Is it smart???

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Aluminum has its strong points, for sure, You pointed out some of them, and in certain applications, I'm sure you are right, particularly the repairability issue, where cast iron is just a living nightmare to deal with.
Chrysler gave up on the aluminum /6 production when they had foundry problems too frequent and too numerous to deal with; it wasn't that the motors didn't perform well... it was just production issues that killed it. They managed to send 60,000 copies out the door, before changing over,completely, to cast iron though, so, they're out there, somewhere, if that's the direction you want or need to go.

The parameters involved in putting together a high-boost /6 are more about rigidity, resistance to flex, and general strength of the block and head, though, and that's where the tensile strength of the iron castings seem to shine. They are just super-strong where they need to be. No other engine that I know of, has the capability to absorb high boost levels without incurring trauma to the basic infrastructure, as the /6. Its basic design features (thick deck, 84-pound cylinder head, forged, crank, big bearings and small bores seem to beg, "TURBO ME!!!! YOU'LL LIKE IT!!!"

The only thing they missed on, was the inherent design limitation of 4 head bolts instead of 5. That's a shame, but ARP makes some stronger studs (220,000-pound-per-square inch material, instead of the standard 180,000-psi) that may take care of that problem. They also have some REAL exxpensive 260,000-pound material studs, if that doesn't fix the "head-lifting" problem, down the road.

We'll see....
 
I'd LOVE to find an aluminum slant block. ...and no....they MISSED when they made the deck an open design. THAT is a shame. that would have solved the whole problem with the weak head gasket sealing. Then you could boost hell outta of um.
 
I've never seen an alum /6. I'll keep my eyes open for ya Rob...
 
i think it's a great theory, as opposed to small/big block running costs all the time, you get to just tick around with the economy of a six until you want it.

Don't get me wrong, i love my smallblocks, but with technology available (not to mention the bargain basement price), i've even considered removing one of my sets of webers of a hemi6, selling them and funding a turbo build.

There was also the article i was reading about using a slightly smaller turbo than reccomended for a daily driver (kicks in earlier at more everyday revs).

just out of curiosity, what would the weight difference be between a turbo 6 and a smallblock be?
 
Seems I read somewhere the slant had the small block already by like 40 pounds so certainly a turbo slant would be heavier still. Slants are bigger than you might think.
 
Well, I jotted down some #'s of my build. Alot of the stuff I had used sitting around so it didn't cost anything. A few parts I traded or some gave to the cause. As you can see the engine was low budget in deed. Even the rings were used from a diff motor.

Block - 1972 Hesston Swather 225ci - $100 (bought three that day for $100)
Head - Don't know the year but used - $0.00
Crank - stock Forged (never been out of block) - $0.00
Rods - stock - $0.00
Pistons - TRW Forged std bore (used from another motor) - $0.00
Rings - Moly (used from another motor) - $0.00
Rods Bearings - Used from another motor - $0.00
Main Bearings - never been out of the Hesston block - $0.00
Oil pump - Stock original Hesston - $0.00
Valves - 1.70 / 1.44 Ebay - $85.00
Springs - Used dual from SB - $0.00
Balancer - Stock Hesston $0.00
Head Gasket - Copper Hussey - $80.00
Head Studs - ARP Custom - $220.00
Main Studs - ARP - $85.00
Rods Bolts - ARP - $55.00
Cam - Erson .465 lift w/ lifters - $130.00
Timing Chain - Rollmaster - $110.00
Dist Gear - New - $6.00
Dist - used from 80's computer controlled D150 - $0.00
Wires - MSD Custom set - $100.00
Water Pump - New Car Quest - $28.00
Chrome Valve cover - Used Ebay - $20.00
Gasket Set - Felpro - $45.00
Intake Gasket - New - $12.00
Intake - Clifford Hyper Pac - $325.00
Header - Cut apart used set of SB and welded by me - $0.00
Everything else is bone stock and came with the motor - $0.00
Machine work on Head - $250 - ported by me
Machine work on Block - $0.00 - honed and cleaned by me
Trans - used 727 from truck - $0.00
Trans kit - $125.00
Trans rebuild - paid a friend to rebuild it - $50.00
Converter - Used - $0.00

Everything else would be something that would fit a small block and a slant so I didn't jot them down. Like fuel system and such.

Everything listed is $1826.00 and this is to get your Slant into the 10's. This is also running a 100% stock oiling system and a non filled block. Motor has been together for 3 seasons and many street floggings (and knocking) trying to get the A/f ratio correct.

Could have been done even cheaper if you get a used intake, valves, stock valve cover and wires. You also wouldn't need the ARP stuff if you were going to just run in the 12's.

