66 dart LED prototype working for now

-
You are doing some great work.
If you ever get to selling this kind of thing, think about doing a Demon tail-light with sequential turn signals like the old Cougars. Now that would be awesome. :D
If I had the know how I'd do it myself.
 
slantsixdan said:
Your meter readings give cause for concern; the bright/dim intensity ratios aren't anywhere near sufficient. Only a 49% difference axially for the original bulb, and only a 30% difference axially with the LEDs. I'd be inclined to try to rule out a problem with your measuring method/equipment as a first step, because the original lamps did comply with the 5:1 and 3:1 ratios. You may need to tweak your driver circuit to reduce the intensity in dim (tail) mode.
Click to expand...

Dan I just borrowed the next door neighbors luxmeter(cheap one ) and got a sample reading off of just the the axis right now. his meter gave me completely different numbers than the photographers
here's the axis numbers for 1 light 10ft away and both 5 up and down
with a .1 light reading with the lights off
tails were @84 degrees temp
1.55 -.1=1.45 (axis)*9.29 =14.3066
1.54 -.1=1.54 (5d) *9.29 =14.3066
1.56 -.1=1.55 (5u) *9.29 =14.3995
1.56 -.1=1.55 (5l) *9.29 =14.3995
1.55 -.1=1.54 (5r) *9.29 =14.3066

brakes were with the same setup but didn't vary at all till I went past 10 degrees down then the readings went UP???? gah must be tilted in the opening
here is the readings that I did
Brakes
12.7- .1=12.6 (Axis)*9.29=117.054
12.7- .1=12.6 (5u)*9.29=117.054
12.7- .1=12.6 (5d)*9.29=117.054
12.6- .1=12.5 (5r)*9.29=116.125
12.7- .1=12.6 (5l)*9.29=117.054
14.3- .1=14.2 (10d)*9.29=131.918 ******
12.6- .1=12.5 (10u)*9.29=116.125
I just went out and looked at the tail lights and they ARE mounted at an angle.hmm maybe I'll have to tilt the board a few degrees to fix the difference
if I take the worst case and do.
14.3066 / 116.125 I still get a good ratio of... hmm 8 to 1
I did resistor down the taillights, I went from 110 ohm to 390 ohm to get a good differential. plus it helps that I'm running 20 in the outer ring and 28 in the centers too! I hope I'm getting close to a safe set of lights
thanks for your help. made me think a little bit harder on what I wanted too!
 
I might be able to help out with the LED controller. Sounds like you need a PWM with current control for, brake and tail regulation. I work with micro-controllers and it might be possible with an 8-pin uC, a couple mosfets, inductor and a few misc parts. Controlling the current will control the intensity. There will be no need for series resistors. Let me know if you have interest.

Years ago I had a yellow 66 Dart 270 convertible with 273 V8. Seeing you car brought back those good memories.
 
KitCarlson said:
I might be able to help out with the LED controller. Sounds like you need a PWM with current control for, brake and tail regulation. I work with micro-controllers and it might be possible with an 8-pin uC, a couple mosfets, inductor and a few misc parts. Controlling the current will control the intensity. There will be no need for series resistors. Let me know if you have interest.

Years ago I had a yellow 66 Dart 270 convertible with 273 V8. Seeing you car brought back those good memories.
Click to expand...

What type of controller? I am interested (anything that makes it easier for me to do what I want)
I do have a PWM version (for mine) and everything is 12volt regulated by LDO sharp 12v regulators. I have had problems with the PWM units not limiting the current and dimming the LED's enough. It could be the pot's not the right one for my application.

I use the resistors to bring it to a normal level and PWM it down from there to the correct level. so if the pwm doesn't work it still will be workable unit.


I am thinking about doing a sequential setup or even a ring version like the new chargers for the challenger. since I have the complete light unit to make measurements off of. But that's going to be a loooong time from now though, I have to finish the wife's dart next then the challenger.
thanks
 
I've had the tails and turns working all night. man did that make the garage look silly during the night. light on dim then blinking to bright.
I took a reading @ 9:00 this morning and got the same or close to the same numbers(after taking into account the light of .7 filtering in)
so it looks good for long term lighting that the led's won't blow out.
I did find out that the turnsignal switxh is backfeeding about .64 volts through the system so I'll take it apart and clean it to see what happens there. If I can't clean it enough to fix the bleed back I 'll just replace it.
 
How do they look in full sun?

Did you meter the OEM incandescent assemblies the same way?

.
 
bohica2xo said:
How do they look in full sun?

Did you meter the OEM incandescent assemblies the same way?

