Is it possible to convert??

-
7

73schwinger

Active Member
Joined
Nov 9, 2015
Messages
42
Reaction score
0
Location
Albany louisiana
I've got a 73 swinger and I'm wondering is it possible to convert to coil overs cause there something up with my leaf springs I'm gonna try to post a picture of what's going on
I don't think there supposed to be that long
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20151123_153728.jpg
    53.8 KB · Views: 410
  • IMG_20151123_153543.jpg
    95.5 KB · Views: 403
Can't help on the coil overs. From the looks of it the springs are beyond weak. They appear to have a reverse arch and looks like someone added longer shackles to recover the ride height, the springs may not even be an A-body leaf. You could measure the front segment from the spring eye to the center pin and get a better idea. Me personally, and depending on your goals, I would look at either having the leaf springs re-arched or replace them and put original style shackles on it. I think it would be a lot easier and cheaper than installing a coil over system.
 
dubob said:
from the looks of it the springs are beyond weak. They appear to have a reverse arch and looks like someone added longer shackles to recover the ride height. Me personally, and depending on your goals, i would look at either having the leaf springs re-arched or replace them and put original style shackles on it. I think it would be a lot easier and cheaper than installing a coil over system.
Click to expand...

x2
 
Agreed; Depending on what your desired end result is, repair or replace stock. These cars drive just fine with the original parts... If your going racing then that may be a different story, but there are some really quick leaf sprung cars out there as well.
 
The main advantage of coil overs is tunability and compactness. The stock suspension is a great designed especially compared to other cars of that era. Just needs the right spring and sway bar rates, shocks and caster.
 
^ the main disadvantage is, all that work!!!

They make PLENTY of aftermarket springs; all of which I would research, especially if your upgrading your T-BARs, spring rates, and how they play matter!!

These cars handle on rails with the rear leafs.. FYI.
 
PoisonDart74 said:
^ the main disadvantage is, all that work!!!

They make PLENTY of aftermarket springs; all of which I would research, especially if your upgrading your T-BARs, spring rates, and how they play matter!!

These cars handle on rails with the rear leafs.. FYI.
Click to expand...

What's that mean^ handle on rails
 
Ever ridden a train?

It mean like a go kart, NO body sway! You turn the wheel it GOES.

Look up some of 72bluNblu and autoxcuda's posts.
 
Part of the problem is those "shackle extentions", they don't help AT ALL. Cut them down to the stock 4" or buy the correct ones.
 
Like this :)
 

Attachments

  • onrails600.jpg
    33.8 KB · Views: 363
73schwinger said:
..... convert to coil overs ....
Click to expand...

"Coil overs?" You don't need "coil overs"

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52IuuCBP8MU"]Jason Digby talks about his world's fastest Leaf Spring Mopar. - YouTube[/ame]

[ame="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cO3jFdKMd_s"]Worlds FASTEST Stock Suspension Mopar!! - YouTube[/ame]

If you have the money, call up Hotchkis Suspension and tell 'em what you have and buy a new set of rear springs........

or do what I did.......I junked out another Dart (A body) took my original and the junker spring packs and combined the leafs until I had a new pack stacked up with 1 more leaf than original. This was a complete guess that turned out to be 'great'. You'll need new center bolts which you can get at most decent fasteners stores, good auto parts stores, or "spring and brake" (truck shops) and even the cowtown Spokamentro has one of those.

You may or may not need new U bolts, "spring clips" both of which you can get at a good spring shop. you need to throw away those extended rear shackles and find some stockers, or at least re attach those so they are shorter, using the "short" bolt holes.

The ONLY thing extended shackles were ever good for was...........well.......nottin'

snap371.3.jpg
 
The long shackles are the biggest part of your problem. They do not help Mopars due to the asymmetrical nature of our leaf springs (roughly 2/3 of the length behind the axle with the greater spring rate forward of the axle).

For a cheap ride height adjustment there are coil-over helper spring kits (you keep the leaf springs and these just go over the shocks to help). I have used them on my Barracuda and my son's Dart.
 
Jim Lusk said:
The long shackles are the biggest part of your problem. They do not help Mopars due to the asymmetrical nature of our leaf springs (roughly 2/3 of the length behind the axle with the greater spring rate forward of the axle).

For a cheap ride height adjustment there are coil-over helper spring kits (you keep the leaf springs and these just go over the shocks to help). I have used them on my Barracuda and my son's Dart.
Click to expand...

Where would I find them at?
 
New springs and stock shackles are all it needs.
 