Hope this helps the cause Bill and hope you are feeling better. Later
 
My only concern, and this may be unfounded please prove me wrong if so, is every turbo car I see bracket racing is not very consistent due to spool up and trying to launch at the same rpm every time.
Is there a way to have your cake and eat it too? Can you run a turbo /6 and successively bracket race it round after round?

I can leave the line at just about any boost level. I footbrake my car and it has 4 wheel drums w/o a line lock. It has left the line as high as 23psi and works well at around 10psi. Traction is a bit of an issue with 26x8.5x14 slicks. But still puts down 1.50's 60'. Like any car, you need to get used to it. When I have good air and not chasing down a record time it is pretty consistent. Both of our turbo cars will run within a few hundredths.

Alot of people run to big of a turbo or a chassis that can't handle the power. U-tube is full of them 10 second lag times. Kinda silly but when the power comes on...ufdaa!!! Trick is finding the right turbo combo and fine tuning it. We have all the hot rod engine combos - BB - SB - V10 - Viper - 4cyl turbo - V8 Turbo...but the most fun is hauling off on a BB Chevy with a Slant 6. I found my way to skin this cat. Later
 
Let me stir the pot here. I have been to Dan Dvoracks shop several times lately, helping a bud. According to Dan (how many national records did the man win? ); cast iron is better.
Let another argument start, lol.
 
Basic set up & grocery list:

70 /6 Swinger 80,000 miles $1,200
Engine mods:
340 valve springs and Shims $50
Deep pan $10
Misc gaskets $30
(Engine had 110-120 psi cranking on all cyl to start) At the end when it was in the 11's.. the best cyl had 100 psi and the worst would only muster 70psi)

Trans:
Trans rebuild kit $120 ebay & rebuilt by me.
Used mopar 175k convert $125 ebay
5 clutch drum and low gearset. From trans laying around

Used GN Turbo $250 Turbobuicks.com
Intercooler $100 ebay
Intercooler pipe, clamps, hose $100 ebay.
Cone airfilter $25

Carb:
used 600DP Holley $100 ebay
rebuild kit $40
Intake $50 bought 20 years ago

Exhaust:
Used stock exhaust manifold
Muffler $20
Misc 2.5" pipe & flange $50
Tailpipe $35

Fuel System:
Deep sump $50
Alum fuel line $25
Walbro GSL 392 pump $110 ebay
mallory 4309 regulator $80
Carb hat $175
BOV/pipe $60 ebay
Boost regulator $50
meth injection $200 Devils Own
Misc fittings & filter $100

Ignition;
Points dist
MSD 7A donated
Wires Crane $70
Cap rotor points $20
Champion RN9Yc $6
Relocate battery $75
Gauges $350 (AEM AF=$200 alone)

Leaving soft & Into the 12's @ 3,360 lbs for $3,676. Big learning curve in the beginning. You have never heard detonation until you hear it under boost. It sounded like the block split a few times.

Eventually with more time & tuning, this basic combo went into the 11's. I learned a few things along the way (and turned up the boost).


Eventually Upgraded as the car went faster and as some parts wore out and failed:
Tires
Brakes
Radiator
Rearend
Alternator
driveshaft
 
I can leave the line at just about any boost level. I footbrake my car and it has 4 wheel drums w/o a line lock. It has left the line as high as 23psi and works well at around 10psi. Traction is a bit of an issue with 26x8.5x14 slicks. But still puts down 1.50's 60'. Like any car, you need to get used to it. When I have good air and not chasing down a record time it is pretty consistent. Both of our turbo cars will run within a few hundredths.

Alot of people run to big of a turbo or a chassis that can't handle the power. U-tube is full of them 10 second lag times. Kinda silly but when the power comes on...ufdaa!!! Trick is finding the right turbo combo and fine tuning it. We have all the hot rod engine combos - BB - SB - V10 - Viper - 4cyl turbo - V8 Turbo...but the most fun is hauling off on a BB Chevy with a Slant 6. I found my way to skin this cat. Later

lol!! re: "I found my way to skin this cat.":cheers:

BOY, YOU SURE DID!!!

Talk about bang for the buck.... You and Tom make me ashamed of myself for what we spent on our motor. I haven't kept track, but other than the turbo, itself, the wastegate and intercooler, we bought everything NEW (well, we did buy a ported head with big valves off ebay.)

Even at that, I really don't think we could have built a normally-aspirated small block with the performance capabilities of this motor for any less.

I know it was a lot of work to list everything, and tell what it cost, but Tom and you gave me exactly the information I wanted, and I REALLY appreciate it!!!

