I think my 225 is toast

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Three-nuts

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[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zz_3h4quNI&feature=youtu.be"]74 Dart 225 Motor noise - YouTube[/ame]

Bought the car two weeks ago. Has approx 160K on it.

When I run it on the highway, it makes a jackhammering sound from under the hood. The knock stays for a couple of minutes after a highway run, then fades away. As you can see from the video, it's a pretty hard knock on acceleration/sustained high RPM.

Compression is even & good, all plugs are the right brown color. Oil is clean. It does have blowback (some oil in the air cleaner housing).

I have a shake at idle in D (or any gear). Hard shudder through the column & front end on take off, lessens quite a bit in higher gears, not noticeable at all at highway speeds. Trans shifts fine, the flex plate is fine and all bolts are tight. Driveshaft & U-joints are likewise tight. Left mount & trans mount replaced, neither were particularly bad. Valves were adjusted (painted the valve cover then).

I can't tell whether this is a rod knock or some kind of valve train issue. It's loudest at the #6 exhaust manifold neck, but it's really hard to localize (using a mech stethescope). Last (& only) rod knock I had, it did it all the time & never went away.

Thanks for reading & input.

(edit) VV did pull the belts off. The alternator bearings are starting to grate, but it ain't it. :( It is not being driven, this was a short test hop. My son was driving it to work (about 3.5 miles each way, never exceeds 40MPH) but he's using another car now. VV
 
a knock like that is never good

you can pull your belts off to make sure it isnt an accessory or water pump. i would have stopped driving it
 
Pull the plug wires off one at a timeand rev it so it makes the knock. When you get one that makes the knock go away or get decidedly better, there's your culprit cylinder. Sounds like a rod bearing gone to me.
 
StrokerScamp said:
Pull the plug wires off one at a timeand rev it so it makes the knock. When you get one that makes the knock go away or get decidedly better, there's your culprit cylinder. Sounds like a rod bearing gone to me.
Click to expand...

Will try that & advise shortly...
 
yep #5 sooner or later you will have a nice hole at the starter then you can reach in and pull the broken parts out.I drove a cab one summer(1975) back and forth to the airport and had one cut lose about 2 in the morning.put a soda can opened up in front of the hole and drove it back home 50miles lost 2 qts,oil.but she still run.with a hell of a miss.you have two things you can do.1 stop running it pull it and figure on turning the crank to 10/10 or20/10 get another rod and rebuild it.or just run the hell out of it to see how long it lasts.lol:eek:ops:the one I was driving went another 200 miles before the crank broke.but back then they were laying around everywhere.......Artie
 
I've seen few slants that made that noise, then threw a rod on usually cylinders #2-#5. Bad oil change regiment-or my smelly-arse favorite causes-Pennzoil or Quaker State users was the culprits or just TONS of miles)
 
StrokerScamp said:
Pull the plug wires off one at a timeand rev it so it makes the knock. When you get one that makes the knock go away or get decidedly better, there's your culprit cylinder. Sounds like a rod bearing gone to me.
Click to expand...


godfatherofchry said:
yep #5 sooner or later you will have a nice hole at the starter then you can reach in and pull the broken parts out.(...)...Artie
Click to expand...

Sirs (or ladies, as the case may be):

You are well-acquainted with your fecal matter.

Pulled #6, no change. As soon as I pulled #5, I heard the knock, softly, at idle. Engine rev: nothing. Checked the rest just to be sure, they're fine (for the moment)

It will be cheaper to change out the motor. I shall continue trolling the forums for one.

I'm not overly surprised. This Dart appears to have been an old-biddy-mobile/time machine that then sat for several years. Not a lot of maintenance was in evidence, which is a testament to the engineering & construction in these cars that it ran as well as it did. Motor flush was... disgusting.
 
never rule out the converter bolts coming loose! i though my motor was done a couple times but it was just verter bolts...
 
Converter bolts won't quite making noise when you pull a plug wire though.
Whatta ya, tired? :)
 
If there isn't a knock when you pull the plug off, I'd bet you could replace that ONE rod bearing and you'd be able to drive the heck out of until you are ready to put another engine in it.

You can even take the pan off with the engine in the car still.
I'd have to try it just for pure grins to see how long it went afterwards.
Worst case you blow it up. (Bout there right now anyway)
And of course might as well do #2 while your in there anyway.(or do em all)
 
TrailBeast said:
If there isn't a knock when you pull the plug off, I'd bet you could replace that ONE rod bearing and you'd be able to drive the heck out of until you are ready to put another engine in it.

You can even take the pan off with the engine in the car still.
I'd have to try it just for pure grins to see how long it went afterwards.
Worst case you blow it up. (Bout there right now anyway)
And of course might as well do #2 while your in there anyway.(or do em all)
Click to expand...

I thought about that & read the manual (which says, oddly, to jack the motor from the left front corner of the pan...and then unbolt & remove the pan! Nice trick!). I figure by the time I open it up & buy a set of rod bearings for $120 I'll find the crank journal lunched. Then, there'd be no point in putting it back together with a new pan gasket. I'd rather spend those three hours towards changing out the motor. I'm old, you see... :)

This car is probably going away. Either sold or junked, it's a substantial loss. My own fault for not hearing this on the test run with the seller. $1300 + 300 exhaust work & another $300 in various bits pieces & a battery. Never too old to do something stupid. Ain't no fool like an old fool.
 
