Probably a Dumb 318 Question

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junkyardhero said:
367... isn't that like just a .030 over 360?
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.040

Nice engine package I’d say.
But it’s not a 318 nor is he helping a guy out with his 318, again.

He lives to boost over and over again while telling people that basically, they are stupid for doing a 318.

So nice to see a helping hand (SARCASM!!!) from this guy.

Seriously folks, I don’t care if you hate me, at least I’m not a lier, I’m a straight shooter, I’m honest with you and I won’t pull a punch to save your feelings. At least it happens on the internet and not live in front of your friends family neighbors and worst of all, the hot rod community where you’ll not live down your embarrassing build.

Come here to learn and get help before you do something crazy.

I’m not going to sit here and lecture you on my greatness because it does t exist. But my experience does and I’ll tell you what I have discovered and learned before you make a mistake I did or know that someone did or the obvious mistake takes place.

Honestly AJ’s build is nice but it’s not helping the OP with his 318 now is it?

Since it’s not, why bother posting non helpful crap about your engine which is not a 318?

Boosting and gloating from a blowhard my way is great and your way sucks guys? Someone now ladies and gents. As if we do t get enough **** shoveled down our throat from politicians!

I sit here very calmly 99% of the time trying to help and call out the BS only to be labeled something I’m not (IDGAF REALLY!) by people who want to matter because they need the attention or something else.
 
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junkyardhero said:
going in a different direction: have you cast all the other supporting actors in this production? transmission, stall, rear end, brakes, suspension?

because if you're still in the pre-planning stages... there's better money spent elsewhere than **** hot 318 build parts. which, don't get me wrong, i loves me some 318... but no sense in building out a rickey racer when nothing around it works or lets you take advantage of that new found power.

and yeah, that cam is vomitus maximus.

ETA: what's your budget?
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Going with 8.25 I got already there front discs 3.73 gears kyb gas a just
 
The cam is here sitting next to my bed so I’ll just run with it here is the card

IMG_6182.jpeg
 
Running 727 3200 stall just need to find a converter used or new don’t care as for the rods the 340 ones I picked up for $120 they’re sitting next to my laundry bin heads speedmaster 2.02 intake 1.88 exhaust heads on there way got em for $750 for the pair no complaints will see what can be done with them.
 
Joey N said:
Running 727 3200 stall just need to find a converter used or new don’t care as for the rods the 340 ones I picked up for $120 they’re sitting next to my laundry bin heads speedmaster 2.02 intake 1.88 exhaust heads on there way got em for $750 for the pair no complaints will see what can be done with them.
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Best of luck to and wishes your way buddy. Enjoy that build and run that bad boy hard.

Work the 330 rods the best you can.
Prep the SM heads well.
 
Uh oh will the 112lsa cam profile not be roudy at all will it be embarrassing :)
 
Joey N said:
Uh oh will the 112lsa cam profile not be roudy at all will it be embarrassing :)
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i mean, it's gonna have way more lope than a stock cam.

but that's a bunch of duration and lift that you're gonna need gears and stall for. i think you have the compression covered, probably.

i share rumble's sentiment that the cam is poor match for the rest of the combination.
 
Joey N said:
Uh oh will the 112lsa cam profile not be roudy at all will it be embarrassing :)
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A stock LSA is 114, at 112, it’ll still sound smooth, but not stock. Don’t worry about it, run it and have fun.

110 is the typical cam that has a chop sound to the idle.

The .500 lift is not Taking advantage of the cylinder heads air flow capabilities. You could port the 318 head, save money, out flow the SM heads and make more power.

The duration is fine. You’ll make power up to approximately 5500.
If you strip test it. Shift there and run again. Shift 300 rpm later. Check et & speeds. Try again and shift at 6K. Check et and speeds. Rinse and repeat at different rpm’s.

It’ll be a fun engine. Worry not.

Go to YouTube and search Charlie Servidio where he ports cylinder heads. He has done 318 heads and will show flow test results.
 
I'll chip this in before this thread turns into a complete **** show:
A lot of guys will jump on the "get a 340/360" bandwagon - which is good advice if you are shopping for a motor to build up BUT you already have the 318, so i say go for it.
Also God help you if dartswinger70 reads this - it will turn into endless posts about UTG (totally unrelated) and how 318s can only ever be the 200ish HP engines that they were from factory and its pointless to try to do anything with them :BangHead:
You might get more usable info asking how to build X HP per CI than how do I build a XXXHP 318. A 400hp 318 is 1.24HP/CI at a +0.030" bore (the equivalent of a 420hp 340 or 445hp 360 - been done plenty of times before)
Definitely not impossible to achieve but will take a bit of planning and parts selection vs just slapping something together.