.
Click to expand...
they look good in the sun.they are much brighter than the stock ones(visually to me AND the meter) I'll see if I can get a picture of it in the sun and post it.I do think I like the Cring version a little better than the full version but I'll test both to satisfy myself, plus it'll give the wife a choice for her dart
yup the original tails were:(reeally dirty with no cleanup)
1.0-.1=.9*9.29=8.361
and turn/brake were
6.1-.1=6.0*9.29=55.74
55.74/8.361=6.6666666666666666666666666666667
I did a double check just to make sure and came up with the same numbers
hmmm good ratio but not as good as the led's
 
slantsixdan said:
Your numbers look really good! New turn signal switches, see here (scroll down for current pricing)
Click to expand...
Thanks
I was really supprised that the numbers were so different then the numbers that I got from the photographers light meter. I'd like to make sure and do a full scale read on the led's all the just to make sure they stay in range like they are supposed to. I have one of those cheap digital thermometers and can check temp rise on the leds. I don't expect to see much rise in temp because I'm only running them @50Ma instead of the rated 70Ma for turn and stop
and the tails are loafing along @ 4Ma so they probably will never get hot
It helps that I'm using the largest 2oz. copper pads on the bottom that I can make fit in the design too! I'll look into the new switch just to be on the safe side
 
About the controller. I use Atmel AVR, for your application the tiny series may be a good choice. Raw PWM sets a duty cycle to provide an average voltage. This works well for motors and solenoids, however will not work well for LEDs. The LED current vs voltage is very sensitive to voltage. A small increase in voltage creates a large increase in current. The circuit needs to be designed to provide good resolution for the desired current range. I have good ideas how to make the control work correctly.

Your recent post suggests the range from a few to 70 mA. This range should be easy to do. I also need to consider how the LEDs are connected in strings of series and perhaps parallel. It may be necessary to to provide separate control for each series string.
 
KitCarlson said:
About the controller. I use Atmel AVR, for your application the tiny series may be a good choice. Raw PWM sets a duty cycle to provide an average voltage. This works well for motors and solenoids, however will not work well for LEDs. The LED current vs voltage is very sensitive to voltage. A small increase in voltage creates a large increase in current. The circuit needs to be designed to provide good resolution for the desired current range. I have good ideas how to make the control work correctly.

Your recent post suggests the range from a few to 70 mA. This range should be easy to do. I also need to consider how the LEDs are connected in strings of series and perhaps parallel. It may be necessary to to provide separate control for each series string.
Click to expand...


hmm ok I have on one type of led's (the full version)
9 rows of 4 led's which work as both turn (dimmed still regulated 12volt)and brake (full regulated)12 volt.

and for the C ring version which I'm leaning toward I have
5 outer rows of 4 led's (12volt regulated) set to 4 Ma and
7 rows of 4 led's for the turn and brake function. set to 50ma (12volt regulated)


I'm not overdriving the led's and hope this will give the led's a safety margine when the temp get into the 100's down here in florida
I have had the full setup running in that type of weather and forgot to turn then off for the night (in full brake light mode@50ma)and they didn't lose any led's or even raise more than a degree or 2 for a 35 hour run but i haven't tested the C ring , but I expect even better results since I etched the boards for the largest copper pad that would fit in the design and huge (for electronic's) traces for extra heat sinking.

I am using the Sharp pq12rd21 low drop out regulator for voltage stability
I actually solder it inline up near the light switch. to regulate both front and rear tail light and in the brake light line
 
here's a short vid of the led's in daylight
[ame="http://youtu.be/7ReNMcPi-yY"]302 Found[/ame]

Excuse the confused person in the video not knowing turns from tails
 
Good job

Daylight visibility is more important. Most people drive more in daylight, and the sunlight can make a weak light very hard to see. I deal with it around here all the time - many newer cars have crappy daylight visibility with full sun on the lenses.

Thanks for posting the daytime pics. The ones in my '65 are similar in daylight

B
 
Real, real sharp. I like the "C"-style arrangement for the tail function. Much better conspicuity this way, too, because not only the intensity but the "shape" of the lit-up area changes when going from tail to stop or tail to turn mode.
 
slantsixdan said:
Real, real sharp. I like the "C"-style arrangement for the tail function. Much better conspicuity this way, too, because not only the intensity but the "shape" of the lit-up area changes when going from tail to stop or tail to turn mode.
Click to expand...