The shock mounted overload springs are a little hard on shock bushings tho. And there's not much room between the shock body and the tank. I have used them back in the day, on both a 70Dart and a 73 Dart. Both times I had to bend the lip on the fuel tank to make room. Also, eventually the coil springs rubbed on the shock-body and made a very annoying racket back there.
New or different leaf-springs is a much better solution.
 
AJ/FormS said:
The shock mounted overload springs are a little hard on shock bushings tho. And there's not much room between the shock body and the tank. I have used them back in the day, on both a 70Dart and a 73 Dart. Both times I had to bend the lip on the fuel tank to make room. Also, eventually the springs rubbed on the shock-body and made a very annoying racket back there.
New or different springs is a much better solution.
Click to expand...

long shakles are good for one thing! eventually they "will" ruin your springs !----lol
 
Get the new leaf springs. Coil overs are cheap cheesy crap unless you blow good money on them.
 
famous bob said:
long shakles are good for one thing! eventually they "will" ruin your springs !----lol
Click to expand...

I'm curious, how does shackle length effects the life of the springs?

I know that long shackles can lead to handling problems, due to the possibility of the springs moving side to side, causing rear-steer.

Is it the side to side movement that destroys the springs?
 
All you need is new leaf springs and the correct shackles.

Also, from your other post, I noticed you car doesn't have an engine in it up front, and half your engine parts (including the heads) are in the trunk. So the car is sitting nose high with a ton of weight in the trunk. Not saying you don't need new leaf springs, but there's a lot more load on them now than there would be if you car was at the proper height and the weight was distributed like normal.

Too many people just figure that the old suspension is no good and needs to be tossed for coilovers. The old suspension parts do need to be replaced because they're worn out, but nothing is wrong with the design for the vast majority of applications that people use these cars for. Converting to coilovers in the back means a full redesign, usually a 3 or 4 link system. Most of those kits cost $1,500 or more. Or you could spend $300 on new leaf springs and bushings, which will work just fine for probably 99% of the things most people use these cars for.
 
ChrisPerry said:
I'm curious, how does shackle length effects the life of the springs?

I know that long shackles can lead to handling problems, due to the possibility of the springs moving side to side, causing rear-steer.

Is it the side to side movement that destroys the springs?
Click to expand...

The long shackles tend to force Mopar leaf springs to sag past horizontal. This is likely due to the location of the strength on Mopar springs (forward of the axle). This puts a slight "S" curve on the spring.

My daughter-in-law's '65 Mustang has long shackles on it (my son put them on the shortest hole, though). Because Mustang springs are symmetrical they don't sag the same way and tall shackles will tend to raise the back end more.
 
Jim Lusk said:
The long shackles tend to force Mopar leaf springs to sag past horizontal. This is likely due to the location of the strength on Mopar springs (forward of the axle). This puts a slight "S" curve on the spring.

My daughter-in-law's '65 Mustang has long shackles on it (my son put them on the shortest hole, though). Because Mustang springs are symmetrical they don't sag the same way and tall shackles will tend to raise the back end more.
Click to expand...

Ok, this is what I'm not understanding. How is the spring effected differently by the longer shackle. If the back of the spring is still seeing exactly the same amount of weight, then why is it bending it?

I don't have a lot of experience with Mopar rear springs, but in my offroad experience with springs with the center pin offset 6-8" further forward, I haven't had a spring bend like that. Unless it bent due to axle wrap or something binding. These springs sometimes have shackles 6-8" long and shackle flips that can move the rear of the springs 10-12" further down.

I'm not trying to argue with anyone here, I'm just trying to understand why the Mopar spring reacts this way. Maybe there is a leverage force that I can't picture in my head.:banghead:
 
You are changing the dynamics of the entire situation. This is sort of like two guys holding a weight, let's say you have a device sort of like a stretcher with a guy at each end, and a weight "down towards" one end. One guy has more of the weight. If you TILT that weight the guy on the other end has to hold up even more of the original load.

These springs are not the same situation, but the idea is kind of similar. The rear of the spring is MUCH weaker. By putting a longer shackle on there you are putting much much more force on that back half.

Also, shackles, even stockers, which are not tight and rigid, "fall over" sideways under cornering force, and this gets worse as they are made longer and / or the bushings are worn

This used to be a BIG problem many guys did not realize on things like Jeeps and Landcruisers. This is because, with the shackles moving, and a crosswise drag link, as the shackles moved, this effectively steers the front wheels.

IHC on the late scouts had a flat spring across between the inside of the two shackles. I did the same thing with an old leaf on my beat up FJ-40. It DRAMATICALLY improved handling.

The rear is the same way. As those big, long sloppy shackles "waltz around" this steers the car, and "it ain't good." Like driving with two rear tires "half flat"

I don't know what this is, but this is the idea:

17610b_238842.jpg
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top