Highest flowing sbm heads?

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Mean416 said:
Harland sharps on jegs right now 1350
I can definitely see a solid roller spring retainer locator setup costing $1k
Fair on the valves, $800

I don't think Ti is needed at this rpm level

$1200 right now for a pair of new w2 castings

Yeah you got me. That's before port work.
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I doubt you can get W2’s new. I’ve seen them shown on Summit and such but AFAIK, they ain’t making them any more.

Depending on RPM and spring load, the HS rockers for W2 heads is a crap shoot. No thinking roller lifter manufacturer will tell you to use less than 320 on the seat with a .904 lifter and .810 wheel. And that is the only lifter worth using if you want reliability and durability.

I have a box of broken HS W2 stuff in the shop right now. That includes broken shafts. If you are serious about making power then a shaft system like the HS a isn‘t the best option.

The huge needle bearings make the rocker body weak, and to get the rocker far enough away from the spring they notch the shafts. So the rockers break at the thinnest point and the shafts snap at the notch. You’d be better off with a set of MP rockers. Of course the answer for the most reliable and durable rocker system is the T&D or Jesel stuff. That’s bullet proof.

As far is Ti goes (and this is from doing it) once you go to a 2.08 or bigger valve and/or want to make power above 7800 RPM reliably you should look at Ti intakes.

I have went way higher on steel valves when I didn’t have the money for Ti valves but controlling those heavy, clunky valves (2.100 diameter with a .310 stem) was a beeotch. It takes a toll on everything.

You have to take a systems approach to any build. Everything affects everything and not addressing every part of the build before you start will cost time, money, frustration and work that you may not have had if the build was better planned.

I see way too many penny wise, pound foolish builds that bite guys in the ***.
 
Rat Bastid said:
I doubt you can get W2’s new. I’ve seen them shown on Summit and such but AFAIK, they ain’t making them any more.

Depending on RPM and spring load, the HS rockers for W2 heads is a crap shoot. No thinking roller lifter manufacturer will tell you to use less than 320 on the seat with a .904 lifter and .810 wheel. And that is the only lifter worth using if you want reliability and durability.

I have a box of broken HS W2 stuff in the shop right now. That includes broken shafts. If you are serious about making power then a shaft system like the HS a isn‘t the best option.

The huge needle bearings make the rocker body weak, and to get the rocker far enough away from the spring they notch the shafts. So the rockers break at the thinnest point and the shafts snap at the notch. You’d be better off with a set of MP rockers. Of course the answer for the most reliable and durable rocker system is the T&D or Jesel stuff. That’s bullet proof.

As far is Ti goes (and this is from doing it) once you go to a 2.08 or bigger valve and/or want to make power above 7800 RPM reliably you should look at Ti intakes.

I have went way higher on steel valves when I didn’t have the money for Ti valves but controlling those heavy, clunky valves (2.100 diameter with a .310 stem) was a beeotch. It takes a toll on everything.

You have to take a systems approach to any build. Everything affects everything and not addressing every part of the build before you start will cost time, money, frustration and work that you may not have had if the build was better planned.

I see way too many penny wise, pound foolish builds that bite guys in the ***.
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Excellent information, thank you!
 
'68cuda416 said:
Well your wrong as usual......A good set of rockers is 2400, a good set of springs, retainers, locks and spring locaters will be approx 12-1400, valves 6-800 for steel and 1k plus if you want Ti intakes, and are the heads free along with the porting because if so can I get the number for that source as I would like in on this secret. I'm sure your fans will come back with either used parts pricing or cheap junk parts but I don't mess around with used or junk on my stuff.
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My Jesels were 1600, manley nextec springs are 600, and heads are 1200 new today. Plus you have to buy that same stuff even on a conventional head. I can post my receipts. And you dont have to go that exotic on the springs or even the rockers and probably save a grand which would put a long way on porting. You don’t know what your talking about. I own a 9 second W2 car right now thats 3250 with me in it and its 372”. There are a lot of 9 second W2 full bodied street cars out there. I do port my own heads so thats where I am off in my numbers and most porters wont do iron anymore. But there is a super stock guy near me that will do a set all out for 1k. And he is good. Probably an anomaly.
 
I would not go crazy with the Harland Sharp rockers. While you can make some nice “Street, strip strip” power without a big worry, there not for swing for the fence with. I have some Econo heads that will get the HS rockers for a nice street build. Nothing to hairy. Just a solid cam with a reasonable lift.

As mentioned before, Jesel or TD rockers are what you want/need. I’ll be down for two sets myself.
 