So a little bit of info in no particular order:
318s are harder to get a decent compression ratio out of due to the short stroke and smallish bore - domed pistons are the "easy" button but generally don't play well with closed chamber heads (will run you $$$ at the machine shop with mock assemblies and machining of the crowns for adequate clearance). My 318 comes in around 9.8:1 CR with KB167 pistons 0.014" above the deck, 63cc combustion chambers and 0.051" head gaskets to set the quench at 0.037".
The wiseco or icon forged pistons will be more forgiving if you run into detonation. Also worth noting that most 318s have "340" rods just without the small ends bushed for floating pins.
It was cheaper for me to reco/prep the factory rods, set them up for floating pins and fit them with arp bolts but I'm in Australia - in the US it may be cheaper to just buy new rods.
Ported speedmaster heads will flow plenty for what you want to do - just make sure you are lifting the valve enough to take full advantage of the extra flow.
High volume oil pump, windage tray and baffled oil pan, some oiling mods are outlined in a sticky in this forum
Arp main cap bolts or studs
There are better suited cams than what you've got on hand - make sure your chosen parts complement each other
Get a good ignition & timing curve sorted for your setup
Spend money on getting everything ballanced
Spend money on a good valvetrain components and a B3 geometry correction kit
Spend money on a good intake, carb & headers
Spend money on a good modern torque converter, shift kit and making sure the trans is in good condition - no point putting a trick engine in front of a clapped out slipping gearbox
See the trend here? $$$
Don't be afraid to make it rev
Make sure the rear end, suspension & barakes are up to the task. ( if it has the factory diff for a slant 6 car you will probably kill it on the first drive)
There are likely a few other things I've missed here

Or there is this for a lot less money and effort:
str12-340 said:
460hp, well maybe not on a typical hot rodder's budget, but can it put out as much as a factory 340? you betcha and it would be a blast to drive, even on pump gas.
Click to expand...
 
318willrun said:
boost and NOS is a game changer. 318 block probably isn't liking 4 digit hp. LOL
Click to expand...
And even if it did, it doesn't have the cylinder head for it. Comparing the 318 head and the LS head is just stupid.
 
Joey N said:
And don’t get mad at me I’m still learning I know there is a 50 year difference in these engines but I don’t think it’s just electronics that makes the engine have a higher output
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Oh I'm mad...I'm real mad...(Just kidding) :lol:

I dont know where to start yes the 318 shares the same crank dimensions thats about it. Guys get giddy thinking the 340 is an overbored 318 and it isnt.

LA 318 means restrictive heads and induction, low compression and basically over coming all that is expensive. Yes money solves all problems but bang for the buck most go with the

360. and the stroker kits etc. This is my shortened condensed opinion.

P.S. there has been alot of internet YT hype perpetuated by Uncle Tony types about 318 power on the cheap, but fact is one needs to dump cash into a 318 to overcome its shortfalls and

its easier with the 360 platform to get the same and even more HP.

P.S. not saying don't do it but go in informed and with a budget and realistic expectations and goals. One can build a fun 318 for the street and enjoy it for a long time.
 
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rumblefish360 said:
There is no reason the La wouldn’t like boost of built right.
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25-30 years ago Hot Rod did a turbo on a stock 318 and kept turning up the boost till it let go.
Don't remember the numbers but it was up there close to 300-350 or more.
toolmanmike said:
Hot Rod's 400 horse teen was closer to bolt together.
Click to expand...
Yeah, remember that one too.
 
I had 3.91s with a 318 4 speed it was ok but a little too low I would back it down to 3.23 etc.
 
Ted265 said:
I'll chip this in before this thread turns into a complete **** show:
A lot of guys will jump on the "get a 340/360" bandwagon - which is good advice if you are shopping for a motor to build up BUT you already have the 318, so i say go for it.
Also God help you if dartswinger70 reads this - it will turn into endless posts about UTG (totally unrelated) and how 318s can only ever be the 200ish HP engines that they were from factory and its pointless to try to do anything with them :BangHead:
You might get more usable info asking how to build X HP per CI than how do I build a XXXHP 318. A 400hp 318 is 1.24HP/CI at a +0.030" bore (the equivalent of a 420hp 340 or 445hp 360 - been done plenty of times before)
Definitely not impossible to achieve but will take a bit of planning and parts selection vs just slapping something together.

