1964 Dart Grüne Hölle Road Course/Track Day/AutoX Project

[mpgmike]

This tread popped up and I started reading it. I kept seeing "Hölle", which is only 1 letter off from my last name. Curious, I typed it into Google Translate to see what it means....





Oh...

Then I got to thinking; my wife's maiden name is Bell. Instead of referring to "my in-laws", I can call them Hell's Bells.

 

[slant six]

Instead of referring to "my in-laws", I can call them Hell's Bells.

Nice - You learned something funny and new.. ¡YAY for Deutchland!

 

[mpgmike]

Ich hatte zwei Jahre Deutsch in der Schule. But it's been 35 years ago. Plus, the teacher never taught us Hölle.

 

[slant six]

Ich hatte zwei Jahre Deutsch in der Schule. But it's been 35 years ago. Plus, the teacher never taught us Hölle.

Yes I would think you would not have typically the term Hölle in the German I or II classes...

 

[slant six]

9/20/21:

I swapped the Step-up piston springs for the metering rods in the Edelbrock 500 Carb from 4" hg to 3"hg - It really needs 3.5"hg Springs but I don't think Edelbrock makes such a part, or a metering rods with 3 stepped areas - I dont think those are available any more either.

With these springs it's a bit too lean at moments on the throttle, but does not get into the 12's / 11's AFR in 4th / 5th gear on the highway when pulling a small to moderate grade. With the 4" hg springs it was wasting fuel in this area... Carbs can only do so much with their notchy tuning abilities I guess. For my next trip to a 24 Hours of Lemons Race in Kentucky, I will set it up for good MPG's instead of all out throttle mashing fun.

I also Was invited to the season wrap up meeting for the Pittsburgh Vintage Grand Prix organizers..
It was on the North end of Pittsburgh, about ~ 40 from me.
Parking was for "fun cars" and boring cars. I parked with the fun cars. Was a fun trip and got to meet a bunch of new car guys and gals that help to put the 10 days of racing and charity events together. Also found more wonderfully curvy roads / hill climbs around the Pittsburgh area. -

Greg

 

[slant six]

9/28/21:

I had another fun weekend driving the Grüne Hölle Dart over 1000 Miles round trip. It went off with out any problems - I could not even detect that it needed any oil after ~500 Miles of driving - (haven't checked it since returning home)

My route took me on all interstates to get there. - About 500 Miles in 8 or so hours each way. The car sang along at 2800 RPM netting 84 MPH with the 3.91 Gears out back. I did not know about the Cincinnati Bypass and Got stuck in terrible Rush Hour Traffic whilst trying to navigate south on I75.

After making it through the urban centers and construction zones with accidents, I ended in Bowling Green KY; NCM Motorsports Park =to crew with the the Off Kilter Racing Team - We are like minded Slant 6 Junkies that campaign a 1962 Valiant in the 24 hours of Lemons Series named Toad Racer.



Got an early start on Friday at the work campus - Love the clear morning walks at sunrise.

Paddock buddies:

Carb Tuning:

It might Not Look Like Much Be we turned the fastest laps in C class - Faster than the Class Winner, "Duff Beer"

Started out Racing in the Rain:

Wore out some Tires..

Found some corvettes..

Sunday Paddock:

Took a bit less interstates on the way back home:

'till next time,
Greg

 

[slant six]

10/26/21:

Here is an action Shot from the Summer PVGP Countryside Tour back in July 2021:

I was a group leader and the White Porsche was bringing up the rear.. Fun times!

Greg

 

[slant six]

11/5/21:

Got the Güne Hölle Dart out for one last epic Drive this Fall - Scenic TOur of the Ohio River Valley and some Twisty Road Side Excuricions from Martins Ferry to Marietta OH. The PVGP Folks Sent and invite and It will be a blast! New Back Roads for me with the scenic colors of the leaves - No Wet leaves on the road and Plenty of sunshine!

I will report back on this trip with documentation soon!

Slant on folks!

