Jeep 4.0 in 69 Barracuda

-
MagnumDust, why do you torment me so. That awlsome picture of the 265 which I want so bad... lol

When I go 265, I will probably go with some thing like what is offered at Fox Engineering...
http://foxinjection.com/

That would give me a fuel injected side draft webber look and feel.
 
dukeboy_318 said:
Before spending money on AJE racing crap, you need to do some serious research on the reviews on their products for mopars.... tons and i mean tons of absolutely horrid reviews by people who have used them.
Click to expand...

I hear what your saying, but it is cost effective for a reason. Not just because they are willing to sell there parts one piece at a time vs as a complete kit for a huge amount of money. And more importantly they are willing to work with my needs and not deny me cause I am installing something other than a big block and want the largest brakes on the market.

People say the same thing about the Dana 30 front axles in my jeeps. And how I am going to break them and how horrible they are. For my usage, they seem to work well and are cost effective. Since everyone thinks they are crap, I get them for cheep and keep on rolling.

My only other option would be to build my own. And even still I would need something for a example. Which at the cost AJE would do that. And this may be a option I follow in the long run after I have the engine in and I decide what I like and don't.
 
JohnFM3 said:
I hear what your saying, but it is cost effective for a reason. Not just because they are willing to sell there parts one piece at a time vs as a complete kit for a huge amount of money. And more importantly they are willing to work with my needs and not deny me cause I am installing something other than a big block and want the largest brakes on the market.

People say the same thing about the Dana 30 front axles in my jeeps. And how I am going to break them and how horrible they are. For my usage, they seem to work well and are cost effective. Since everyone thinks they are crap, I get them for cheep and keep on rolling.

My only other option would be to build my own. And even still I would need something for a example. Which at the cost AJE would do that. And this may be a option I follow in the long run after I have the engine in and I decide what I like and don't.
Click to expand...

I think in this case you'd you just up spending the "huge amount of money" twice. I think you'd be better off just having a shop modify a pan/pickup for center sump until you can spring for a nicer alterkation or HDK.(Don't bother with magnumforce, its junk too)
 
magnumdust said:
I think in this case you'd you just up spending the "huge amount of money" twice. I think you'd be better off just having a shop modify a pan/pickup for center sump until you can spring for a nicer alterkation or HDK.(Don't bother with magnumforce, its junk too)
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion.
 
magnumdust said:
The intake is the big mystery. Obviously we don't if its wider or narrower than the hemi 6 intake/carb setup. However, even if it did get in the way, you could possibly do like the 240z guys when they convert their L28's to efi.(w/o the later efi manifold)
maxresdefault.jpg
Click to expand...

looks a little like the one I fabbed for the slant. EMT runners to a flange off a plenum fed by a TB. Simple and you can tune the runners for your cam intake profile Ramcharger style.
 
Is this project making any headway? Actually kinda interested to see how well this works out.
 
txstang84 said:
Is this project making any headway? Actually kinda interested to see how well this works out.
Click to expand...

This project is on a holding pattern for the time being. My wife and I put a offer on the house behind where we are living. So all project not necessary for cleaning up are being stopped.

I should be picking up the donor Cherokees the end of this month, and yanking the parts out of them. So the first thing when I move in to the new garage, I am pulling the old v8 and starting to get measurements for the new KFame to hold the 4.0L.

Sorry to everyone on the lack of status updates. This house purchase is my first and its taking more time that I thought it would.

Have a Good Weekend,
John
 
Gotcha--home buying is lots of paperwork, but once it's over, all you have to do is keep paying on it
 
So I made my second and final payment for 2 parts cherokee's this weekend. And the person I purchased them from is willing to hold on to them till after the move to the new house. Hopefully it doesnt come to that. I really hope to get them yanked over to my current house this Fri, stripped down over the weekend, and towed out by next weekend. But we will see.

Both cherokee's are from the Renix 4.0L era when GM owned jeep (1988 an 1989). 1 is a 2wd and the other is a 4wd. Though I plan on running the H.O. injection, Electronics, Harness, and ECU, the engine's head will not be swapped out for a H.O. till after fabrication and the project is road worthy.