Thanks SlantSixSDan really appreciate that.
I have not looked at the turn signal switch yet but I will.
I just finished etching the left sides and was going to test fit them and found out that the are a complete different size and shape. I did the first prototypes on breadboard style and didn't think to check for fit,just hot glued them in. so I'll have to have 4 separate boards instead of just 2.
I checked the 2 extra housings set's that I have and they're all a little different. so if I ever do make them for other people I'll have to leave them a little big and let them sand the edges to fit. so far I've found the Right inner housing is the major culprit on housing size differential (3 different sizes all close but still different shapes) and the left inner almost as bad.


So far it looks to be plug and play for the outer lights and just 1 additional wire ran and 2 dual element sockets to convert the inner light to turn/brake and 3 12volt regulator modules for front and rear protection. the one for the tail/parking lights I put inline at the light switch and grounded at the steering column bolts brake regulator is right at the switch too and grounded the same. I'm still chasing the wiring diagram to locate a good spot to add in the front parking regulator.
View attachment cring.jpg
I'm not happy with the alignment of the right inner set and will move them in so that they show inside the chrome ring.
It won't matter on the next set since I'll be casting some all new lenses that take the place of the chrome bezel,which are pitted badly and ring(they'll be all red lense instead)
 
When you make new lenses, be sure to put some sort or retroreflector back on or in the new lens.

When I molded the new red lenses for the '65 I used some reflective tape in the same place as the OEM retroreflector was on the clear lens. The newer reflective stuff is very bright:

RetroRefl.jpg


It is bright red in daylight, but looks orange with the camera flash.

B.
 
bohica2xo said:
When you make new lenses, be sure to put some sort or retroreflector back on or in the new lens.

When I molded the new red lenses for the '65 I used some reflective tape in the same place as the OEM retroreflector was on the clear lens. The newer reflective stuff is very bright:

RetroRefl.jpg


It is bright red in daylight, but looks orange with the camera flash.

B.
Click to expand...
Hey looks real good from here, Crisp too! Did you tint the cast? the led's are they setup in 4 unit sections? did you use the square superflux style or the round leds?
Sorry for being so nosy but I'm always interested in how someone else did theirs and if there is an easier/better way to do it than the way I did.

I'm going to have to do a lense and bezel all in one and cast (using the factory pillow style reflectors in the lense and extend it into the blank area using clay to add the texture in that area. It's almost impossible to find decent bezels for any kind of price that's even close to reasonable. I was quoted 200.00 per to re-plate plus fixing pit's in my bezels and that just isn't worth doing for about 1200.00 total.
I'll cast them and see about spectra chroming em(cost wise) if I want them chrome.
Which molding rubber and casting resin did you use?

I have some Tap silicone left from previous jobs but it's sort of soft (30 durometer)
I'll see if I can get a harder durometer silicone(65+) to hold mold shape a little better and about a quart of water clear resin to try it out.
 
bohica2xo said:
Actually, the red in the left lens is the 47 year old OEM retroreflector (after a good cleaning) in the camera flash. The lens on the right is the reflective tape.

For all of the info on my project, it is in this thread:
http://www.forabodiesonly.com/mopar/showthread.php?t=172744

Your stuff looks great!

B.
Click to expand...
I thought the right one was the new one and was wondering how/where you placed the tape to get that glow. that's why I asked what led setup you used, I couldn't figure out how you got such a smooth/crisp line in the glow using led's. It sure does look good.
so you just used the tape in the round section correct?

I just looked at your thread , whew you sure did stuff them in there, I have just 48 total in mine (20 for tails and 28 for brake and turn). I can't imagine how bright yours are when they light up.
 
A big +1 (or +10) to the advisory regarding the retroreflectors. They need to be present and they need to work. It's extremely difficult to get a good working reflex reflector off a copycat mould. There are many different grades of retroreflective sheeting that vary widely in their brightness and effective angles, so shop carefully. And 3M's got a new material that is both transluscent and retroreflective. Not sure it's available to consumers yet; I'll check with my 3M guy and see what he has to say.
 
Translucent and retroreflective? How is that possible. Can't wait to see this stuff in action.
 
hemitheus said:
Translucent and retroreflective? How is that possible. Can't wait to see this stuff in action.
Click to expand...

I guess it's possible because we live in the future!
redbeard.gif
(now where's my damn jetpack...no, wait, I mean molecular transporter. And my replicator! Can't forget my replicator. Can I borrow $20? I promise to give it right back! :lol: )

Not such a big stretch to imagine transluscence and retroreflectivity at the same time. We've had it for decades in hard plastic (think of combination side marker light/reflector units, for example). The difference is that the new stuff is thin and flexible, as I understand it. I'll try and get more info and report. In the meantime, look at this what Grote announces.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top