 

[slant six]

11/6/21:

Here is a recap of the day of fun routes we found on the way to Marietta, Ohio.

About ~440 Miles of Driving on Lovely Twisty Ohio Valley Side Routes, Lots of scenery to take in, Leaves changing, and Covered Bridges, Mail Pouch barns etc. The Routes were a blast - possibly comparable to the back of the dragon with less traffic, except for maybe the trucks going to and from the many fracking well pads in the area. We took interstates and well worn 4 Lane US States routes there and back from my place.

When we would happen to encounter a well rig truck, we would pull off, take a break, and just enjoy the scenery and the beautiful day,

Some pictures:

It's November so short days.. Got started on a clear morning... Got to look at the stars before the blue hour.

6 of us gathered for the impromptu tour:
Most were fans of the MG, the Triumph, or the Jaguar - thankfully the organiser remembered that the 'ol '64 dart eats up these roads just as well as the smaller sized British produced bretheren.

We gathered at the Bob Evans in Martins Ferry OH before heading out.

Witnessed the 5.0 encountering some quasi-nefarious activity..

After Breakfast we were off.

Pulled off after being behind a Tanker Truck and Found some beautiful rim roads and meadows.

A local man was out on his super nice early 80's Yamaha street / trail bike, stopped to ask if we were okay, indeed we were.

Stopped for a snack break at the bottom of the valley back on Ohio Route 7 at Hannibal Locks / Dam

For the last section of the route the Jag and MG's Stayed on the Valley floor while The triumphs and the Dart headed back up the mountainside for more twists and ~ 40 Miles on Ohio Route 26.

 

[slant six]

11/6/21 Continued:
Along some steam valleys and getting close with geology:

Found Lots of Mail Pouch Barns and Covered Bridges along Ohio 26 - This one was not the most picturesque , but We stopped about 18 Miles from the end of the route to take some pictures, check fuel etc. There was no Cell service and there was a Quaint Campground in the Wayne national forest behind this bridge.

We made it to Marietta for an early dinner:

Explored a nice and well stocked antique store:

Planned a route back through West Virginia Up to the Ridge in the Laurel Mountains above Uniontown.. Saw some Windmills up close:

Got a glimpse of a few counties looking west in Western PA from the ridge Just after sunset:

Here is the actual route.. See how those lines to the west were a bit bendy and crooked? =

Greg

 

[slant six]

11/10/21:

Did some fiddly Stuff on the car after returning from the Ohio Excursion.

Found that the Header collector bolts were loose, so I replaced them with longer bolts that permitted the use of lock washers and I also put nylocs on there too.. Maybe the nylon will burn off but It's better tan having the header bolts come loose when I am on the road.

Also Refreshed and cleaned the pins on the back of the gauge cluster and cleaned the grounds real good. All of the vibrations made the instrument cluster lights, turn signals and hi beam indicator work sporadically..

Drove the car to work Monday nite... it all was good.

Now ready for some serious winter fabrication when time and $ allows.


Greg

 

[RustyRatRod]

So Greg, just to nail this down, I have the same input bearing retainer you have and modified. I've already gotten it turned down so the Hemi throwout bearing fits. Now, from what I am seeing, I need to have the aluminum part cut back 1/2" and the actual steel tube cut down 1/4". Is that right?

 

[slant six]

So Greg, just to nail this down, I have the same input bearing retainer you have and modified. I've already gotten it turned down so the Hemi throwout bearing fits. Now, from what I am seeing, I need to have the aluminum part cut back 1/2" and the actual steel tube cut down 1/4". Is that right?

Possibly.. There are a few different flavors of that retainer. I Used the OE MoPar Clutch fork and Pivot.. so on the first try of this configuration with my T5 .. It was from a 2000 Mustang V6 (SN-95) Chassis..
Yes I needed to machine some Aluminum off the snout to make things work and have proper clearance in the bell housing... When I went to the Ford Motorsport Z Box T5 I did not need to perform that additional machining.
It also depends what the finger height for the pressure plate is that you choose to run. Your test fits with the clutch and PP installed will also help determine these things along with just comparing measurements on any car 60's-70's MoPar Manual trans Input bearing retainer to your T5 Part.