In a 4cyl to 6 cyl conversion project I tackled on my sisters wrangler, I ended up with a second complete wiring harness. I just need to buy a ECU if I want to keep all Jeep electronics. There is the possibility of selling it all and purchasing a MegaSquirt3 ecu and building my own harness.

I will have a 2wd AW4 4sp auto tranny. Its a real bomb proof tranny which has proven itself time and time again in the trails with the 4wd version. There are threads on this forum of people installing one of the Grand Cherokee's V8 trannys which is a true dodge tranny. I may use the AW4 for trade an see what I can get out of that.

Another thing I grabbed which may be beneficial (or not), a Grand Cherokee Dana 44 with 3.73 gears. The bonus is its already setup for 4 link suspension. The draw back is it has a Aluminum Diff with steel axle tubes. Those of you who wheel would understand the issue. When off camber and side loading the axle, you run the risk of blowing the opposite carrier bearing thru the diff. I suspect that a much lighter vehicle such as a Mopar A-body (when compared to a fully off road capable ZJ or XJ) will not have much to worry about.

The last thing I have as a result of this purchase is a couple of usable drive lines now.

The best part of all this, as I noted above I have 2 engines. My 92 Wrangler is getting a replacement engine now as the one I am pulling out has well over 300K miles on it and has given up the oil pressure.
 
I think there are a couple threads in the drivetrain section about using Dana 44s out of Jeeps in A bodies...funny part is, many people in the Jeep world buy Ford 8.8s to retrofit the 44s...there's another thread about that and the swap is becoming a little more commonplace from what I can tell.
 
txstang84 said:
I think there are a couple threads in the drivetrain section about using Dana 44s out of Jeeps in A bodies...funny part is, many people in the Jeep world buy Ford 8.8s to retrofit the 44s...there's another thread about that and the swap is becoming a little more commonplace from what I can tell.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I got a 8.8 with 3.73 gears and limited slip with drum brakes in my 92 wrangler. Cut the old leaf spring purches off, and weld on the new ones. Done.Only real difference is the 5/8 of an inch narrower on each side as compared to a factory rear axle. And since I ran the drum setup, the ebrake worked out correctly with out having to rig it.

As I understand it, the main reason for going to the 8.8 was that Jeep had very few rigs with D44s other than the Full Size stuff. And with Width Restrictions in Washington becoming more common place, seeing Wranglers with full width axles is getting to be rare more than normal. So its easier and cheaper (IMO) to just up grade to a 8.8 (which has the same bolt pattern (5x4.5) and similar gear options rather than try an locate a properly sized D44 or pay to shorten a full size D44.

Again, this is more just my observation and opinion.
 
Totally understandable...if you're the type that doesn't mind reusing gears you can find basically whatever ratio you want either from a truck, Mustang, Explorer--whatever. Man, I'm growing some interest to see how this works out--seems like an easy way to gain some cubes for sixer guys out there without having to swap over to a V8, and getting the trans with it is a bonus. Those 4.0s are just as indestructible as any 225, plenty powerful, came with a solid EFI setup, and they were built en masse until 2006...even eBay doesn't seem too bad on scalping.
 
txstang84 said:
Totally understandable...if you're the type that doesn't mind reusing gears you can find basically whatever ratio you want either from a truck, Mustang, Explorer--whatever. Man, I'm growing some interest to see how this works out--seems like an easy way to gain some cubes for sixer guys out there without having to swap over to a V8, and getting the trans with it is a bonus. Those 4.0s are just as indestructible as any 225, plenty powerful, came with a solid EFI setup, and they were built en masse until 2006...even eBay doesn't seem too bad on scalping.
Click to expand...

What got me thinking down this path is partially the fact that the last several years I have been working on nothing but jeep with 4.0's, and I have gotten quite familiar with them. The other thing is I have already built 2 slant six's. One stock, and the other a custom build while working at the machine shop where the work was done. I was able to pull consistent Mid 13's.

If I wanted this Barracuda to end up with a slant six, I would go thru the effort and build a EFI slant six. But my end desire is the Aussie 265 Hemi In Line 6. No reason to fab up EFI for 225 only to need to redo it for the 265. Going the Jeep 4.0 route means no fab work, bolt on and run. I can enjoy the car and restore the rest of the car while building a 265. The Jeep ECU is batch fire and fairly simplistic. Should be more than enough to drive the 265. And with after-market re programming, the options are limitless. Further more, the jeep harness should be long enough and look good on that 265. As if it belongs there. I just dont see a 265 in my near future, probably 5 yrs out. So I am thinking with this route I can enjoy the car and continue working on it along the way.

