removing aluminum anodizing

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A word on those welding rods, muggyweld or whatever. It works best on thin stuff like trim and radiators. I tried to repair a crack in a cast al 6 intake Choke stove and could never get the al base hot enough To melt the rod. I only succeded in melting the rod into the crack and the. It promptly fell out after i ran my finger over the cooled weld. So like the demonstrator does, heat the base and wipe the rod onto it until it flows and cthen build up your repair. I was on that intzke for 10 minutes with a mapp gas torch and could not get it hot enough. Oxy would have done it but i didnt have a rig. it probably would have not worked there anyway as it was over the exhaust riser and it gets pretty hot there. Tig welder did it up in aboou 10 seconds.
 
In talking to a high end professional metal polisher, those aluminum automotive trim parts are technically not the same "anodize" as let say a blue anodized Aeroquip fitting.

The automotive trim part finish/process is actually called Bright Dip.

Look at a blue anodized Aeroquip fitting. Then look at a aluminum headlight bezel. You'll see the bezel has a thicker coating and it has a gloss to it. You can sand away the blue anodizing much easier than the bright dipped headlight bezel too.

You'll find many anodizing businesses that do not do Bright Dip. Also many Bright Dip places do not have vats large enough for long 3 feet plus pieces.

You are mostly correct.

Bright dip is an chemical polishing process that uses phosphoric and nitric acid heated to between 180 and 220 degrees F. It does not make the coating thicker, but it may make it more durable since the coating is now flatter and more uniform.

Bright Dip solution is so corrosive that it will etch 316 stainless steel over time. Maintaining the right balance of phosphoric and nitric acids as well as maintaining a consistent temperature is critical to a good finish. In addition with the acid at such a high temperature companies that do bright dip need to install fume scrubbers and a variety of exhaust systems to keep the workplace safe. This is why bright dip tanks are so small, it is easier to properly ventilate a small tank than a large one. Finally the bright dip process is a bit finicky and this means that few shop have the expertise to do bright dip in a production environment.

Back in the 60s a lot of automotive trim was bright dipped, it gave the appearance of stainless trim at a much lower price. At that time companies didn't have the environmental concerns either. When the bright dip solution needed to be changed you simply dumped it down the drain. Today, used bright dip solution is going to contain heavy metals like chrome and copper, inaddition it is also going to a super strong acid. So the heavy metals must be removed and the acid neutralized. Expensive.

The key benefit of bright dip trim was that not only was it cheap to produce but it was also very durable. If well maintained anodized aluminium can and does last for decades. The key exception is colored anodized parts. Since most dyes are organic in nature they can and will fade over time.

If you were to take a microscopic picture of the surface of even polished aluminum you'd see that there is a series of peaks and valleys. Chemical polishing like bright dip etches away the peaks creating a flatter surface. The flatter the surface the more reflective, thus the term bright dip.

The anodizing process is broken down into the following steps, RINSING takes place between each step.

1. Cleaning in a soap tank heated to 140 degrees F. Cleans any oils or dirt off the part. Parts should be relatively clean, heavily oiled parts may need a dedicated degreasing, or other mechanical cleaning prior to this first step.

2. Etch Tank- Sodium Hydroxide is used to etch the part to give it a uniform appearance. etching can last from 30 seconds to several minutes depending upon the finish desired. A long etch time will create a "flat" finish. Shiny = Shorter.

3. Deoxidizing- The etching process will leave trace elements on the surface including copper found in various. The deoxidizer is an acid solution at room temp.

4. Bright Dip - many shops don't bright dip. If they wish to do a shiny finish they can get a relatively bright finish by first polishing the part to a mirror finish. Then degreasing the part and then etching it for only a few seconds. It won't be as bright as bright dip though.

5. Anodize. For clear anodize the part is anodized for 10-12 minutes for colored anodize the part may be anodized for up to an hour.

6. Color- A variety of colors can be added. Longer they sit in the tank the darker the color. Hardest color? Black, a good solid black is actually pretty challenging. If the pH is off on the tank the part can come out purple or brown. Just like in third grade colors can be mixed and matched, want purple? Blue tank for a while than red tank for a while. Green? Gold(yellow) and Blue. For production runs of thousands of pieces shops will dedicate a tank for a particular color. Most job shops will have red, blue, black, and gold. You can even get a camo appearance by streaking the part with acid between colors. The acid will immediately remove the dye from the pores since the pores have not been closed in the seal tank.

