Relocating of the Neutral Safety Switch

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I installed a GM 2004R trans in my '69 Barracuda with center console, there was no way to connect to the Mopar NSS wiring. I used a simple push button type switch mounted in my shifter to have a NSS although it will only start in "Park":



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Then I got a reverse light switch off another year model to get my reverse light to work.

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I think that by using those Magnetic Cylindrical Plastic Sealed Reed Proximity Switches instead would have been easier and less bulky and I could start the car in neutral as well. "Pawned" never mentioned where you buy those switches or where to get the tiny magnet??? FABO members would need to have that info to copy the idea because many of us are not familiar with those gizmos?? I can also imagine other applications for those switches when you have something that moves out of position and you need to have something actuate relative to the movement.

The extra switch you see mounted to the outside of the shifter bracket is an "override" switch in case the NSS fails. I can easily access it by sliding my hand under the console.

Treblig
 
They are great and it is a awesome fix to me. Surplus center usually has them.
 
Treblig said:
I installed a GM 2004R trans in my '69 Barracuda with center console, there was no way to connect to the Mopar NSS wiring. I used a simple push button type switch mounted in my shifter to have a NSS although it will only start in "Park":



View attachment 1714991665 View attachment 1714991666 View attachment 1714991667 View attachment 1714991668 View attachment 1714991669

Then I got a reverse light switch off another year model to get my reverse light to work.

View attachment 1714991670


I think that by using those Magnetic Cylindrical Plastic Sealed Reed Proximity Switches instead would have been easier and less bulky and I could start the car in neutral as well. "Pawned" never mentioned where you buy those switches or where to get the tiny magnet??? FABO members would need to have that info to copy the idea because many of us are not familiar with those gizmos?? I can also imagine other applications for those switches when you have something that moves out of position and you need to have something actuate relative to the movement.

The extra switch you see mounted to the outside of the shifter bracket is an "override" switch in case the NSS fails. I can easily access it by sliding my hand under the console.

Treblig
Click to expand...
And you never said where you got your push button switch. I'd light to install one like that in my clutch pedal sometime, cheaper and smaller than a factory one.
 
75slant6 said:
And you never said where you got your push button switch. I'd light to install one like that in my clutch pedal sometime, cheaper and smaller than a factory one.
Click to expand...

They have a few different ones at the Oriellys. Most auto parts carry them. I got the one that could handle the most amperage just in case.

treblig
 
I think some of the flame throwing came from thread title "elimination of the neutral safety switch".
That isn't correct. It should have said "Relocating the neutral safety switch" .
I hope my comment isn't considered a flame or dig. Its just my observation...
That stuff should have been placed well away from keys, fobs, etc...
Could a key or other foreign object cling to the magnet and make all 3 switches at once ? Chit happens
The world wouldn't come to an end if chit did happen. Good luck with it
 
75slant6 said:
I see what the problem is here. Pretty well no one read the first post properly! Everyone assumed Pawned was simply bypassing the NSS when in fact he replaced the NSS on the trans with a setup on the column which TOTALLY makes sense if you take half a minute to read the first post. Then what he did got called fugly even when he said more than once that it's TEMPORARILLY installed and will be prettied up later! Pawned, keep building your car how you want and keep posting on here, some people just can't see/read clearly... Rant over.
Click to expand...

Thank you, I guess it helps when someone reads what you post before going off on you. Seems they read the title of the thread and looked at the picture

I just do not understand the negativity. I have done a few projects before that I have posted, that were very well received. And a couple that were received just like this.

I also tracked down and replaced the "rooster comb" and seals, thinking that may be the source of the leak. I pulled the pan NUMEROUS times and resealed it and even when as far as replacing the pan hoping that would solve the leak. When I realized the fluid was seeping through the internal parts of the switch (not from the threads) I tried to seal the switch with RTV and it slowed it down but it still seeping out

I do the projects for myself and no one else. I then will post them here if someone else is pulling out their hair over the same problem.
I just do not understand the negativity
 
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Pawned said:
The small batteries can be had most anywhere. Harbor Freight, Radio shack. I have 100 on order from China that is due most any day. Small Magnetics A whopping $1.73 which includes shipping. The Switches are from China also $1.28 each Switches
Click to expand...


