New QA1 UCA's on my 70 Duster. Passenger side doesn't have enough camber

-
RockinRobin

RockinRobin

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 15, 2013
Messages
1,424
Reaction score
1,140
Location
Corsicana, Tx
Bought QA1 upper control arms in November for my drag car. Called QA1 and told them I have the small ball joints. They said I need to buy part #52303, which I did. They never asked me if the K member was slant 6 or V8. It is V8. Took it to the Alignment shop yesterday. Tech says the driver's side aligned just fine but the passenger side runs out of adjustment when trying to set camber. He says the control arm is too short. Top of tire is tilted in a couple of degrees. Tried to call QA1 but they are closed on Saturdays. Any suggestions? Doesn't somebody make a camber bolt with a larger eccentric for more adjustment?
 
This maybe? from instructions- 3. QA1 also offers: Eccentric Camber Bolt Adjusters (P/N 52361) for the Mopar A/B/E Body cars,
 
I found with my cars that it is tough to get a alignment done as the way things are today. It has to be programmed int her alignment machine or they don't know how to set it up. You need a Old school tech that has done these cars in the past with no alignment racks with computerization. I had one guy tell me he couldn't align mine because i changed it to power steering from manual. Flat out told me impossible to do. I just took it to a Old school tech and got it setup.
 
What is the rest of the front suspension? Adjustable strut rods? Factory? Did you.give him alignment specks from the scosh chart?
 
hemifiedbird said:
I found with my cars that it is tough to get a alignment done as the way things are today. It has to be programmed int her alignment machine or they don't know how to set it up. You need a Old school tech that has done these cars in the past with no alignment racks with computerization. I had one guy tell me he couldn't align mine because i changed it to power steering from manual. Flat out told me impossible to do. I just took it to a Old school tech and got it setup.
Click to expand...

RockinRobin said:
The rest of the suspension is factory. The alignment specs are what was in his machine.
Click to expand...

THAT could be the problem. I don't care what any other mechanic thinks, on the matter of alignments....if they all abide by a prepackaged set of published specs that everyone has, they will all be wrong.

Align.gif


The numbers above are a decent starting point. There is such a lack of understanding on the matter of alignments. These cars were built with skinny bias ply tires that almost nobody uses anymore, Radial tires give better ride, handling and wear. Even if this car is a dedicated drag car, you can benefit from more caster and less camber than stock.
 
Those QA1 uppers are designed to move the upper ball joint back for high speed stability. If he's using stock specs he may not be able to get the upper eccentric to work. But as pointed out you don't want stock specs. Use the skosh chart and put a jack under the K frame and jack the car up an inch from the rest position. This is closer to where the front end will be when your doing top speed.
 
RockinRobin said:
Bought QA1 upper control arms in November for my drag car. Called QA1 and told them I have the small ball joints. They said I need to buy part #52303, which I did. They never asked me if the K member was slant 6 or V8. It is V8. Took it to the Alignment shop yesterday. Tech says the driver's side aligned just fine but the passenger side runs out of adjustment when trying to set camber. He says the control arm is too short. Top of tire is tilted in a couple of degrees. Tried to call QA1 but they are closed on Saturdays. Any suggestions? Doesn't somebody make a camber bolt with a larger eccentric for more adjustment?
Click to expand...
If the UCAs are not the same length, return them for exchange. Otherwise, set the passenger side camber first, no extra caster for max camber, then make the driver's side the same as the passenger side. I guess that is what they did but I also guess that you don't know what they set it to.

If the alignment is still a problem, order offset bushings to go in both sides and repeat the process above. If nobody makes offset bushes for the QA1 UCAs, have a machine shop turn nylon rod stock and drill the hole offset.
 
RockinRobin said:
The rest of the suspension is factory. The alignment specs are what was in his machine.
Click to expand...

So, the factory specs that are for bias ply tires, and call for positive camber and negative caster. Or, in other words, the exact specs that the QA1 UCA’s are manufactured to correct.

The design of the QA1 UCA’s adds positive caster, and allows for negative camber at the same time. The specs you need to use when you have radial tires. Those UCA’s were specifically designed NOT to run factory specs, which is why that shop can’t get to the factory specs with them.

Use the SKOSH chart, if they won’t then find a different shop.
 
RockinRobin said:
Bought QA1 upper control arms in November for my drag car. Called QA1 and told them I have the small ball joints. They said I need to buy part #52303, which I did. They never asked me if the K member was slant 6 or V8. It is V8. Took it to the Alignment shop yesterday. Tech says the driver's side aligned just fine but the passenger side runs out of adjustment when trying to set camber. He says the control arm is too short. Top of tire is tilted in a couple of degrees. Tried to call QA1 but they are closed on Saturdays. Any suggestions? Doesn't somebody make a camber bolt with a larger eccentric for more adjustment?
Click to expand...
I find it hard to believe that the control arm is too short. If that assertion is true, then the tech should back it up with Steering Axis Inclination measurements. They did measure SAI... right?
 
Bodyperson said:
I find it hard to believe that the control arm is too short. If that assertion is true, then the tech should back it up with Steering Axis Inclination measurements. They did measure SAI... right?
Click to expand...

Right?!

The funny thing is, there’s more than one thread here where an alignment tech told someone their control arm was too short. I’m not sure what they’re teaching these techs, but I’m pretty sure “your control arm is too short” is slang for “I can’t get the machine to turn the little box on the monitor green”.

But it doesn’t help that the machine is trying to get them to dial in +.5° of camber and -1° caster so your car drives like a shopping cart with radials on it. Especially when you have aftermarket UCA’s that are designed so you can have -.5° camber and +4° caster.
 
72bluNblu said:
Right?!

The funny thing is, there’s more than one thread here where an alignment tech told someone their control arm was too short. I’m not sure what they’re teaching these techs, but I’m pretty sure “your control arm is too short” is slang for “I can’t get the machine to turn the little box on the monitor green”.

But it doesn’t help that the machine is trying to get them to dial in +.5° of camber and -1° caster so your car drives like a shopping cart with radials on it. Especially when you have aftermarket UCA’s that are designed so you can have -.5° camber and +4° caster.
Click to expand...
I cant believe modern alignment equipment even have the specs for these old cars to compare to. We always had to build custom specs to do that but I just read them straight from the live screen and remeasured. Educated guess. I never did get very accurate results with the "green box"
 
Bodyperson said:
I cant believe modern alignment equipment even have the specs for these old cars to compare to. We always had to build custom specs to do that but I just read them straight from the live screen and remeasured. Educated guess. I never did get very accurate results with the "green box"
Click to expand...

Used to be you had to buy the specifications book that went with the machine and then buy updated books when new models came out. But they digitized those manuals decades ago so now they’re just uploaded with the software. And they’re basically just text files so the entire history of automotive alignment specs could probably upload in a couple minutes.

Wouldn’t surprise me if some of the software didn’t have specs that went back that far, but if it’s in the computer it’s pretty much guaranteed to be original factory specs.

Nowadays pretty much all of it looks like this, and the techs just turn bolts until it goes from red to green (borrowed from another thread)
IMG_8463.jpeg


They’re not learning suspension theory, and there’s a good chance none of them know that some of the specs in that computer for passenger cars are for bias ply tires, because it’s unlikely any of them are old enough to know bias ply tires were factory equipment in the ‘70’s. Much less know that the alignment specs are different for a radials than bias ply’s, let alone WHY they are.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top