Welding in the subframe

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Payy

Payy

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Hey, I have a short question.
I have a huge rust hole in the subframe right next to the torson bar rear anchor, and even around it.
My question is, do I need to remove the torson bar before I weld it?

-Payy

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oh my god! thats not good. i know they make reproduction front frame rails, you might want to order them if you havent already and maybe call their tech hotline? that is if somone doesnt know, i would say yes and hope its a remove, cut, replace, reinstall type of deal.
 
Hole in subframe? You have no subframe!!! Auto Rust makes a patch panel for that area, but I might go looking for another body if that isn't the only rust on the car. Seriously! I've never sent a car that bad to the crusher; and I've sent my share of cars to the crusher. Maybe I should start exporting...

But yes, jack and level the car and release the load from the bars.
 
if i was going to fix it i would make card board patterns of the used to be frame section. take careful measurements of the socket location then cut it all out. remove the torshion bar and socket. then fabricate a new (or buy)a new frame. then tack it all together in place with the torsion bar and socket in place to get it in the right location. then remove the torshion bar for the final weld.
 
Its the only hole in the body, and these cars are very rare here in Norway so fixing it is the only option ;)
The thing is that as far as I can see the torson bar should not be in the way, and should altso be free to slide through its rear anchor even if I weld it with it in.
Is there any reason why I should remove it? Did I miss something here?

-Payy
 
That looks awful. I would unload the torsion bar and remove it. The amount of welding and subsequent heat you'll apply there can't help the tensil strength of the bar. My .02
 
Yep, you need to remove both bars and replace the whole cross member and anything else that is that rotted.
 
What? Both? Its only the left side that is rusted, the right side is ok.
But why do I need to remove the torson bars?

-Payy
 
If you burn through while welding, which is likely, you don't want tension on that bar it will explode at you and probably do some serious damage. As was mentioned I would find another crossmember to replace the whole thing with. You need good metal around the patch area to weld to and it doesn't look like you'll have any.
 
Okey thanks that makes more sense :)
I only plan to weld in some good steel where there is a hole or it is clearly weakened, the metal around it is actually quite good :)

Another question then.
Do i need to loosen the ball joint to remove all the tension away from the torson bar?
My local amcar dealer says so, but haynes do not mention it :S
 
My hats off to you good sir! If i saw that I would run far far away! I would recommend getting the replacement part,instead of just welding on it. This is your life we are talking about,and this is a MAJOR part of the unit-bodies structural integrity!
 
I have a torsion bar that is missing the tabs where it attaches to the rockers. Cut it out with a sawzall.

I'd sell it and you can use it for clean sections to repair that one.

Let me know.

Look on the bottom side of the lower control arm. There is a tensioning bolt that runs up through the arm to a block that loads the torsion bar. Loosen that up while having the tire off the ground. Might spray it good with Liquid Wrench, pb blaster before putting a wrench on it.
 
To completely unload the torsion bar you may need to remove the bump stop from underneath the upper arm. That will let the assembly drop just a little farther.
 
Bump.

I am trying to slide the bar through the rear anchor afther removing the rebound stop and loosening the adjustment bolt in the front, but it's stuck like hell.
I see haynes refer to some kind of tool to use as a striking point.
Is there an actual tool for this task or do I have to improvise? And if so, does anyone have a good idea (or experience) on what I can use instead?

And again thanks for a lot of good answers :)

-Payy
 
Lock on a pair of vise grips and hit with hammer. Yes there was a special tool for it. Make sure you have all the tension off the adjuster, it should be loose enough for you to move it a little by hand.
 
I can't move it any way even with the wise grips (well I only have a small pretty crappy one but still) and by hand is not a chance, but it got me thinking, and if the tension is off there should be no chance of it hitting me in the face while welding it either right?

-Payy
 
That is awful! Looks like something from the Titanic. LOL Let us know how it goes.

You can make a torsion bar removal tool like another member did here:

just use a couple u-bolts and a piece of angle iron from the Hardware store .I like to wrap the bolts in heavy cloth tape so they don't scratch the bars.I welded this up but it doesnt need to be so complicated.
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Judging by the amount of rust on that frame rail, I would not doubt that the torsion bar is rusted into the socket. Spray it good with penetrating oil. Be very careful when working with torsion bars. They are high tensile heat treated steel. They are under much torsional stress when loaded. Whatever you do, do not nick the bars. I have seen torsion bars split apart with radial fractures. I keep a short end as a paperweight.
 
I think you might be right about it rusting into the socket, I just could not remove the thing even with WD-40 and heat plus the tool in the picture below, actually I broke the u-bolts afther a while but the torson bar would not move a bit.
The result was that I just completely took the load of it before welding and the result was great actually.
Altso I have some pictures for thoose who wanted an update ;)

-Payy

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I see why you could'nt get the bar out. No one mentioned the retainer clip in the rear of the socket that has to be removed to get the bar out. I see it in you final picture!
 
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