You also may want to check This article authored by myself to help out with the topic..

Greg

 

[slant six]

12/16/21:

Have been slowly working on some small bits.
I removed the Headlight Switch / Wiper Switch Dash Bezel..I made a Proper Tool to get the wiper and headlight Switch Lock nuts off. I painted the Dash Bezel a year or 2 back and it originally looked like this piece too.

It is kind of a cool and somewhat more scarce piece as most '63-'64 darts that I have seen (especially GT's) Had the pushbutton with the buttons and Park lever where this big gray Block off plate is.

Before:

All that groovy '60's Chrysler chromed plastic was faded away into a smokey yellow hue that just looks dated and old.

So like many other bits inside and out on the car - Satin black to the rescue!

It's not perfect, but I am the one who will see it the most and I can live with it.

'Till next time!

Greg

 

[slant six]

1/9/21:
Here is a blast form the Past.

Found this Picture from the Day I Picked up the car from my dear friend's house in NC... He Gracisouly Picked up and Hauled the Dart to his house from Southern Georgia and Stored if for a few months for me.
It was an October hurricane weekend, and There was rain all day.. But this is how the Grüne Hölle project started life with me... getting towed up the mountain on the open trailer with 'Ol Blue.

I have Plans to work on and upgrade the car this winter but have been getting sidetracked by other small projects and "deals".
I did get the Painted Wiper/Washer and Headlight Switch bezel plate installed.

Hope to get back to it soon.

 

[slant six]

2/10/22:

It was above freezing Last Night for a few hours so I went to the garage to get a few things done.

The Headlight / Wiper Switch bezel / Plate had been installed a while back - It came out quite nice:

Since I had the car on the rack........ New Tires for the Road Wheels - Mounted and Balanced.

While it was up on the rack, Clean the calipers and install some new pads - Hope to make a TNiA or HDPE day this year.
EBC Blue Stuff on the Corvette C5 Form Factor pads means I can play with all sorts of compound s from EBC, DBA, Porterfield, Hawk and others.
The Lang Tools 279 Caliper Press came in handy, All my other old Mopars Can get by with an old c Clamp.

Those Porsche 997 Gt3 Brake Ducts look right at home on the sway bar!

Maybe I will get a Trailer Hitch Fabbed up soon as well!

Till next time.

 

[slant six]

2/14/22:

I was able to get some more work done on the car over the weekend.

I Ordered some Sparco R100 Street Seats - They are affordable and have Provisions for Head and Helmet support, Belt Holes as well as side bolsters to support you in the corners a bit. I am sure they are not the best seat but they are good upgrade from the stock seats at this point, which were heavy, high and dropping webbing and foam all of the time.

There are not any ready Made Bolt in Siding Seat Brackets that I could find for the '63-'66 A Body MoPars.. so I bought a Corbeau Seat Bracket/ Slider for the '67-'76 A Body. It of course did not fit but with a bit of Tab relocating / Welding and other typical hotroddery I was able to Fit the Sparco Seat to the Corbaeu Sliders and Fit the Sider / Bracket to the Floor of the car.

Welding and fitting to make the bracket fit this car:

Sparco's have a wider track for the sliders than the Corbeau's so I added some Oversized tube and sleeved / welded the seat adjuster handle.

Lots of test fitting to fit a floorboard with goofy stock mounting points and reinforcement plates not underneath the bracket I was adding.

All Painted up..

Started Working on the Harness Bar for the Shoulder Belts.
The Piece Below the quarter window on the '64 Dart is metal, not trim, not removable.. It;s Part of the unibody Structure, so Harness bar will get welded to it.

'Till next time,
Greg

 

[slant six]

2/18/22:

Got Some more fab work done
Hole Sawed the Right side of the Metal Unibody Panel under the 1/4 window for the removable harness bar.