7. Seal tank. Tank with a very weak nickel solution heated to 180-200 Degrees F. parts are sealed for 10-20 minutes depending upon color.


Regards,

Joe Dokes
 
Thanks Joe for the details.

Have you worked in the plating industry.

I worked for a electronics connector company and all our parts were plated to mil spec. Usually electroless nickel over a beryllium copper or brass part. Are parts were machined to a "pre plated" spec. Especially threads. We did see variance in plating thickness. And also the hardness or resistance to flaking when are part was swaged or rolled crimped after plating for assembly.
 
FWIW, I didn't have much luck with oven cleaner years ago. I got much faster results dropping the pieces into warm Drano Kitchen Crystal bath. Stripped the bright dip within 20 minutes. Rinse the smut off, ready for repairs/polishing.

drainobathimg.jpg


polishedbezelimg.jpg
 
Thanks Joe for the details.

Have you worked in the plating industry.

I worked for a electronics connector company and all our parts were plated to mil spec. Usually electroless nickel over a beryllium copper or brass part. Are parts were machined to a "pre plated" spec. Especially threads. We did see variance in plating thickness. And also the hardness or resistance to flaking when are part was swaged or rolled crimped after plating for assembly.

Yeah, I worked in anodizing in college. We did mil-spec anodizing, but we were mostly a job shop.

Anodizing has good "throwing" power so it tends to build quite evenly. I can't remember exactly how far into a hole anodizing will throw, I think it was 1/2 the diameter but don't quote me. It does throw a LOT farther than chrome though. Since anodize is a dielectric, as the coating builds the current is always looking for the easiest path, thus the part that build the fastest builds resistance to current and the current has to go to an area of the part farther from the cathode. Thus, even with intricately machined parts you get a pretty uniform coating. This compares to Hard Chrome, as the chrome builds it just keeps conducting electricity, this forces some parts to be chromed to a ridiculous thickness and then machined down. With metal plating were you are placing a conductive coating on a part it is much harder to get a uniform plating thickness.

If the anodizer knows what they are doing they can accurately predict the build and keep the part within spec. I had a customer who was complaining about the thickness of our hard anodize on a part that was to receive a pressed in bushing. We were holding our thickness to about 2/10,000 of an inch. But some parts were loose and some too tight. Turned out his machining was off and his boring bar couldn't hold the tolerance, or I should say his machinists couldn't bore to the correct diameter. He was cool about it and apologized and thanked me for helping him find the problem. On parts with male threads anodize is typically not a problem since the coating is so uniform, assuming the machinist allows for the build up of around 2 thousandths of an inch. For anything larger than 3/8 it typically wasn't a problem. Now for screw holes especially small ones we might have to mask the threads because although it throws well it only throws well to about 1/2 the diameter of the hole. So small deep screw holes would need to be masked with nylon screws.

As far as hardness, anodize, especially hard anodize is VERY hard, it is harder than case hardened steel, but it is generally only a couple of thousandths of an inch thick. We had a bunch of tests that parts were subjected to in order to meet the hardness standard but I can't remember exactly what they were.

Anodize is a great coating. Just look at your shower door, those things last forever. Sure you might be rocking a 70s era shower door but as long as you don't use toilet bowl cleaner on it, it probably looks great.

Regards,

Joe Dokes
 
FWIW, I didn't have much luck with oven cleaner years ago. I got much faster results dropping the pieces into warm Drano Kitchen Crystal bath. Stripped the bright dip within 20 minutes. Rinse the smut off, ready for repairs/polishing.

Drano is mostly Sodium Hydroxide, this is the same chemical that we used to etch the part, and strip parts, it works great.

Here's a little fun experiment for you. Take Drano in glass bottle, add water, add aluminum foil. Keep adding foil. Pretty soon the foil will react with the water violently. The bottle will get hot. Now quickly, place a balloon over the end of the bottle and watch the balloon fill with gas. The GAS is HYDROGEN. Fun Stuff. Now take the balloon off the bottle and tie the end in a knot. You now have a balloon filled with hydrogen.

Just like the Hindenburg...... Hmmm. Anyone remember what happened to the Hindenburg? Anyone....... Anyone...... Bueller...... Bueller........? Now take a piece of paper and tape it to the balloon, this is a fuse. Now light the paper on fire and take step back. Watch the balloon create a really cool fireball. What is really neat about it, is that since the balloon if full of nearly pure hydrogen, it won't explode, it burns, so you get a really cool fireball for about two to three seconds.

