This is interesting-Go Elon---------------

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Wow talk about showing your backside , how about doing some research outside the US media , first there are hundreds of Tesla vehicles already operating successfully in Canada , second solar city was purchased to gain patents not generate revenue , he wanted their tech licenses for his current home "Powerwall" battery setup which he has now released the solar shingle part of so yes you can re-shingle your roof with shingles that are little solar panels the first 2 styles are already on the market with 2 more designs - a Tuscan terra cotta style and Slate coming in 2018 , the cost when amortized over the life of the roof compared to a conventional 30 year asphalt shingle is almost a wash without the value of the energy cost savings of the solar production -put that in your pipe and smoke it . , 30 years being the weather warranty and the power warranty of their shingles ,the impact or damage warranty is Infinite -life of your home .Does it pay to run out and switch your roof over now no but does it pay to switch when your roof is done and needs replacing -hell yes . Third you can add WalMart and JBHunt to the list of pre orders for the trucks , they were actually first in before Pepsi . Walmart is going to test here in Canada so their goes that cold weather myth all Tesla products have always been built with a battery maintenance system that manages battery temperature even when the car is in storage .
People laughed and talked crap about every Paradigm development in human history , there was a time when the swiss were the only people to buy a watch from then Texas Instruments invented a watch powered by an oscillating crystal and what happened ? A national industry with hundreds of years of dominance in the market was wiped out almost over night .It has to start somewhere with someone , it's not going to save the planet it's just a better way and will overcome the old way .
 
69_340_GTS said:
Who says the self-driving car has to be electric? The two things are not dependent on each other.

Less pollution? Not if they keep burning fossil fuels to make the electricity.

And... lithium and cobalt are two things that the U.S. does not have a lot of. We could maybe find some here and mine it. But, I guarantee the greenies would want to stop that mining for some damn reason. So we are back to importing a scarce commodity from countries who are not necessarily our "friends". Not a good basket to put all your eggs in.
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Self driving car doesn’t have to be electric, youre correct. But at this point in time, Tesla is leading the way. I personally think it will be limited to inner city and highway only. Time will tell

Less pollution - yes. It’s because producing power in mass quantity is much more efficient. A fuel type power plant has a relatively small number of turbines and massive generators. The friction loss is limited to fewer areas, there is a lot less and relatively lighter moving parts, and the burner is on a much bigger scale and more strictly regulated. Imagine trying to power every home in a city with a gas generator instead of a centralized coal plant.
 
Cannucky - yeah except solar isn’t a paradigm, it’s been around since the 50’s and hasn’t improved very much in terms of efficiency. The sun is still diluted by our atmosphere, it’s pretty far away, and it’s also only out 1/2 the year. Be lucky I guess.

There needs to be a diverse portfolio of energy to include solar, fuels, wind, hydro, and nukes. Nukes and hydro are my favorite because they are the cleanest and generate the most where wind and solar live on the bottom and are really only good for off grid use. Musk says we have a giant nuke reactor in the sky called our sun and I say we have a giant solar panel called our oceans and lakes. Every environmentalist is freaking out about a rising tide, well I say damn it up and create some power and reservoirs on the hills with hydro. I also think we should reduce our arms and produce power with all these nukes instead. World would be a better place.

Not enough sq/ft for solar to work efficiently enough and wind is powerful but just dumb IMO. They lose their mind about climate change but want to add windmills everywhere. Extracting energy from weather pressure systems is going to directly change how those pressure systems behave - now that’s REAL climate change.
 
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cannucky said:
Wow talk about showing your backside , how about doing some research outside the US media , first there are hundreds of Tesla vehicles already operating successfully in Canada , second solar city was purchased to gain patents not generate revenue , he wanted their tech licenses for his current home "Powerwall" battery setup which he has now released the solar shingle part of so yes you can re-shingle your roof with shingles that are little solar panels the first 2 styles are already on the market with 2 more designs - a Tuscan terra cotta style and Slate coming in 2018 , the cost when amortized over the life of the roof compared to a conventional 30 year asphalt shingle is almost a wash without the value of the energy cost savings of the solar production -put that in your pipe and smoke it . , 30 years being the weather warranty and the power warranty of their shingles ,the impact or damage warranty is Infinite -life of your home .Does it pay to run out and switch your roof over now no but does it pay to switch when your roof is done and needs replacing -hell yes . Third you can add WalMart and JBHunt to the list of pre orders for the trucks , they were actually first in before Pepsi . Walmart is going to test here in Canada so their goes that cold weather myth all Tesla products have always been built with a battery maintenance system that manages battery temperature even when the car is in storage .
People laughed and talked crap about every Paradigm development in human history , there was a time when the swiss were the only people to buy a watch from then Texas Instruments invented a watch powered by an oscillating crystal and what happened ? A national industry with hundreds of years of dominance in the market was wiped out almost over night .It has to start somewhere with someone , it's not going to save the planet it's just a better way and will overcome the old way .
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Tesla in spotlight with 'beast' electric semi-truck

"But the semi also piles on the chaos at Palo Alto-based company. Tesla is way behind on production of the Model 3, a new lower-cost sedan. It’s also ramping up production of solar panels after buying Solar City last year. Musk has said Tesla is also working on a pickup truck and a lower-cost SUV and negotiating a new factory in China.