I Welded in the abutment for the Right side of the bar...Protected all of the glass and soft surfaces with welding blankets or cardboard and tape.

Made a few More little spark/spatter shields during the welding process. I know there are actual products out there for this kind of work, but recycling stuff from the cardboard trash bin with a bit of tape here and there was quicker and possibly somewhat easier as I am not sure what to even look for when it comes to auto body welding shield wrapping materials. Also who can argue with giving some cardboard 2 or 3 uses before going into the bin? I like to use it for lots of stuff.

One Sparco seat installed. - Harness Bar mocked up for length, New Belts with camlocks installed. Still need to Hack up a New Corbeau Seat Frame and slider set for the driver's side. (note to self.. the Driver's Side seems to have more area to work with due to the offset of the trans and driveshaft hump).

Greg

 

[slant six]

2-24-22:

Got the Interior all buttoned up. The Car feels really tight with the new Seats, safety Harnesses and Tires. Found some local twisty Roads and have been breaking in the New EBC Bluestuff Front Pads.

The bottom and side bolsters really cradle you and provide a lot of support during conering, compared to the stock , low, heavy, wide OE seats from 1964.

Next up Should be the trailer hitch install or the fiberglass hood, with aluminum hinges. - Hope to get one or the other done before my April Roadtrip.

 

[slant six]

3/3/22:

I have been working on some small things
- Finishing up the Seat / Belt install
- Adding a Fire Extinguisher
- Adding a recovery strap to the front of the car
- Finishing up some of the interior gauge lights

I hope to actually get to the fiberglass hood this weekend.

Some Interior shots of the seats, Belts and Bar:

Put some Plugs / Tape and Cardboard(for now) to block up some of the openings in the core support.

Front view shows additional tow strap added.

Some materials for getting the gauge lights to match the Dash Lights:
Green lighting gel - cut to size, and attached to the bulb.

Turns gauges looking like this:

Into something more like this:

 

[slant six]

3/16/22:

I have been able to work on some small bits here and there.

So Long Stock Hood:

It weighed in at good 60#... Firm.. Rugged.. old Detroit Steel.

Add another 8# for the Stock Steel Hinges and Springs that I also removed.. Not shown.

New Lite Hinges and plates - Plates get bent and then epoxied to the fiberglass, while the hinge arms replace the stock steel pieces.
(thanks Rick!)

Here's the new Hood Ready to be fitted - It's a flyweight Pin on / Lift off fiberglass type hood.

Weigh in..

Total with Hinges included: 14#

Not bad for a day's work, Losing 54# off the Nose of the car.

One of the many Test fits.. Adding some aerocatch bits for the closure.

Those Aerocatch parts are nice, quality, and well made - and I think they look great too.

Summit Racing Has Factory Style Air Dams for first gen 80's S10/ GMC S15/ Sonoma for something ridiculous like $11.. I couldn't pass it up so I bought one and hacked it to the underside of the factory front valence - It Prolly should be lower, but for now it's better that what was there before.. nothing.

Had some paint Problems with the fiberglass - will hafta redo it sometime, but it's good for enough for now.

' Till next time..

 

[RustyRatRod]

5/19/20:

Preparing for the T5 Swap...

I have not yet gotten to cutting any floors or raising any crossmembers yet, Will be getting to that soon.

I got the 3 speed out and was eyeing up the viability of the parts needed to do the swap. I have 2 t5's and 2 conversion bell housings to choose from; One was From the Slant 6 Bellhousing Group Buy back in ~2005 which I was not a part of, but I acquired one from someone that abandoned their Transmission swap project.

I had a nice flywheel made about 10 years ago at Wilcap - this is the time to use it.. It was made for the '68 Up Slant 6 Crank Hub Register which is ~2.165"Ø and the engine / Crank currently in the car is a Small Hub Crank ...Production years 1960-67 which has a Hub of ~1.870"Ø.

If it were just some sort of stockish build I would get the correct flywheel and be done.. but that's not the case so I designed up some Adapter Rings and am getting those made now.