Have fun. If you burn your house down don't blame me.

Regards,

Joe Dokes
 
If it was me, I'D be sleeping on the cot in the garage and letting YOU enjoy the smell of hot anodized bezel all weekend .........
well I never got it into the oven it was on the tray when she walked in and ask me what I thought I was doing. needless to say I wasn't going to tell her but since it was sitting on the stove and the oven light was on and blinking saying it was up to temp she sorta figured it out and just "looked" at me. it's gonna cost me an expensive night out with a lobster thrown in to really make it hurt my car part money. as a side note though I did get ALL the anodizing off on both sides so it shouldn't have stunk up that bad.
 
Drano is mostly Sodium Hydroxide, this is the same chemical that we used to etch the part, and strip parts, it works great.

Here's a little fun experiment for you. Take Drano in glass bottle, add water, add aluminum foil. Keep adding foil. Pretty soon the foil will react with the water violently. The bottle will get hot. Now quickly, place a balloon over the end of the bottle and watch the balloon fill with gas. The GAS is HYDROGEN. Fun Stuff. Now take the balloon off the bottle and tie the end in a knot. You now have a balloon filled with hydrogen.

Just like the Hindenburg...... Hmmm. Anyone remember what happened to the Hindenburg? Anyone....... Anyone...... Bueller...... Bueller........? Now take a piece of paper and tape it to the balloon, this is a fuse. Now light the paper on fire and take step back. Watch the balloon create a really cool fireball. What is really neat about it, is that since the balloon if full of nearly pure hydrogen, it won't explode, it burns, so you get a really cool fireball for about two to three seconds.

Have fun. If you burn your house down don't blame me.

Regards,

Joe Dokes

You know that there is a few people going to try that this weekend.
 
cool...this has really turned into an informative thread....thanks all

P.S. duster440, I read your stripping technique on another forum, thanks
 
Lil Red;
Lotsa people giving their "learned opinions" without giving you the true answer you need. Forget about Oven Cleaner. The only way to remove anodizing correctly is with EastWood's Anodizing Remover.

Do not let it rest on your fingers, wash it off or use Gloves. It is some bad stuf, but works amazingly. I have been polishing and restoring 67-8 Cuda Grilles for years. Nothing else comes close to this stuf. Very inexpensive and it lasts forever.

Your truck grille has very thick anodizing, so it may take 2 coats.
Good luck, Brutha!
 
Lil Red;
Lotsa people giving their "learned opinions" without giving you the true answer you need. Forget about Oven Cleaner. The only way to remove anodizing correctly is with EastWood's Anodizing Remover.

Do not let it rest on your fingers, wash it off or use Gloves. It is some bad stuf, but works amazingly. I have been polishing and restoring 67-8 Cuda Grilles for years. Nothing else comes close to this stuf. Very inexpensive and it lasts forever.

Your truck grille has very thick anodizing, so it may take 2 coats.
Good luck, Brutha!

Holy Crap Eastwood Anodize remover is $30.00 vs a can of drano for around $7.00 If the Eastwood stuff were $10.00 I'd say okay you're only wasting $3.00, but your wasting $23.00.

Drano is lye or sodium hydroxide the exact same chemical we used to strip anodize in a custom anodizing shop.

Mix drano with water, submerge the part, remove after a few minutes of bubbling.

Wear gloves, eye protection. If you get any on your skin rinse immediately as it can cause a chemical burn.

Enjoy.

Regards,

Joe Dokes
 
Holy Crap Eastwood Anodize remover is $30.00 vs a can of drano for around $7.00 If the Eastwood stuff were $10.00 I'd say okay you're only wasting $3.00, but your wasting $23.00.

Drano is lye or sodium hydroxide the exact same chemical we used to strip anodize in a custom anodizing shop.

Mix drano with water, submerge the part, remove after a few minutes of bubbling.

Wear gloves, eye protection. If you get any on your skin rinse immediately as it can cause a chemical burn.

Enjoy.

Regards,

Joe Dokes

Eastwood is probably labeled Drano..:wack:
 
Eastwood is probably labeled Drano..:wack:

EXACTLY!!! Everything Eastwood sells you can find somewhere else, and usually cheaper under its original label. The only reason to buy anything from them is strictly out of convenience / combined shipping because they have a little bit of everything.

