. So I would get it running right first. If it's not rattling your fillings lose as it is now, it's fine "for now".
Start with basics: 1. Distributor drive alignment - Take out the distributor. Look down the hole, you'll see the slot int he top, and thegear driven by the cam. Do what was suggested to get the engine on TDC of cyl 1, on compression stroke. (Finger over the hole, turn clockwise until the pressure pushes past your finger, then continue to turn clockwise until the dampener line aligns with "0" on the timing cover)
Look down the dist. hole. An imaginary line drawn thru the slot of the drive should also pass over the #1 spark plug hole. If it doesn't, use a long big flat blade screwdriver and turn the drive counterclockwise while pulling lightly up to disengage it. Then reposition so the slot faces the right direction.
Next, reinstall distributor with rotor facing straight ahead. Point the nipple of the vacuum can at the 2nd intake bolt in from the rear of the passenger's side and finger tighten the lock down bolt.
Next, make sure the firing order on the cap is right. #1 is dead center, front. It rotates clockwise so start with number one, and go 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2 clockwise from teh front center post.
Next, plug vacuum line from carb (which should be the ported vacuum on the side of the carb. Not manifold vacuum... I think you fixed that already).
Next, replace #1 plug and wire, and hook up timing light.
Next, Using the idle speed adjustment screw on the driver's side (points up and back from primary throttle shaft... the front "2 bbls"), back it off until the throtle is closed (visually it stops moving at this point). Then, open it by turning the idle speed screw in 1 full turn from closed.
Next, using the idle mixture screws on the primary side (if it has secondary idle mix, ignore it for now), screw them both in until just snug, then back out 1.5 turns.

At this point, you should be able to turn the key and have it fire immediately, and it will be idling high. It's a good starting point. AS the engine warms you can check the timing, and slowly lower the rpm with the idle speed screw and mixture screws to get the idle under 800rpm. When it'as under 800, set the intial timing to 15°, tighten down the dist locking bolt, and see how it runs. If it starts well, and idles well, you can shut if down, verify full throttle (with a friend flooring the gas), kickdown settings, etc, and then drive it. If it can't be made to run or idle that low, let us know.

When it does come time to get a balancer, get the best one you can afford. I won't use Professional Products, or any of the Pro Street (Cyco products) lines of non SFI. The SFI ones seem ok, non SFI are total junk. I wouldn't use them to prop a door open, and I'll torch the new one I have sitting in my garage. You cannot get a good performance balancer new for less than $200. You can get one, but there's no garantee it will be good for you. I've lost one of each type above. The first one just slipped. This latest one is costing me a fortune to fix as it took out the timing cover and crank in it too. Id' rather have my ***** put in a vice than use one of those imported POSs again.
 
great info moper, tho I could have gone the rest of my life, without the visual of a ***** in a vise, ouch.
 
Great explanation moper.

Duster, you should start a new thread to help with your cam. There is A lot of knowledge here, but they need a "cam" title in a thread to find it. I'd help, but I'm an idiot with cams.
 
Moper or anyone else. My 340 will not continue to run! I followed Mopers instructions, Dist. drive gear pointing toward #1, Rotor toward front (it actually pointed to #1, i'm guessing thats what he meant). Plug wires correct. My Dist. is the old school Mopar electronic with mech. tach drive (no vac. adv. canister. How should I dial in the dist. body on this dist for start up? We have tried every position for start up. It trys to fire but won't continue! When the key is on the tach lights up so i feel i'm getting juice. Could the ign. be bad? I had to install a new voltage reg. Could I have a wire wrong? It's got an MSD digital 6 and remote timing control. The timing control works. I hope i'm not hijacking this thread since it seems to be very related. It's peeing me off BIG TIME! Thx for any help, Kevin
 
moper's explanation is dead on accurate. I take nothing away from it, but if the balancer has spun, or the mark has been machined off and remarked incorrectly, there's no way in hell to have a reference for timing. Period. Since the balancer is a KNOWN part that's been modified in a really unorthodox way, that would be where I started FIRST, and then proceed with mopers great instructions. Because without a known CORRECTLY marked balancer and timing reference, all the rest is for naught. Sure, you can time an engine without the balance, but setting running engine timing without a correctly marked one is impossible.
 
Kevin Jonker said:
Moper or anyone else. My 340 will not continue to run! I followed Mopers instructions, Dist. drive gear pointing toward #1, Rotor toward front (it actually pointed to #1, i'm guessing thats what he meant). Plug wires correct. My Dist. is the old school Mopar electronic with mech. tach drive (no vac. adv. canister. How should I dial in the dist. body on this dist for start up? We have tried every position for start up. It trys to fire but won't continue! When the key is on the tach lights up so i feel i'm getting juice. Could the ign. be bad? I had to install a new voltage reg. Could I have a wire wrong? It's got an MSD digital 6 and remote timing control. The timing control works. I hope i'm not hijacking this thread since it seems to be very related. It's peeing me off BIG TIME! Thx for any help, Kevin
Click to expand...

You probably have it timed up on number 6 (180 out). It's VERY easy to do. I've done it many times myself through the years.
 
You can use a cam degree kit, maybe you can borrow it, and use it to get the engine at tdc-----then mark the balancer.
 
we swapped it 180 and it back fired through the carb, so we felt it was correct the other way. The balancer is fresh with about 2000 miles on it. It is a professional products balancer but it ran fine before we pulled the motor and the motor was not touched before reinstalling it. It just seems like there is something keeping it from firing? I know we have had the dist positioned at some point where it should fire! Stupid thing! (watch it will turn out to be something stupid!)
 
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