Picture of the progress:
Bye Bye old Sandy, Greasy Non Synchro 1st Gear 3 Speed!
View attachment 1715890273


Who Knows maybe this car was in a flood? there is tons of sand on top of the trans and stuck to all the greasy Stuff under here!
View attachment 1715890274


View attachment 1715890275


View attachment 1715890276


Lots of sand, Grease and undercoating to scrape off in the tunnel before cutting / grinding / welding.
View attachment 1715890277


Scrapin, we be Scrapin, Mon!
View attachment 1715890278


Get It light by taking all the sand out!
View attachment 1715890279


Time for class... er world class t5 that is.. I was taking notes.
View attachment 1715890280


I was able to purchase a complete T5 with most of the necessary parts from another die hard slant 6 fellow. Since he did alot of the work and engineering this does make things easier for me... He also had Desirable parts in the swap that are just bespoke or no longer made.. such as the Mcloeod 9" Pressure plate. Back in 2000-2004 it was easier to get parts like this from McLeod.
Here is the Pressure Plate when I got it.. Good parts, but it needed refreshed.
View attachment 1715890281


View attachment 1715890282


View attachment 1715890283

It also Had a Nice 9" Dual Friction Disc with the t5 Splines in the Center Hub. Kevlar Pucks on one side and Organic Facing on the other.
I sent Both the Disc and Pressure Plate to Falcon Clutch Falcon Clutch Specialist in Deer Park NY.
I talked to them on the phone and Told them I wanted the Pressure Ring Blanchard Ground and Rebuilt with the same exact spring pressures as it had When I sent it to them.. I also had them Reface the 9" clutch disc the same way that it was made from McLeod.. One side with pucks and the other side full organic..
Here's how it came back: (New Parts on Right Side !)
View attachment 1715890284

Here's the Flywheel.. Sort of a Fidazna'ish Slant 6 Flywheel.
View attachment 1715890285

I got a 28 Spline Yoke, And once the T5 is in the Car I can measure for a driveshaft too.
View attachment 1715890286

Again, I was able to buy some parts from a successful t5 slant 6 swap that was removed from a car??!? So I dont have to make a trans crossmember, but this one is thin.. so I think I will weld up some metal to beef it up.. Its made of light gauge metal for some reason.
View attachment 1715890287


Lastly, I have some measuring and futzing Around with the Input Bearing and associated adapters.
Parts on order to make this all work.. Also might have to fire up the lathe!.
View attachment 1715890288


Cheers! Greg

What's available for a clutch kit now? It appears I may have to piece something together.

 

[slant six]

What's available for a clutch kit now? It appears I may have to piece something together.

Probably not much currently available. You will need to work with a local clutch builder / remanufacturer most likely.

You have Choices however.. I would see what is available in the T5 Input Splines and Ø for the disc, probably in 9" to 9.25" OD then Get a Pressure plate built to match it - Especially if you want to run a stock flywheel. There is also this option:
I have bought one but do not have it in my hands yet.
The one I bought is setup for the T5, not Mopar A833. It can be hand in either flavor.
- My buddy has it and I will be picking it up later in April.

 

[RustyRatRod]

Probably not much currently available. You will need to work with a local clutch builder / remanufacturer most likely.

You have Choices however.. I would see what is available in the T5 Input Splines and Ø for the disc, probably in 9" to 9.25" OD then Get a Pressure plate built to match it - Especially if you want to run a stock flywheel. There is also this option:
I have bought one but do not have it in my hands yet.
The one I bought is setup for the T5, not Mopar A833. It can be hand in either flavor.
- My buddy has it and I will be picking it up later in April.

In that case, I'll just use a Mustang disc and rock on with the pressure plate I have. It's pretty new still anyway. Thanks!

 

[slant six]

In that case, I'll just use a Mustang disc and rock on with the pressure plate I have. It's pretty new still anyway. Thanks!

Sounds Like a plan, Stan. If you don't intend on drag racing it or doing smokey burnouts I bet it will be fine!