I'm not just tossing this out there as an opinion. My phosphate treatment / rust inhibitor is called LiquiGuard. I was in "on the ground floor" with the company during its research and development of the product a few years ago and still use it almost every day. The owner called me out of the blue one day very excited because Eastwood was investigating his product for distribution ... it meant a lot of potential profit for his small fledgling company but it meant a lot MORE profit for Eastwood. He was trying to decide whether or not to let them market his product under their own label without giving him any credit or acknowledgment for his formulation and years of chemistry that went into it. He ultimately decided against it ... and is now doing very well without them. It was and still is $10 a gallon; since then, they've come up with several more formulations for different metals.
 
Lil Red;
Lotsa people giving their "learned opinions" without giving you the true answer you need. Forget about Oven Cleaner. The only way to remove anodizing correctly is with EastWood's Anodizing Remover.

Do not let it rest on your fingers, wash it off or use Gloves. It is some bad stuf, but works amazingly. I have been polishing and restoring 67-8 Cuda Grilles for years. Nothing else comes close to this stuf. Very inexpensive and it lasts forever.

Your truck grille has very thick anodizing, so it may take 2 coats.
Good luck, Brutha!

Speaking of lotsa people with 'learned opinions,' how about posting some pictures of some of your work? We'd all love to check it out. :-D
 
Lil Red;
Lotsa people giving their "learned opinions" without giving you the true answer you need. Forget about Oven Cleaner. The only way to remove anodizing correctly is with EastWood's Anodizing Remover.

Do not let it rest on your fingers, wash it off or use Gloves. It is some bad stuf, but works amazingly. I have been polishing and restoring 67-8 Cuda Grilles for years. Nothing else comes close to this stuf. Very inexpensive and it lasts forever.

Your truck grille has very thick anodizing, so it may take 2 coats.
Good luck, Brutha!


OUCH that hurt (not really )
If you mean correctly by your opinion then yep go for it 29.99 plus shipping.
some one else might say that just take it to an anodizing place and have them strip it for you. even more $$$ to do that but easy and faster if you have someone else do it.
or the way a lot of people on here have sugguested which you said to forget about. (not happening here)

But you are wrong.:protest: Easy Off (original yellow cap) oven cleaner works not only for the anodizing removal but to clean plastic of paint and metalized chrome (this is not an opinion but fact) so that you can spray chrome it without the mill thickness and get crisp lines.

and your directions could have come directly from a can of easy off about gloves and such along with proper ventilation.

Good for you if you want to spend 30 bucks plus shipping on a name brand that sounds exactly like diluted Draino ( already made ready to use, heck if I pour water into a bottle and add the draino will you send me 30 bucks plus shipping? I should have enough in 1 can of draino to ship you at least 4 bottles of your eastwood stuff, uh how bout on sale 25.99 each plus shipping of course) by all means be my guest and spend that money. BUT I have many other uses for the 20-25 dollar difference in price to get the exact same results.

I have been using easy off oven cleaner($5.39 @ walmart and $5.49@ publics and k-mart) and sometimes Draino ($7.00 to 9.00)when I remember to get it. to do anodizing removal for a long time I started using it around 1967 or so. it's proven itself to me on many car restorations

here's some of the current stuff that I have in the works for my 66 dart

original bezel and grill waiting on the Easy Off treatment
View attachment DSCF2692.JPG

passengers side stripped andpolished (dang just saw the dent, @#!$#) the spare one instead of the one on the wife's car. it's in better shape
View attachment 0208131615.jpg

both of them stripped and polished but I still have to fix that ding.
View attachment 0208131615b.jpg
close up of spripped bezel (with ding)
View attachment 0208131616.jpg


here's what I had to work with on the passengers side
View attachment 0122131354.jpg

spedo bezel with an old one for reference after spray chroming and detailing

View attachment WP_20130522_011.jpg

here's what they looked like while I was removing the pain/chrome using (wait for it....... ) Easy -Off oven cleaner.

View attachment DSCF3756.jpg

here's the glove box done up

View attachment WP_20130522_004.jpg


glove box lid and end piece spray chromed before detailing

View attachment WP_20130507_008.jpg

and here's what they looked like before spraying and after stripping with , I know you already guessed it yup Easy off oven cleaner on the Glove box lid and the drivers headlight bezel I forgot and left the oven cleaner on overnight. dang it was hard to get off until I remembered the old saying about the "hair of the dog" so I re sprayed it, waited a few minutes and it came right off. :D

View attachment DSCF3764.jpg


now I know some people swear by super clean and or purple power,and it works for them(cheaper yet than Easy off oven cleaner). I say whatever you want to use that works for you. me I'm just lazy and like the idea of spray and forget then wipe off clean after 1 or 2 sprays depending on the anodizing.
 
well guys, I used the easy off...3 different applications (apllied, let sit, then rinsed,repeat)

looks dull grey in appearance....gonna try some polish in the morning...but so far it looks promising

I'll keep you posted, thanks everyone, 66dvert your parts look impressive
 
I used easy off oven cleaner for ALOT of my trim parts. And have had good luck.