So a little bit of info in no particular order:
318s are harder to get a decent compression ratio out of due to the short stroke and smallish bore - domed pistons are the "easy" button but generally don't play well with closed chamber heads (will run you $$$ at the machine shop with mock assemblies and machining of the crowns for adequate clearance). My 318 comes in around 9.8:1 CR with KB167 pistons 0.014" above the deck, 63cc combustion chambers and 0.051" head gaskets to set the quench at 0.037".
The wiseco or icon forged pistons will be more forgiving if you run into detonation. Also worth noting that most 318s have "340" rods just without the small ends bushed for floating pins.
It was cheaper for me to reco/prep the factory rods, set them up for floating pins and fit them with arp bolts but I'm in Australia - in the US it may be cheaper to just buy new rods.
Ported speedmaster heads will flow plenty for what you want to do - just make sure you are lifting the valve enough to take full advantage of the extra flow.
High volume oil pump, windage tray and baffled oil pan, some oiling mods are outlined in a sticky in this forum
Arp main cap bolts or studs
There are better suited cams than what you've got on hand - make sure your chosen parts complement each other
Get a good ignition & timing curve sorted for your setup
Spend money on getting everything ballanced
Spend money on a good valvetrain components and a B3 geometry correction kit
Spend money on a good intake, carb & headers
Spend money on a good modern torque converter, shift kit and making sure the trans is in good condition - no point putting a trick engine in front of a clapped out slipping gearbox
See the trend here? $$$
Don't be afraid to make it rev
Make sure the rear end, suspension & barakes are up to the task. ( if it has the factory diff for a slant 6 car you will probably kill it on the first drive)
There are likely a few other things I've missed here

Or there is this for a lot less money and effort:
Click to expand...
Reason I grabbed the 340 ones is because my block is a 74 engine and I don’t believe it comes with good rods that year I could be wrong but I am also doing as much of the work at home so I wanted to be able to put the pistons into the pins with little to know trouble unlike the press fits, I am going with moly rings off rock auto probably. Aswell as I’ll be using the 1.7 rockers most likely so that it can open up enough to take advantage of the flow but we’ll see
 
Dartswinger70 said:
I had 3.91s with a 318 4 speed it was ok but a little too low I would back it down to 3.23 etc.
Click to expand...
I mostly drive within my town which is pretty small but sometimes do freeway so I was thinking 3.73 is a good middle ground
 
Darter6 said:
25-30 years ago Hot Rod did a turbo on a stock 318 and kept turning up the boost till it let go.
Don't remember the numbers but it was up there close to 300-350 or more.

Yeah, remember that one too.
Click to expand...
You remember the junkyard 360 Car Craft did? They pulled it right out of the junkyard and kept puttin more and more nitrous on it tryin to blow it up and it never let go.
 
Joey N said:
I mostly drive within my town which is pretty small but sometimes do freeway so I was thinking 3.73 is a good middle ground
Click to expand...
Yeah with an 0verdrive or 5 speed i know with the old 4 speed and 3 91s it was a bit much like 3000 RPM at 60 MPH or there about. a Real gas drinker...
 
I’m just running a 727 3200 stall probably shift kit but may go billet servos, reverse manual valve body
 
Joey N said:
Hey there folks, I was just wondering and I’m sure no one has a direct answer but I’m thinking… most people say that there is not much potential in the 318 but I remembered the ford coyote (5.0) is actually quite a small engine yet this engine outputs 460hp 420tq with just a 3.63 bore 3.65 stroke. 12:1 comp ratio on pump gas!!! 55cc head chambers cam around .550 lift. So my question is, is this doable to a 318 if not why? Is it the aftermarket head and piston support holding you back?
Thanks in advance
Click to expand...
Let me just say this: Horsepower is a number trap. Decide on an expectation for your car and shoot for that goal. For instance, if it's 1/8 mile then what number? Then decide how to get there. I've seen a lot of "Coyote 'stangs" run 8.2's in the 1/8 mile with automatics. You can get a 318 to run that number pretty easy in a A-body and keep it very streetable.
 
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