I was thinking about it and you actually could be right.
There IS a SMALL chance that pulling a plug wire could change the balance which in turn could make the engine spin a little differently and quiet a converter bolt rattle.

Right? (Slim but possible)

Seriously doubt this is the case with this car but,,,


805moparkid said:
yea actually...
Click to expand...
 
If you can do it then that's GREAT.
I've had to make do with what I had most of my younger years so I learned to make things work and it carried over through the rest of my life I guess.

Now that I realize you are capable of it, I want you to replace those two rod bearings and drive the piss out of it and tell us what happened.:violent1:
Just kidding.:D





Three-nuts said:
I thought about that & read the manual (which says, oddly, to jack the motor from the left front corner of the pan...and then unbolt & remove the pan! Nice trick!). I figure by the time I open it up & buy a set of rod bearings for $120 I'll find the crank journal lunched. Then, there'd be no point in putting it back together with a new pan gasket. I'd rather spend those three hours towards changing out the motor. I'm old, you see... :)

This car is probably going away. Either sold or junked, it's a substantial loss. My own fault for not hearing this on the test run with the seller. $1300 + 300 exhaust work & another $300 in various bits pieces & a battery. Never too old to do something stupid. Ain't no fool like an old fool.
Click to expand...
 
TrailBeast said:
I was thinking about it and you actually could be right.
There IS a SMALL chance that pulling a plug wire could change the balance which in turn could make the engine spin a little differently and quiet a converter bolt rattle.

Right? (Slim but possible)

Seriously doubt this is the case with this car but,,,
Click to expand...

I don't disagree...except that it didn't rattle on the other five when pulled. Plus I pulled the starter & manually checked all four bolts. :)
 
Three-nuts said:
Already checked those. Rod bearing issue = confirmed.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't say that quite yet. Something on number 5 cylinder is confirmed. There's still the piston, wristpin and rod bearing. I've seen some galled pistons and wristpins knock like you would not believe.
 
TrailBeast said:
If you can do it then that's GREAT.
I've had to make do with what I had most of my younger years so I learned to make things work and it carried over through the rest of my life I guess.

Now that I realize you are capable of it, I want you to replace those two rod bearings and drive the piss out of it and tell us what happened.:violent1:
Just kidding.:D
Click to expand...

Oh god you ain't kidding. I've had nearly thirty cars since I was 15...my first car was $150 and had the head & bits in the trunk. After college I owned at least two at once (and as many as five) in case one died. Never paid more than $300 for a car that wasn't a ragtop. My '74 Fury III had a blown vacuum switch for the heat, so I bypassed it with a $2 toggle switch. Permatex was my friend. I carried a full toolbox in my trunk at all times.

My favorite moment was when the rear U-joint quit on my Ram van & my buddy was blown away when I pulled a U-joint cross kit out of my box and proceeded to replace it on the side of the PA Turnpike at night (he held the flashlight).

When I'm too old to swap a motor, start shovelling.
 
Still toast.
Interesting to find out exactly though.

StrokerScamp said:
I wouldn't say that quite yet. Something on number 5 cylinder is confirmed. There's still the piston, wristpin and rod bearing. I've seen some galled pistons and wristpins knock like you would not believe.
Click to expand...
 
^^^ Good god. I thought my neighbor (a retired racecar mechanic named Stan Butler; may he rest in peace) was hardcore for making a head gasket out of a grocery bag ^^^

TrailBeast said:
Still toast.
Interesting to find out exactly though.
Click to expand...

If I can find a very cheap (or free) 225, I promise to open up this one & post the results.
 
Not sure of the rest of the condition of the car, but a decent running slant can be found a swaped out pretty cheaply. Might consider that over junking it and may recoup some of your investment?
 
When I was about 15 I took my dads truck while he was at work to go to my girlfriends house.
I lived in a place where a 15 year old had been driving for 3 years already.
Anyway it threw the driveline out on an old backroad.
Found ONE beaing cap still in the diff yoke and the other one was gone.
I had two tools in the truck, (5/8 Craftsman short socket and a half inch wrench.

Guess how it went.

The short socket went in in place of the old bearing cap, and the nuts on the retainers were half inch.
My dad drove it like that for 6 weeks before it threw out again along with all the incriminating evidence.:D


Three-nuts said:
Oh god you ain't kidding. I've had nearly thirty cars since I was 15...my first car was $150 and had the head & bits in the trunk. After college I owned at least two at once (and as many as five) in case one died. Never paid more than $300 for a car that wasn't a ragtop. My '74 Fury III had a blown vacuum switch for the heat, so I bypassed it with a $2 toggle switch. Permatex was my friend. I carried a full toolbox in my trunk at all times.

My favorite moment was when the rear U-joint quit on my Ram van & my buddy was blown away when I pulled a U-joint cross kit out of my box and proceeded to replace it on the side of the PA Turnpike at night (he held the flashlight).

When I'm too old to swap a motor, start shovelling.
Click to expand...
 
The car is remarkably solid & rust-free, a sprinkling of small rust holes on the surface of both lower rear quarters, some light surface rust in the trunk, but none anywhere else.... the right anchor for the trunk torsion bars is bent, I was going to straighten & then stiffen it with a piece of heavy-gauge sheet steel (since I heard that once bent, they don't hold their shape)...

gljFU.jpg


...carpet's dissolving, & it needs a heater core, 2-front tires, probably ball joints and a front-end alignment.

Other than that, it's poifect!

(edit) that is one crappy photo
(edit2) and that cute l'il dent in the rt front fender...
 
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