Besides, has any one here heard a Stroked Out (4.7 or 4.9L) jeep inline 6? I just did recently at the local store, OMG. I thought for sure the owner had installed a new hemi in his 2004 TJ. It sounded good. And lets not forget, that the Jeep engine is pushing around 5000 pounds of vehicle, and doing so easily. The Cherokees are getting and easy 19MPG while doing so with the larger tires such as the 32's (such as the one I own). This Barracuda should be no problem for that 4.0, even as a stock engine.

I will keep everyone posted. Looking forward to pulling the original v8 (318 I think) and tranny out and starting to get measurements. Hopefully by the end of July to mid Aug.

:cheers:
 
Besides, has any one here heard a Stroked Out (4.7 or 4.9L) jeep inline 6?
Click to expand...

Yes :)

I used to hang out with a handful of Jeep folks...most of them were just as broke (financially) as any of the other gearheads and only talked about the things they wanted to do with their Jeeps...just like all the rest of us.
 
txstang84 said:
Yes :)

I used to hang out with a handful of Jeep folks...most of them were just as broke (financially) as any of the other gearheads and only talked about the things they wanted to do with their Jeeps...just like all the rest of us.
Click to expand...

You then know what Jeep Stands for... its a toss up between Just Expect Endless Problems and Just Empty Every Pocket. In a way you could almost refer to my barracuda as a Jeep as it will have Just Everybody Else's Parts.

Worst thing about a Jeep is that its never finished. Unlike other cars gear heads work on, a Jeep is never done.

Most of the Jeep owners I hang out with are mildly built. Cherokee's with 4 inches of lift and 32 or 33 inch tires. Most of them with more of a budget build with less than $5k invested including purchase price. But everyone of them are looking forward to this build. I am almost tempted to throw a thread on the JeepForum.
 
I knew 2 of the 3 you mentioned...just everybody else's parts, and just empty every pocket--although, I've experienced the last one too...just expect endless problems. A friend's '82 CJ7 absolutely ATE a left front hub on one weekend. Turns out he didn't fully wash out some debris after a rather extended trip in the mud...then we drove it about 400 miles to visit some friends of mine...there went about $500 for new hub, new rotor, new caliper, pads, etc.

The other time, he had to buy conversion axles for his AMC 20 rear end--the factory style are a two piece design and the conversion axles are one piece, but they aren't cheap...I think he sold it before actually getting around to changing them...at a loss of course.

Then, one of my roommates used to have an '89 YJ...4" lift, wheels/tires...needed the double jointed rear driveshaft, but never got around to it. Then we swapped an AMC 304 in it, installed an EFI conversion...I don't think the stock A999 trans liked that though...it ALWAYS ran hot and damn near boiled over one weekend just towing a frikkin sea doo to the local lake...constant problems. Hindsight being 20/20, we should've just rodded the carbed 4.2 that was installed ('89 was the last year for the 4.2, IIRC)

By comparison, the Cherokee guys I knew had far fewer issues but they didn't ride theirs' anywhere near as hard.

I can't wait to see how this works out because I think that 6 ought to be a great engine for a Barracuda--especially if you put some goodies into it. If it can move a 4200lb Wrangler around with that level of authority, a 3200lb A body should be fun to drive.
 
txstang84 said:
If it can move a 4200lb Wrangler around with that level of authority, a 3200lb A body should be fun to drive.
Click to expand...

This is my thought as well, even with out the goodies I think I will have more then enough to move the Barracuda down a quarter mile strip respectively. And I am hoping to be more at the 2700 pound range. I am not going to have full interior. This car is dang near stripped right now as it is.

Up until now I had planned on running the stock single exhaust manifold. For those who don't know jeeps, they run a piped exhaust manifold on the inline 6, not a cast iron. My thought on this has changed, as I found out that the TJs (97 thru 2004) had a option for dual 3 into 1 manifolds. They were cast iron, but I have found that decent (non tuned pipe) aftermarket piped replacements are only around the $300 to $400 range. And a good set of matched tuned pipes are around $800 ish. My ECU is not capable of reading dual O2 sensors, but that shouldn't matter after the engine is warmed up with the 94/95 YJ ECU I plan on running. So just having 1 O2 sensor on the back half should be ok.
 
