Lets talk about what you want to see in a Gen III aftermarket Block?

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Johnny Mac

Johnny Mac

www.blueprintengines.com
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Would love to hear what my resident hemi engine builders would like to see in an aftermarket, designed from scratch, gen III engine block?

Splayed mains vs the 2/4 cross volts?
Extended cylinder bores?
Let's hear it! All ideas welcome.
 
How bout lets get some new slant 6 blocks cast before all that junk? lol
 
RustyRatRod said:
How bout lets get some new slant 6 blocks cast before all that junk? lol
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You get out of here. Lol I need to build things people don't already give away for free

:rofl:
 
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I'm not sure how many members we have here that have built gen III's. The BGE block is very Stout in stock form. But always room for improvement. I have a nice list going already from my own experience, but I'm sure I don't know it all ;)
 
The Dart Hemi aftermarket block looked like a nice piece, but I don’t know if it has ever came to fruition yet. But I did see Garlit’s Swamp Rat VII
Don Garlits Swamp Rat Dragster - Big's New Digger - Hot Rod Magazine
run during a Cackle Fest at Bristol on a high load of Nitromethane.
While he didn’t make a full pass because of concerns from his wife at the time, the over 700 feet he did run was pretty impressive. I think if Chrysler hadn’t changed hands again that it’s possible that billet reiterations of the Third Gen could have replaced the Second Gen in Fuel racing along with some weight reduction to reel the ET’s and top speeds back in. If that had happened, I think it might also be possible fuel cars might still be racing the full 1320. Of course, it would have been disadvantageous for a lot of teams to have to start over with all new parts and designs. But it’s not like NHRA has cared (especially with some corporate leveraging!) about that sort of thing. I mostly get a good chuckle thinking about the reaction some of the blue blood purists would have if it had happened to have went that way! But in all honesty, I don’t think anyone has fully tapped the potential available in N/A form in a Third Gen yet. Just too easy to add boost to and go fast like with other brand X junkyard engines…
 
Garrett Ellison said:
The Dart Hemi aftermarket block looked like a nice piece, but I don’t know if it has ever came to fruition yet. But I did see Garlit’s Swamp Rat VII
Don Garlits Swamp Rat Dragster - Big's New Digger - Hot Rod Magazine
run during a Cackle Fest at Bristol on a high load of Nitromethane.
While he didn’t make a full pass because of concerns from his wife at the time, the over 700 feet he did run was pretty impressive. I think if Chrysler hadn’t changed hands again that it’s possible that billet reiterations of the Third Gen could have replaced the Second Gen in Fuel racing along with some weight reduction to reel the ET’s and top speeds back in. If that had happened, I think it might also be possible fuel cars might still be racing the full 1320. Of course, it would have been disadvantageous for a lot of teams to have to start over with all new parts and designs. But it’s not like NHRA has cared (especially with some corporate leveraging!) about that sort of thing. I mostly get a good chuckle thinking about the reaction some of the blue blood purists would have if it had happened to have went that way! But in all honesty, I don’t think anyone has fully tapped the potential available in N/A form in a Third Gen yet. Just too easy to add boost to and go fast like with other brand X junkyard engines…
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Yeah I have yet to see a dart actually exist outside of a few displays At sema/pri. I have heard rumors it wasn't much more than a BGE with spayed 4 bolt mains. But I can't confirm that.
 
What I would like to see in an aftermarket block is just plain AVAILABILITY. I looked at the Dart block at PRI this year. Nice looking piece. Rep I talked to said there were three out in the hands of shops waiting to go on dyno for testing. One of the more important things would be cylinder thickness and how it ties to the rest of the block to accept high loads of pressure. Maybe even something that would have an accepted part number for NHRA class racing. Now I'll really go off the deep end and mention an affordable alloy block.....
 
RustyRatRod said:
How bout lets get some new slant 6 blocks cast before all that junk? lol
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I'd be thinking an affordable siamese low deck big block would be better suited than a modern hemi.
The junk yards are full of hemi engines.
An aluminum slant six would be nice too.
 
motorpirate said:
How about provisions for LA motor mounts??
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That I will look at....never crossed my mind! May not be able to as the ears may interfere with the gen III fitment/architecture. But I will look!
 
I would like to see the lifter bores be moved so there isn't the misalignment of the push rods. Camshaft bore enlarged to make room for a larger cam to accommodate higher than 660+ plus lift. Thicker bores to allow for larger cu in displacement and strength. Six bolt mains would be nice.
 
I'll preface by saying I will never be a buyer of an aftermarket block. This is strictly because I'll never build anything that requires additional strength beyond factory blocks. That info aside, I suggest 2 things. Aluminum block, and both Chrysler and Chevy bellhousing bolt pattern. Aluminum is self explanatory. Almost all high level racers that would use an aftermarket block use a GM based transmission. Why not simplify things for your future customer and give them the ability to use a standard GM housing without an adapter housing. This allows them to have easy access to buy something from someone if they have a failure at an event. I'm sure I'll get hate for this recommendation, but in reality, how many people running 8s or faster with a gen 3 hemi use a Chrysler trans?
 
racerjoe said:
I'll preface by saying I will never be a buyer of an aftermarket block. This is strictly because I'll never build anything that requires additional strength beyond factory blocks. That info aside, I suggest 2 things. Aluminum block, and both Chrysler and Chevy bellhousing bolt pattern. Aluminum is self explanatory. Almost all high level racers that would use an aftermarket block use a GM based transmission. Why not simplify things for your future customer and give them the ability to use a standard GM housing without an adapter housing. This allows them to have easy access to buy something from someone if they have a failure at an event. I'm sure I'll get hate for this recommendation, but in reality, how many people running 8s or faster with a gen 3 hemi use a Chrysler trans?
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Thats a great suggestion. we could cast the material in, and just make it a machining change for the bell.
 
Johnny Mac said:
we could cast the material in, and just make it a machining change for the bell.
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That makes a lot of sense. Depending on how the patterns layout, maybe offer it as an either or both option in case someone wants the option down the road (start with a 727 but swap to a GM trans later).

And I would guess that it wouldn't just be racers that would want that. Seems like the 4L60/65/80 is a pretty popular trans, or even the 200R4, so I could see it being a popular option for an G3/4L65E. Unless the 8HP70 because easier to swap.
 
I've seen lots of comments about the full skirt block costing power (ok, I've seen one guy make the same comment multiple times). I struggle to see how a skirted block hurts power when a non-skirted one with an oil pan doesn't, but I'm no expert. Maybe something to look at though?

Sure seems like the skirted block with cross bolts is partly why the OEM blocks can hold the power they do so not sure it is a worthwhile direction. Just tossing it out there.
 
DionR said:
That makes a lot of sense. Depending on how the patterns layout, maybe offer it as an either or both option in case someone wants the option down the road (start with a 727 but swap to a GM trans later).

And I would guess that it wouldn't just be racers that would want that. Seems like the 4L60/65/80 is a pretty popular trans, or even the 200R4, so I could see it being a popular option for an G3/4L65E. Unless the 8HP70 because easier to swap.
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Honestly, if I were to start a new build that was a cruiser, I'd use the 4L80 trans with a G3. The 4L80 is easy to control with a Holley, and you don't have to deal with all the silly nuances the modern Chrysler transmissions have. The biggest ones being you have to use the factory shifter and then there's only 1 company that supports the control system from a stand alone prospective. Let's not forget the aftermarket support for the 4L80.
 
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