Here's wishing both of you a fast and successful 2011. MOPAR to ya...
 
It may or may not be smarter, that's subjective.
Myself, I think that it comes down to most people preferring V-8's.
 
It may or may not be smarter, that's subjective.
Myself, I think that it comes down to most people preferring V-8's.

You're probably right, but WHY do they prefer a V8, if they can go quicker/faster for less money with a turbocharged /6?

Maybe they haven't seen any evidence of that, and it never enters their mind...

Shaker 223's car is a good example of that alternative thinking; a street car with a smooth idle and great driveability, along with workable hiway gears (2.93's) that runs over 120 mph in 11-flat, into a 15 mph headwind, in a 3300-pound car, on its first time out with a new motor.

Lots left... look for some high tens, next time out.

Ryan's '66 Valiant is 300+ pounds lighter, and is running 127, but I am not sure if it's streetable; probably is.

I don't think you can do that with a 360 (normally-aspirated) for the same money...

Just sayin'... If these people who prefer V8's were fully aware of what's possible with a turbo /6, and the cost considerations, they might re-think their engine choices; it's not cheap to go 10's and 127 mph in a small-block A-body.

Not cheap with the /6, either, but possibly cheaper, with some driveability advantages...
 
Actually, 2.76 gears. MPG is still decent too. Never checked it with the new engine because the pedal on the right is so fun to push!!!
 
I hear ya, Bill. What's cooler: A SS/AA, or a whisper smooth turbo'd slant?
They are both waaaay cool in their own element. It's just that more people are attracted to V-8's than 6's.
Back in the 80's, I stood behind Lydon & Johnson's SS/AA Barracuda, while it was idling, unattended, in the staging lanes. Talk about awesome! No 6 cylinder could make me felt like I did listening to that Hemi.
I'm having a hard time making my point. A turbo'd six is fast, and I love seeing different stuff go fast. It's just that people love V-8's more than 6's.
 
Actually, 2.76 gears. MPG is still decent too. Never checked it with the new engine because the pedal on the right is so fun to push!!!

Tom, or Ryan,

I put a limited-slip 3.55 in our '64 Valiant in anticipation of our first run with it. I have a 742 case lying on the floor here, with a 2.76 in it. I was thinking about just adding a spool (no street driving) to replace that 3.55.

What do you think?
 
I know you didn't ask me, but I think it would be a good idea, Bill. Seems to me the higher gear ratio would cause the engine to build more boost. Just my lame brain opinion.
 
I hear ya, Bill. What's cooler: A SS/AA, or a whisper smooth turbo'd slant?
They are both waaaay cool in their own element. It's just that more people are attracted to V-8's than 6's.
Back in the 80's, I stood behind Lydon & Johnson's SS/AA Barracuda, while it was idling, unattended, in the staging lanes. Talk about awesome! No 6 cylinder could make me felt like I did listening to that Hemi.
I'm having a hard time making my point. A turbo'd six is fast, and I love seeing different stuff go fast. It's just that people love V-8's more than 6's.


Well, I'm sure you're right; whatever floats your boat... :cheers:

The sheer novelty of a small, inline 6 going 10s, in a full-size a-body is what floats mine, so maybe I'm a cult of one???:-D

If it can be done more cheaply than with the V8 package, that's just icing on the cake....

Differnt strokes... (4.125" in this case) for different folks...
 
I know you didn't ask me, but I think it would be a good idea, Bill. Seems to me the higher gear ratio would cause the engine to build more boost. Just my lame brain opinion.

Apparently, you're 100-percent keyrect... Ryan and Tom both run final drive numerical ratios in the 2's, by choice...

And, they don't do ANYTHING, unless it's F-A-S-T!!!!
 
well I enjoy many deferent motors. I have a bb charger,a desiel truck ,and a slant turbo,soon to be two. I love all of them but the slant is my favorite.

The slant is in a truck which weighs close to 3700# , and went 11.56@116.
so is it smart ?shure pull your slants then give them to me...since they aren't worth anything to those v8 guys:iconbigg::iconbigg::iconbigg::iconbigg:
 
well I enjoy many deferent motors. I have a bb charger,a desiel truck ,and a slant turbo,soon to be two. I love all of them but the slant is my favorite.

The slant is in a truck which weighs close to 3700# , and went 11.56@116.
so is it smart ?shure pull your slants then give them to me...since they aren't worth anything to those v8 guys:iconbigg::iconbigg::iconbigg::iconbigg:

No way buckwheat. Me and you will have to split um. LOL
 
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