Back up!! What small batteries, I didn't see any batteries in your drawing?? Like I said, not everyone here is familiar with the inner workings of the magnetic switches. I know (in theory) how they work, I know what a proximity switch is but where do the batteries go??
Explain it like you would to a child (to coin a phase from Galaxy Quest)

Treblig
 
RedFish said:
I think some of the flame throwing came from thread title "elimination of the neutral safety switch".
That isn't correct. It should have said "Relocating the neutral safety switch" .
I hope my comment isn't considered a flame or dig. Its just my observation...
That stuff should have been placed well away from keys, fobs, etc...
Could a key or other foreign object cling to the magnet and make all 3 switches at once ? Chit happens
The world wouldn't come to an end if chit did happen. Good luck with it
Click to expand...
Actually it can be placed anywhere on the column. This is just where I picked, probably because I have so much problems moving around, this is the most accessible to me.
I started to pull apart the steering column to make it internal to it. When I thought about doing any service to it, I did not want to pull apart the column again.

Plus YOUR ARE MOST CORRECT i SHOULD HAVE TITLED THE THREAD CORRECTLY.
 
Treblig said:
Back up!! What small batteries, I didn't see any batteries in your drawing?? Like I said, not everyone here is familiar with the inner workings of the magnetic switches. I know (in theory) how they work, I know what a proximity switch is but where do the batteries go??
Explain it like you would to a child (to coin a phase from Galaxy Quest)

Treblig
Click to expand...

I screwed up. My fingers were typing faster than my thoughts magnets
 
Pawned said:
I screwed up. My fingers were typing faster than my thoughts magnets
Click to expand...


Ok, now I can ask some intelligent questions!! In your original pic, you have a wire going to the relay to "G". Can I assume that "G" the relay ground? So when the proximity switch "sees" the magnet it closes the circuit and completes the ground?? Is there an amperage rating on the switches?? More details, we're not electronic geniuses....

treblig
 
Treblig said:
Ok, now I can ask some intelligent questions!! In your original pic, you have a wire going to the relay to "G". Can I assume that "G" the relay ground? So when the proximity switch "sees" the magnet it closes the circuit and completes the ground?? Is there an amperage rating on the switches?? More details, we're not electronic geniuses....

treblig
Click to expand...
I do not know the rating on the switches. That is why I bought 10 of them. But the circuit sets the small coil in the starter relay, not alot of current - it does not carry the starting motor current.
One of the problems with dealing with China is getting specifications and drawings on components. So if they are real cheap, you gamble a few dollars that they will suffice.
Yes the switch connects the relay to ground which makes the circuit to energise the relay's coil.
Originally, the G on the Starter relay connected to the center pin on the NSS. When the tranny was in park or neutral the center pin would connect to ground.
I had originally intended to use my switches to operate relays that would make the ground connection. But as I have spare switches, I decided to try not using my relays and seeing if the switch could handle things. So far so good. If the switch malfunctions due to high current flow, I will then use my relays. If that happens I will add an update to the thread. But I think all is golden for now
 
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Pawned said:
I do not know the rating on the switches. That is why I bought 10 of them. But the circuit sets the small coil in the starter relay, not alot of current - it does not carry the starting motor current.
One of the problems with dealing with China is getting specifications and drawings on components. So if they are real cheap, you gamble a few dollars that they will suffice.
Yes the switch connects the relay to ground which makes the circuit to energise the relay's coil
Click to expand...


Since you're using the switches to ground the circuit it will carry minimal amperage. Most of the amperage will be on the power side of the circuit. But that's why I installed a bypass switch in my Barracuda (see previous post), just in case my homemade NSS fail, I don't want to get stuck somewhere without being able to start the car.


