Motorhome 440's... factory seconds?

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RustyDusty

RustyDusty

Rabid Cross-eyed Opossum!
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I was talking with a mechanic at work who is a big mopar fan. He was telling me something I had never heard... motor home 440s are typically factory seconds. He said if they screwed up and had to repour the block and other things like that it found it's way to a motor home. Is this common knowledge that I've just missed? Or just heresy?

Cheers!
Drake
 
I doubt they would take some kind of factory second, stick it in a vehicle that is 3x the weight and still put a warranty on it.

I think you are being told a tall tail.
 
Perhaps there's a kernel of truth there? I tore a 1970 440 core down recently of unknown origin. The "VIN" stamped on the skirt of the block was a very short number - not like a typical VIN at all. Pad was stamped for undersized journals. I figured the engine was either a warranty replacement or came out of a motor home.
 
would be pretty shocking ! think how hard your "pulling" vehicle has to work. with my cummins i always wonder how it can run for 20 straight hours (except fuel ups) and not even have a hicup. my race car has to do maybe 10-12 1/8 mile passes a day and i'm worried about it ?
 
Know I've seen 440's out of big Chrysler's that have had there main and rod bearing journals turned under sized.
 
I kind of doubt it myself. Imagine a dealerships bays full of motor homes that needed the engine pulled. As some general info, many of these 440's came with heads (202's?), that were drilled with an extra hole for better cooling. In some ways they were better. I would guess they had a different cam for better pulling at the lower end.
 
The 440 in my coronet is a 78 model from a motorhome. Typically the casting number was 440-3 or similiar. Mine uses the smaller plugs and has the extra cooling holes around the spark plug holes. The cylinder head casting number end in 452. Having foundry experience i doubt the repoured any castings. they would have just re melted them.
 
I work in a large Foundry that pours parts for Subs and Aircraft carriers. If there is a problem in the metal content or mold or core issue, the part is scrapped. End of story. if the part continues thru the process and any defect is found, it is repaired. if the defect is above specs, the part is scrapped. I would find it hard to believe that any car manufacturer would past on problem casting that didn't meet specs. Rest assured that every member on here that has a family member that sails on a U.S. Navy vessel it is as perfect as humans can make it. No matter if the cast part is as big as a truck or as small as a pack of cigarettes....
 
va58 said:
I work in a large Foundry that pours parts for Subs and Aircraft carriers. If there is a problem in the metal content or mold or core issue, the part is scrapped. End of story. if the part continues thru the process and any defect is found, it is repaired. if the defect is above specs, the part is scrapped. I would find it hard to believe that any car manufacturer would past on problem casting that didn't meet specs. Rest assured that every member on here that has a family member that sails on a U.S. Navy vessel it is as perfect as humans can make it. No matter if the cast part is as big as a truck or as small as a pack of cigarettes....
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That is the exact way it was when I worked for Mercruiser.
 
Mopar to ya said:
I have a hard time believing they would put a factory second in any vehicle, much less a hard use motorhome.
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i agree, those things are built to run for hundreds of miles at a time. if anything , they got some of the best of everything.
 
and Elvis is alive selling Yugo's in Momtana...when You drive mopars, I expect stupid crap like that from the envious chevy and ford owners......
 
I do NOT want what this chap is smoking!!! There would be NO WAY that a block would be re-cast, and undersized journals and such were much more commonplace than one would think. I have an entire page of symbols to indicate a myriad of different undersized components that you may come across when decoding engines and stuff!! Everything from oversized cylinder bores to undersized valve stems to oversized lifter bores and everything in between.

Next time he passes the pipe your way, tell him to keep it right on going!!! Geof
 
I guess it depends on how you define factory second or how the OP defines a "re-poured" block. Obviously you can't re-pour one once it's been poured but you can pour a new one. Personally, If the factory screwed up a casting or machine work and then did what was required so they wouldn't have to scrap the part (ie: bore it oversize, grind the journals smaller, etc) - then to me, that's a second. Doesn't mean it's not usable but it's still second. Many would agree that Chrylser had some of the worst machining in the industry back in the day. Anything to save a nickel. Motorhome engines may have had different engineering specs but I have a hard time believing they got top of the line production parts. Not saying they got seconds or rejects as a matter of policy either. My point is, anything's possible.

I bought NOS plastic trim parts for my projects from the dealer back in the 80's and there's no question, they were seconds because of defects found. Still usable but they wouldn't have found their way into a production line vehicle.
 
I think you have a point 70 Duster, but even the HP motors will have undersized journals, overbores and anything that will get the motor done and into a vehicle. There is absolutely nothing wrong with undersized machining, bearings or anything else that may have had to be done to a motor to get it finished. As quick as assemblies had to be finished at put together, it's no wonder why stuff was put together in such a manner.

And don't think for a minute that the best parts were put on the line and the seconds ended up on dealer parts shelves. QC was bad all across the board back then, and ill-fitting parts were used all the time, on the line and in the repair dealership. Take a look at how hastily a Superbird is put together. Some original paint cars have primer showing right through the very thin overcoat, paint runs everywhere, and such poor fit and finish it would be scrapped out today!! I've seen rear window plugs with as little as 4-5 tackwelds holding them in place. You'd thing a high profile car such as this would get the full treatment, not the other way around, but it was get it down the line and sold and we'll fix it later, IF we HAVE to!!! Geof
 
In the late 60's,, mopar had a crankshaft supply problem,.. sent out a lotta motors with .001 under, from factory, seems to me there wew a few .002 under journals as well, true....
 
I worked in an automotive machine shop from 70 to 73. The local Chrysler-Plymouth dealership handled repairs on all the state police cars. They would bring piston-rod assemblies to me to press apart and replace the rod. The guy from the dealer told me that the majority of the 440s in these cars had oversize cylinder bores.
 
Purple Haze said:
Know I've seen 440's out of big Chrysler's that have had there main and rod bearing journals turned under sized.
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my low buck just dont give a f--k has 20 under mains and rods:D and i dont think anybody has ever been in it. the bearings had .020 and 75 stamped on them.. .still had the thin head gasket that has left the mopar name in the deck when removed8-)
 
I have a '73 440 out of a large class 3 Motorhome. the Crankshaft counterweights have 1/2"-3/4" wide and deep V cuts into them. Huge ! I know they did this for ballancing, but WOW ! I took pictures. never seen that big a cuts !
 
My first car, a 72 Gold Duster. had a maltese cross next to the serial numbers on the block. It's a good thing I looked it up because it meant that the rods were turned 10 under.
 
Had a 78 power wagon with a factory 440 in it and it had undersized rods. I have a hard time beleiving they'd put a "second" motor in a motorhome, considering the rough life and severe abuse these vehicles saw. Cracked manifolds were very common, as the heat had no way to get out of the engine compartment,
 
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