Meanwhile, the company posted a record quarterly loss of $619 million in its most recent quarter.

Musk, too, is being pulled in many different directions. He leads rocket maker SpaceX and is dabbling in other projects, including high-speed transit, artificial intelligence research and a new company that’s digging tunnels beneath Los Angeles to alleviate traffic congestion."

J.B. Hunt, Wal-Mart climb aboard Tesla's electric truck

"The early orders reflected the uncertainty about how the market for electric commercial vehicles will develop. About 260,000 Class-8 trucks are produced in North America annually, and that market has a value of about $28.6 billion, said Don Ake, vice president of commercial vehicles at FTR, an industry economics research firm.

The 500-mile (800 km) range between charges that Tesla Chief Executive Elon Musk promised on Thursday for the Tesla Semi is about half the range between fill-ups of a diesel Class 8 truck. Heavy batteries cut payload and add cost, potential deal killers for fleet buyers focused on operating cost per mile."

I still say Musk is a modern P.T. Barnum and he is spending out money to make his billions. Even when his sales drop on the front end when taxpayer credit for buying zero emission vehicles start fading away, we'll still be paying for his research that he is so generous with.

I'm not against electric vehicles, solar power or eating a salad. I am against the tech being forced out before it's been competently advanced enough for its intended purpose. I've driven electric cars. They are a kick to drive and they are most likely the future. For the present, they are a mere novelty that needs more refinement.
 
I don't eat much salad and this isn't about the enviroment in my mind , solar has gotten a whole lot more efficient since the fifties and battery tech is constantly evolving , The truck doesn't need an 800 mile range because the Law only allows 10 hours of driving so add a trailer covered on panels and the truck can be recharged while the driver gets his required sleeps after his shift at the wheel . This is just about replacing one tech with another and there are going to be people like you who refuse to see the whole picture at once and want to pick at the edges of individual items but this is coming as a whole . Heres another one for you -there is no doubt in my mind you would have made the same arguements 40 years ago regarding computors , star trek communicators and Dick Tracy video phone watches but here we are walking around with all three built into 1 that is thousands of times more powerful than what was used to send the men to the moon 50 years ago . The Paradigm is the end of the fossil fuel oligarchy and the global control it exercises . Is Musk running in too many directions at once ? Probably but the market will find the help he needs to keep the balls in the air and we will move forward .
 
cannucky said:
first there are hundreds of Tesla vehicles already operating successfully in Canada
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Doctors and business men commuting short distances from heated garages. How much energy to defrost a windshield? Canada is not like Victoria with mild winters.

cannucky said:
-put that in your pipe and smoke it .
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I will put in my pipe after getting up on the roof to shovel the snow off, then will smoke it. After that as
I slide off and break my leg, then will crawl over to my solar power chain saw and remove all trees on the
south side of the property. Then will call an ambulance.

cannucky said:
People laughed and talked crap
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???
 
One last thought for some of you , all the e-cars are subsidized heavily in your country but not so much the rest of the world , a new 3/4 ton extended cab deisel can cost 90k here so the price for a model 3 is not a big deal , I see model S's here on the street all the time so there is no doubt the model 3 will out sell the S without any sort of subsidy here .
We're building a 10+ billion dollar hydro electric dam and plant so we can sell the electricity to the US on the spot market most likely at a loss , thats right all of you on the west coast the Canadian people are and have been for quite some time subsidizing your electricity bill and I for one have no problem keeping that power here to use for ourselves , if that means free power for electric cars so be it better than losing money on every KW to subsidize a foriegn nation .
 
Micro electric energy is also getting ramped up to take advantage of motion. Everything on the planet is in motion. Mini paddle wheel inside gutters, storm drains and micro wind mills everywhere are coming. Even the military is developing boots for soldiers that will charge the batteries in their equipment.

Electric is more efficient as a power source and the technology to make it from everything that moves or gives off photons is advancing fast.
 
monook said:
Doctors and business men commuting short distances from heated garages. How much energy to defrost a windshield? Canada is not like Victoria with mild winters.


I will put in my pipe after getting up on the roof to shovel the snow off, then will smoke it. After that as
I slide off and break my leg, then will crawl over to my solar power chain saw and remove all trees on the
south side of the property. Then will call an ambulance.