Thanks,
treblig
 
Treblig said:
Since you're using the switches to ground the circuit it will carry minimal amperage. Most of the amperage will be on the power side of the circuit. But that's why I installed a bypass switch in my Barracuda (see previous post), just in case my homemade NSS fail, I don't want to get stuck somewhere without being able to start the car.


Thanks,
treblig
Click to expand...
I always carry a starter switch that I hook directly to the starter relay or a screwdriver in case the key start does not work. I also like to use it when I work on the engine instead of jumping into the car to start it.

But like I said if the switch does not work due to excess current, Then I will replace the switch and add a relay in the circuit to handle the power. The relays are just a few dollars each
 
I honestly don't know how much current is req'd to close a OEM starter relay and hold it closed. I don't know how much of the current is lost in that coil either. Lets hope you wires and contacts can handle it.
 
I have a DC amp meter. If you want I can check the amperage on the relay ground circuit of my Barracuda??

treblig
 
Treblig said:
I have a DC amp meter. If you want I can check the amperage on the relay ground circuit of my Barracuda??

treblig
Click to expand...
I have about 6 ammeters here, both AC and DC. I just did not bother to find out as I do not know the specs of the switch. So it is used it till it drops.

RedFish said:
I honestly don't know how much current is req'd to close a OEM starter relay and hold it closed. I don't know how much of the current is lost in that coil either. Lets hope you wires and contacts can handle it.
Click to expand...
The current on the actuating coil of the starter relay is on only as long as the key is turned. Once you start the car the current ceases.
If the switches burn out, I will find switches that handle more current. The point is the circuit works.
BTW, you do not need to use the same components as I did, If you can find better, please use that
 
I just now placed an ammeter on the actuating coil of the starter relay. The maximum current measured while starting the car was a whopping 3.1 milliamps. or .0031 amps

I just found the specs on the magnetic proximity switch :
max contact rating:10w
(in case you are interested in the rest of the specs.)
max switching voltage:100vdc
max switching current:0.5A
min breakdown voltage:220vdc
max carry current:1.0A
max contact resistance:100mΩ
release time:0.1ms max
operate time:1.0ms max
Diameter :6.08mm

So it looks like my guesstimate is/was correct

BTW regarding the magnetic. I found that I need to cut the magnet in halves or quarters. The car wants to start in drive, so a smaller magnetic should help
 
Treblig said:
I installed a GM 2004R trans in my '69 Barracuda with center console, there was no way to connect to the Mopar NSS wiring. I used a simple push button type switch mounted in my shifter to have a NSS although it will only start in "Park":



View attachment 1714991665 View attachment 1714991666 View attachment 1714991667 View attachment 1714991668 View attachment 1714991669

Then I got a reverse light switch off another year model to get my reverse light to work.

View attachment 1714991670


I think that by using those Magnetic Cylindrical Plastic Sealed Reed Proximity Switches instead would have been easier and less bulky and I could start the car in neutral as well. "Pawned" never mentioned where you buy those switches or where to get the tiny magnet??? FABO members would need to have that info to copy the idea because many of us are not familiar with those gizmos?? I can also imagine other applications for those switches when you have something that moves out of position and you need to have something actuate relative to the movement.

The extra switch you see mounted to the outside of the shifter bracket is an "override" switch in case the NSS fails. I can easily access it by sliding my hand under the console.

Treblig
Click to expand...
come on, tell us it`s a hidden anti theft switch !! used to hide a momentary push button switch on my hem street car.
 
oh BTW I changed the design of the switches and it has worked flawlessly for over 18 months.
 
Pawned said:
oh BTW I changed the design of the switches and it has worked flawlessly for over 18 months.
Click to expand...
Glad to see it works.
My thought would be to test the proximity switch with a similar load away from the car,say a bulb and a battery.
Run it for several hours or days and see if it will fail.

Those switches are used in household alarm systems, and some can be wired n/o or n/c.
As long as they are secure, they should be dependable.
 
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