After I gave up on them I bought and sold a set of race W2 heads, Norris rockers, and an intake. Made a little quick money on the deal. They ran 9’s in a heavy all steel strip only Avenger.
 
turbodart68 said:
My Jesels were 1600, manley nextec springs are 600, and heads are 1200 new today. Plus you have to buy that same stuff even on a conventional head. I can post my receipts. And you dont have to go that exotic on the springs or even the rockers and probably save a grand which would put a long way on porting. You don’t know what your talking about. I own a 9 second W2 car right now thats 3250 with me in it and its 372”. There are a lot of 9 second W2 full bodied street cars out there. I do port my own heads so thats where I am off in my numbers and most porters wont do iron anymore. But there is a super stock guy near me that will do a set all out for 1k. And he is good. Probably an anomaly.
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Been hanging out on Mopar forums and attending big Mopar only races forever.
I can say I have not run into ANY “ 9 sec full bodied W2 street cars” out there.
RIP.. guy well known in Mopar circles as 9 sec Phil comes to mind, had a 68 or 69 W2 Cuda on Nitrous that ran real high 9’s, 10 flat( I actually raced him at Monster Mopar in 10.0 shootout years ago) but he is only one who comes to mind.
BTW I am talking NA, not turbo or spray cars.
 
cookietruck said:
looks like Trick Flow heads put you way ahead.
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True. And at 190cc it begs the question. Trickflow did it with the big block head. First the 240 then a few years later the 270. I truly think if the 190 does well then the 220 is a possibility. If that happens then we are in for a treat. I hope that happens.

For years us Mopar guys had to either go with a factory head or switch to a W head. Most of us, me included couldn’t afford to do such things. I wish I knew then what I know now. I would have eaten top ramen to save for a set of W2’s. Now we have too many options to fill that void. AFR makes a 245cc intake head for small chevy that is conventional 23 degree head. A 220cc head for a Mopar in todays world is very very possible. We need to support companies like Trickflow so that they feel they can spend more in designing a bigger head for us. The TFS 190 is really a lot better than any other conventional small block head out there and I am not talking about port size or flow. Look at how nice the chamber is. They spent a lot making that head better.
 
You haven't seen ANY?! Man. A 9 second W2 car on a stock stroke 340/360 exists. On the other hand I have seen several, over the years, 10.00 street cars with J heads lol. All are N/A, boost or nitrous doesn’t count.
 
turbodart68 said:
You haven't seen ANY?! Man. A W2 car on a stock stroke 340/360 exists. On the other hand I have seen several, over the years, 10.00 street cars with J heads lol.
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No, I haven’t.
not bragging , but if anyone wants to take it that way, Oh well.
I had a 70 Duster street/ strip car. Full interior including back seat. Had two Kirkey seats, otherwise interior was bone stock.
Uncut, untubbed, not even mini tubbed, super stock springs, it was a true sleeper.
it ran 9’s with a 700 lift roller, 13 to 1 compression, at 3350 pounds with my 300+ in the seat. Very good W5 heads.
that car was honestly fairly legendary in these parts, running like it did.
so frankly, I find it very hard to believe when you throw around as supposed fact there are lots of NA W2 street cars running around.
it takes an honest 650 horse to get a heavier car( like I had) solidly in the 9’s.
650 horse W2 motors aren’t growing on trees that I am aware of. May be some, but they aren’t common or I would know of them
 
turbodart68 said:
My Jesels were 1600, manley nextec springs are 600, and heads are 1200 new today. Plus you have to buy that same stuff even on a conventional head. I can post my receipts. And you dont have to go that exotic on the springs or even the rockers and probably save a grand which would put a long way on porting. You don’t know what your talking about. I own a 9 second W2 car right now thats 3250 with me in it and its 372”. There are a lot of 9 second W2 full bodied street cars out there. I do port my own heads so thats where I am off in my numbers and most porters wont do iron anymore. But there is a super stock guy near me that will do a set all out for 1k. And he is good. Probably an anomaly.
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When I think of you the first thought I think of is THANK GOD I DIDN'T GET INVOLVED WITH YOU at any point in time and knowing what I know about you I guarantee you I never will.
 
B3422w5 said:
No, I haven’t.
not bragging , but if anyone wants to take it that way, Oh well.
I had a 70 Duster street/ strip car. Full interior including back seat. Had two Kirkey seats, otherwise interior was bone stock.
Uncut, untubbed, not even mini tubbed, super stock springs, it was a true sleeper.
it ran 9’s with a 700 lift roller, 13 to 1 compression, at 3350 pounds with my 300+ in the seat. Very good W5 heads.
that car was honestly fairly legendary in these parts, running like it did.
so frankly, I find it very hard to believe when you throw around as supposed fact there are lots of NA W2 street cars running around.
it takes an honest 650 horse to get a heavier car( like I had) solidly in the 9’s.
650 horse W2 motors aren’t growing on trees that I am aware of. May be some, but they aren’t common or I would know of them
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I have one in my garage. It did 650 hp and it isn’t a stroker. I guess I will have to take your word for it. Plus my W5 motor 436” 9:1 compression breathing through turbos with 33” tire 3.70 gear and a 2500 stall ran 10.30/138. I don't think you are bragging at all. Not all motors are created equal.
'68cuda416 said:
I don't think you have a clue what your talking about either so we will just agree to disagree and I don't like your cars either so go back to your west coast left wing lunatics who will coddle you and tell you how great you are because your not gonna get that from me
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Dude you need help. Every thing you say has been debunked. You attack everyone like you are the end word in everything. You really have no quality information on anything. You go on tirades on the same posting, posting over and over. You assume things about people. Then you make statements like this. You have really shown what is at your core. A bitter, jealous, vindictive, insecure, narcissist. Kindly go somewhere else where you fit in. No one wants you here. Take the hint.
 