Damn-2700lbs? Yes, that 4.0 ought to move it along smartly!

It should be just fine with a single, and yeah a decent header shouldn't cost all that much--I think even the stainless ones are in the reasonable price range, whether or not they'll interfere with your T bar or steering parts remains to be seen though.
 
...horseshit...a sherman tank V8 has been shoehorned into a '70 Mustang before...a 5.9 Cummins will fit...it might not be pretty, and you'd have to do some serious engineering, but it can fit. That being said, if you wanted to drop a diesel in a Dart, use a 4BT...smaller, only weighs as much as a big block, and you wouldn't have to do quite as much to get it in there.
 
tarvin890 said:
wow nice! id like to do a 5.9 2nd gen diesel in my dart....wont fit...
Click to expand...

txstang84 said:
It should be just fine with a single, and yeah a decent header shouldn't cost all that much--I think even the stainless ones are in the reasonable price range, whether or not they'll interfere with your T bar or steering parts remains to be seen though.
Click to expand...

Tarvin, if I was going to go that route, I would be running a proven nimble VW TDi engine. Look at what that engine has to push around. A 4500 pound sedan (assuming 2014 Jetta which I own) with more than enough power and performance. And it would be much lighter in the engine compartment than any mopar motor. There is a thread on TDIForum where a guy put a TDi in a Gen 1 Jeep liberty with great success. Even keeping the jeep 4wd.

TxStang, as much as I know it would be just fine with a single pipe exhaust system (as all my jeeps run 2.5 inch Flowmaster with High Flow Cat), could you imagine a dual exhaust manifold with Siamese 2 inch or 1.75 inch exhaust going all the way back. And if I want to be really creative in the end, relocate the fuel tank and bring the exhaust out the middle of the rear.
 
So not to get too geeky here, but the Surface Area of a 2.5 inch exhaust system is 4.9 inches. The Surface Area of a single 1.75 inch exhaust system is 2.4 inches. So a Siamese dual 1.75 inch system would be just a hair off of what a single 2.5 inch exhaust system at 4.8 inches. The presentation of of a Siamese system would absolutely killer, and the main benefit would probably be clearance.
 
JohnFM3 said:
Tarvin, if I was going to go that route, I would be running a proven nimble VW TDi engine. Look at what that engine has to push around. A 4500 pound sedan (assuming 2014 Jetta which I own) with more than enough power and performance. And it would be much lighter in the engine compartment than any mopar motor. There is a thread on TDIForum where a guy put a TDi in a Gen 1 Jeep liberty with great success. Even keeping the jeep 4wd.

TxStang, as much as I know it would be just fine with a single pipe exhaust system (as all my jeeps run 2.5 inch Flowmaster with High Flow Cat), could you imagine a dual exhaust manifold with Siamese 2 inch or 1.75 inch exhaust going all the way back. And if I want to be really creative in the end, relocate the fuel tank and bring the exhaust out the middle of the rear.
Click to expand...

thatd be cool too...would actually fit also... lol
 
Sorry--been away from this forum for a minute--Yeah, that would work, I'm just thinking that a couple sticks of 2.5" pipe would be cheaper than 4 sticks of 1.75" pipe...BUT, it's your car, and as evidenced by other people on other threads, I'm not allowed to openly ponder or wonder about the reality or viability of your choices.
 
txstang84 said:
Sorry--been away from this forum for a minute--Yeah, that would work, I'm just thinking that a couple sticks of 2.5" pipe would be cheaper than 4 sticks of 1.75" pipe...BUT, it's your car, and as evidenced by other people on other threads, I'm not allowed to openly ponder or wonder about the reality or viability of your choices.
Click to expand...

Forgive me, I think I had not explained myself well enough. Assuming I can figure out the O2 sensor setup for a dual manifold exhaust system, I am talking about only 2 sticks of 1.75 inch pips. Not 2 per manifold. One 1.75 inch pipe per manifold should be more than enough flow as compared to a single 2.5 inch exhaust system.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top