???
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I am well aware of the weather in the rest of Canada I have lived and worked in the rest of Canada including Calgary , I am from Ontario bud , you know 1 of the province's that keeps rebuilding your oil industry with our tax dollars every time you go bust only to have you talk crap about us when things are booming . I get it you live in an economy that is driven almost solely by the fossil fuel industry and are going to cling to that thread till it's too late -surprise even the Saudis are bailing on that and trying to create a new economy it's happening either get out in front of it our be buried under it .
PS there aren't many heated garages in Victoria in fact people like me that own multiple cars are shunned for not riding bicycles like the doctors and businessmen you seem to think proliferate this area , FYI most of the people around here are military , trades or Provincial civil servants , the rest are the small but vocal population you see on the news licking leaves and painting rainbows but they are by no means representitave of the actual population .
 
Ddaddy said:
Micro electric energy is also getting ramped up to take advantage of motion. Everything on the planet is in motion. Mini paddle wheel inside gutters, storm drains and micro wind mills everywhere are coming. Even the military is developing boots for soldiers that will charge the batteries in their equipment.

Electric is more efficient as a power source and the technology to make it from everything that moves or gives off photons is advancing fast.
Click to expand...

Exactly it's about the shift in thinking not the individual tech .
 
For the record none of this will save the planet . The planet doesn't need saving it will be just fine after we are long gone off the face of the earth . We have known for 50 years this planet can only support 2 billion people max and yet here we are over 5 billion and nobody wants to address the real solution .
 
cannucky said:
I don't eat much salad and this isn't about the enviroment in my mind , solar has gotten a whole lot more efficient since the fifties and battery tech is constantly evolving , The truck doesn't need an 800 mile range because the Law only allows 10 hours of driving so add a trailer covered on panels and the truck can be recharged while the driver gets his required sleeps after his shift at the wheel . This is just about replacing one tech with another and there are going to be people like you who refuse to see the whole picture at once and want to pick at the edges of individual items but this is coming as a whole . Heres another one for you -there is no doubt in my mind you would have made the same arguements 40 years ago regarding computors , star trek communicators and Dick Tracy video phone watches but here we are walking around with all three built into 1 that is thousands of times more powerful than what was used to send the men to the moon 50 years ago . The Paradigm is the end of the fossil fuel oligarchy and the global control it exercises . Is Musk running in too many directions at once ? Probably but the market will find the help he needs to keep the balls in the air and we will move forward .
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Thanks for the personal assault. Thanks for not reading and comprehending what I said. And it's spelled COMPUTER.
I never said it was about the environment. I stated clearly where my problems lay with the issue. Read it, don't read it, it doesn't matter.
Have a Merry Christmas.
 
cannucky said:
For the record none of this will save the planet . The planet doesn't need saving it will be just fine after we are long gone off the face of the earth . We have known for 50 years this planet can only support 2 billion people max and yet here we are over 5 billion and nobody wants to address the real solution .
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That was before we genetically engineered food on a global scale. Without GMO we wouldn’t be able to feed such high population. We’re at what, 8 billion now?
 
well I have a solar system on my workshop roof, its a big system 42 panels, and a big invertor....I was lucky with a govt rebate of 50%...it cost around 14k to me,,,its been up nearly 3 years..its basically paid for itself..it generarates roughly 8000 watts on a good day...and I use most of my power during the day so its great for me...basically I save more than 50/60% per month , I feed back into the grid what I don't use and get paid for that...
 
Interesting read this thread, let me give some insights into the way electricity grids work. 60-80% of the capacity of electricity networks are used for less than 20% of the time. Generally they are very underutilised overnight (when most people will be charging their electric vehicles) so in the not to distant future people will be able to charge them overnight at reduced rates because demand is not that high. This is already beginning to happen in the good old land of OZ (granted we are blessed with what is probably the best climate in the world for solar) where energy utilities are offering time of use tarriffs where the price of electricity overnight is much cheaper than during daylight hours.

I am a petrol head like most on this site and there is nothing that makes me feel better than a Mopar singing at high RPM but I am also a realist and electric vehicles are the way of the future (I love the idea of a flat torque curve).

My next daily driver will most likely be electric but my play car will always be Mopar fossil fuel!

Regards
Anthony
 
Companies purchase things that make them look like they are helping save the planet. Then, millennial youth feels good about buying from them. Follow the money.
 
1973Barracuda said:
Companies purchase things that make them look like they are helping save the planet. Then, millennial youth feels good about buying from them. Follow the money.
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Is that your head or your heart talking?

Whit68 made some valid observations....
Yes.. Companies generaly dont do things that turn off their buyers but that doesnt make the viability of a technology wrong.