The trick I found was to roughly sand the parts first and THEN use the over cleaner. It allows it to soak in fast and have a faster/better reaction which in turn makes for less applications and wait time.

once it did its thing I rinsed it off. Then wiped it down, then rough sanded with 180 grit wet, then 220 wet,then 320 wet,then 800 wet, then 1200 wet, then ran it on my polishing wheel and it almost immediately brings it to a nice shine.

after that I wiped off the polishing compound film on the surface. Then I hand rubbed with mothers aluminum polish and then wiped it clean again. All of my trim came out looking as good as new with this process.

Its time consuming but it works.

Check out the link in my signature below for my duster build thread and you can find countless pictures of the trim work I have did on my duster throughout the resto process.
 
Speaking of lotsa people with 'learned opinions,' how about posting some pictures of some of your work? We'd all love to check it out. :-D

http://www.ebay.com/itm/68-BARRACUD...Parts_Accessories&hash=item58a04ab740&vxp=mtr

http://myworld.ebay.com/partzguru?_trksid=p2047675.l2559

I think I've seen his stuff for sale on ebay for some time. I don't understand why his ebay name only has 20 transactions.

The trim metalwork looks good from the ebay resolution pictures. Pics look a little washed out. The painted silver on that headlight bezel looks like MP wheel argent or something with gloss and little bigger metallic that original.
 
Steve, thanks for those links. I had to laugh at one of the feedback ratings if indeed those belong to our member above ...

Great buyer! Your satisfaction is 100% guaranteed
Seller: eastwoodcompany ( 98040)
May-20-13 17:01
-- (#360656994882) -- View Item

The item was a single aerosol can of Eastwood's Paint and Powder Coating Stripper purchased just this week for $19.94.

I made the mistake of buying a gallon of that stuff once for sixty bucks ... found the same thing in its original full-strength formulation from Solvent Kleen for less than half the price.

Regardless of whether this thread stays informative or turns into a "my way is better than yours!" war, the main point of any message board is an exchange of information to reach a common goal. There are more than five years' worth of threads here at a minimum about the removal of anodizing (look at the bottom of the page to see the Similar Threads). All we can do is toss our experiences out there for [hopefully] improvement of the greater good.
 
Steve, thanks for those links. I had to laugh at one of the feedback ratings if indeed those belong to our member above ...

Great buyer! Your satisfaction is 100% guaranteed
Seller: eastwoodcompany ( 98040)
May-20-13 17:01
-- (#360656994882) -- View Item

The item was a single aerosol can of Eastwood's Paint and Powder Coating Stripper purchased just this week for $19.94.

I made the mistake of buying a gallon of that stuff once for sixty bucks ... found the same thing in its original full-strength formulation from Solvent Kleen for less than half the price.

Regardless of whether this thread stays informative or turns into a "my way is better than yours!" war, the main point of any message board is an exchange of information to reach a common goal. There are more than five years' worth of threads here at a minimum about the removal of anodizing (look at the bottom of the page to see the Similar Threads). All we can do is toss our experiences out there for [hopefully] improvement of the greater good.

:eek:ops: I didn't mean to come across as my way was better (cheaper yes) but better nope. heck purple power and super clean are even cheaper and work too! but I'm lazy and having tried the cleaner method, draino method and purple power way(that got rid of the grease ground in my hands when I had a latex glove spring a leak and didn't eat my hands up. Also Guilty as charged I tested Easywoods stuff to see if it works any better) Draino works better than easyoff if you can submerge the part and over all is cheaper than easy-off since You don't use the whole can of draino and can re-use the heck out of it before it doesn't clean any more, but ya gotta watch it cause it will eat the metal(hands too even in latex gloves included. don't ask me how I know) I now use only those ugly green gloves that say they are chemical safe, and my Mom used those things for years cleaning her oven without a leak! My grill wouldn't fit in the bucket so I did the easy off thing (couldn't find draino at the store that day either!) the Wife brought some home for me from the same store and told me to "look down once in a while and I might find it" :banghead:
 
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