'68cuda416 said:
When I think of you the first thought I think of is THANK GOD I DIDN'T GET INVOLVED WITH YOU at any point in time and knowing what I know about you I guarantee you I never will.
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wait a minute here, sounds like you were considering dating Turbodart68
these aren't dating forums...
 
turbodart68 said:
I have one in my garage. It did 650 hp and it isn’t a stroker. I guess I will have to take your word for it. Plus my W5 motor 436” 9:1 compression breathing through turbos with 33” tire 3.70 gear and a 2500 stall ran 10.30/138. I don't think you are bragging at all. Not all motors are created equal.

Dude you need help. Every thing you say has been debunked. You attack everyone like you are the end word in everything. You really have no quality information on anything. You go on tirades on the same posting, posting over and over. You assume things about people. Then you make statements like this. You have really shown what is at your core. A bitter, jealous, vindictive, insecure, narcissist. Kindly go somewhere else where you fit in. No one wants you here. Take the hint.
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Trust me it's the other way around and little do you know but there are many people of whom i WON'T NAME NAMES WHO VIEW YOU EXACTLY AS i DO.....goodbye
 
I didn’t find out till recently that the B1BA is still available. Its a decent head that takes LA intake and headers. You can even put Chevy rockers on it and oil through the pushrod. Thats another good option. I just bought a set complete and ported off an offroad truck racer. $500 for the set. Used heads are out there. But be careful because there is some real junk out there too.
 
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cookietruck said:
wait a minute here, sounds like you were considering dating Turbodart68
these aren't dating forums...
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Hahahaha good one. Made me spit up my coffee.
'68cuda416 said:
Trust me it's the other way around and little do you know but there are many people of whom i WON'T NAME NAMES WHO VIEW YOU EXACTLY AS i DO.....goodbye
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I don’t care how you view me. I don’t care how “popular” I am on this forum. I do care about sharing info (correct info as I know it) with others and having intelligent conversations. All I have to say is thank god you are gone.
 
turbodart68 said:
I didn’t find out till recently that the B1BA is still available. Its a decent head that takes LA intake and headers. You can even put Chevy rockers on it and oil through the pushrod. Thats another good option. I just bought a set complete and ported off an offroad truck racer. $500 for the set. Used heads are out there. But be careful because there is some real junk out there too.
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my brother bought a used set at Monster Mopar about 4 years ago. B1BA. Unfortunately, at my urging. intake, rockers, ported heads..1200 bucks
i have come to the conclusion they are more trouble than they are worth.
the head itself is “ Bigger” than the rest of the replacement head crowd, and it has a slightly raised exhaust port. In short, headers are an out and out pain in the ***. And don’t even think about them on a 63-66 Abody.
Well done, they are comparable to a well done Eddie type head. Gotta a buddy who runs them on a 3000 pound A body bracket car. Roller cam, etc, etc. typically runs 10.40’s or so.
with the oddities about them, and other offerings out there, they are nothing I would run, unless money forced me to( got them ultra cheap)
 
One of my friends just shared this

95655E4A-1F66-490C-B3D1-C922BB31C62B.jpeg
 
B3422w5 said:
my brother bought a used set at Monster Mopar about 4 years ago. B1BA. Unfortunately, at my urging. intake, rockers, ported heads..1200 bucks
i have come to the conclusion they are more trouble than they are worth.
the head itself is “ Bigger” than the rest of the replacement head crowd, and it has a slightly raised exhaust port. In short, headers are an out and out pain in the ***. And don’t even think about them on a 63-66 Abody.
Well done, they are comparable to a well done Eddie type head. Gotta a buddy who runs them on a 3000 pound A body bracket car. Roller cam, etc, etc. typically runs 10.40’s or so.
with the oddities about them, and other offerings out there, they are nothing I would run, unless money forced me to( got them ultra cheap)
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Brett Miller has a CNC program he is working on. They are beautiful. The heads he hand ported made 940 on a 400+ inch nitrous motor without nitrous. Brian at IMM has a customer who also runs nitrous and his motor makes great power (I forget how much exactly) but it was impressive. I bought mine because they were cheap. They are at IMM getting flowed now.
 
turbodart68 said:
Brett Miller has a CNC program he is working on. They are beautiful. The heads he hand ported made 940 on a 400+ inch nitrous motor without nitrous. Brian at IMM has a customer who also runs nitrous and his motor makes great power (I forget how much exactly) but it was impressive. I bought mine because they were cheap. They are at IMM getting flowed now.
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I thought the set he was working on or did were the moved centerline or whatever they called it.
 
B1BA-MC?

Post up cats!!!!

(I don’t really care for cat pictures…. It’s just better than some of the conversation.)
 
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