Would you avoid a certain port design that made killer HP just because it also lowered emmisions?
 
1973Barracuda said:
Companies purchase things that make them look like they are helping save the planet. Then, millennial youth feels good about buying from them. Follow the money.
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001LikeThankAgree.jpg
 
mbaird said:
Is that your head or your heart talking?

Whit68 made some valid observations....
Yes.. Companies generaly dont do things that turn off their buyers but that doesnt make the viability of a technology wrong.

Would you avoid a certain port design that made killer HP just because it also lowered emmisions?
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Nope. I am all about horsepower. I just believe we are not there yet with electric. And, the public is lied to about it. And, green weenies are involved and bully companies. We are lied to, then, have to pay for it. Look at the Volt. Save the environment, whatever. So, how much damage is done producing batteries?
 
Revhendo said:
Thanks for the personal assault. Thanks for not reading and comprehending what I said. And it's spelled COMPUTER.
I never said it was about the environment. I stated clearly where my problems lay with the issue. Read it, don't read it, it doesn't matter.
Have a Merry Christmas.
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Wow you think that was a personal" assault" ? We have a name for people who are offended and feel assaulted by every little thing other people say , we called them pussies . Does that offend you Pussy ? Your the one not reading, I clearly responded to what your problem is with the tech in question .The difference in range is moot when you figure the addition of solar charging panels on the trailers , the ability to drive at night and charge while sleeping in the day and the fact that you can't legally drive 800 miles in one go based on the 10 hr law and the legal requirements for all trucks to have trackers and data loggers in them .Why do you think they are targeting 500 miles ? because they know that's the limit under the law when you include a 1hr meal break during which the truck will be charging .Keep living in your ever shrinking bubble bud , the world is evolving around you and without you , maybe your boy Trump will mandate a coal powered car for you .
 
Thats certainly 1 part of the problem but we don't have GMO water yet which is as big a part of the equation as the GMO food , as for the comments about hp well you do realize that modern electric motors produce instant tq and tons of it the Tesla cars are amoung the fastest cars in the world in the 1/4 mile beaten only by the new electric supercars being made by the exotics .

Sorry had to add this was a response to 2 posts above about hp and population I failed to quote the first 1 so it didn't appear in context , I wouldn't want the school marm to get offended .
 
cannucky said:
maybe your boy Trump will mandate a coal powered car for you
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Now I see why the anger. What's in the heart comes out. To much fake news for you eh?
Angry Trudeaunite.

Many assaults coming from you, when shown the other side of the debate. Am I a pussy too?

Refute me.
 
cannucky said:
Wow you think that was a personal" assault" ? We have a name for people who are offended and feel assaulted by every little thing other people say , we called them pussies . Does that offend you Pussy ? Your the one not reading, I clearly responded to what your problem is with the tech in question .The difference in range is moot when you figure the addition of solar charging panels on the trailers , the ability to drive at night and charge while sleeping in the day and the fact that you can't legally drive 800 miles in one go based on the 10 hr law and the legal requirements for all trucks to have trackers and data loggers in them .Why do you think they are targeting 500 miles ? because they know that's the limit under the law when you include a 1hr meal break during which the truck will be charging .Keep living in your ever shrinking bubble bud , the world is evolving around you and without you , maybe your boy Trump will mandate a coal powered car for you .
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I never said I was offended.
I didn't realize I was in the presence of such an awesome internet hero.
Have a Merry Christmas.
 
cannucky said:
Wow you think that was a personal" assault" ? We have a name for people who are offended and feel assaulted by every little thing other people say , we called them pussies . Does that offend you Pussy ? Your the one not reading, I clearly responded to what your problem is with the tech in question .The difference in range is moot when you figure the addition of solar charging panels on the trailers , the ability to drive at night and charge while sleeping in the day and the fact that you can't legally drive 800 miles in one go based on the 10 hr law and the legal requirements for all trucks to have trackers and data loggers in them .Why do you think they are targeting 500 miles ? because they know that's the limit under the law when you include a 1hr meal break during which the truck will be charging .Keep living in your ever shrinking bubble bud , the world is evolving around you and without you , maybe your boy Trump will mandate a coal powered car for you .
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I have 2 thing I'd like to discuss with you.

First, the logic "The truck doesn't need an 800 mile range because the Law only allows 10 hours of driving" doesnt work when you make a mass production. If you make that truck for you only, that is fine. For mass produce, that logic wont be accepted. You cant just tell every customer that "the Law allow 10h drive so we make 10h range"; if you do have ability, show them you can make 20h range and let the driver decide how long he want to drive.

Second, if you support Tesla you should buy one, that will increase their chance to success. Once you got one, do let us know where is the battery locate? Is it the size of Samsung Galaxy battery, or how large it is?
 
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