72 360 first start question

-
HAVE YOU PUT A TIMING LIGHT ON IT YET?

Answer that question please so we won't go slam around in circles. Thanks.
 
70aarcuda said:
when number 1 piston is at TDC firing...numbe 1 on the cap needs to line up with the rotor...

set your damper to TDC take the cap off and see where the rotor is point....

moving the oil gear also known as the intermediate shaft does nothing for your timing...lining up the rotor and number 1 on the cap is the key.....
Click to expand...

Doesn't the slot in the shaft need to be positioned correctly to allow the rotor to line up?

Or am I missing something?
 
Bad Sport said:
Doesn't the slot in the shaft need to be positioned correctly to allow the rotor to line up?

Or am I missing something?
Click to expand...
where ever the rotor lines up at #1 tdc is where you start the firing order. 18436572 from there CW.
 
Mopar Tim said:
where ever the rotor lines up at #1 tdc is where you start the firing order. 18436572 from there CCW.
Click to expand...

I don't let it fall where it may, I like it in the correct position, but yes that will work. I usually run mine CW.
 
you guys, I changed it. Of course. It would run better. LOL
 
Mopar Tim said:
where ever the rotor lines up at #1 tdc is where you start the firing order. 18436572 from there CW.
Click to expand...

yep , its too much emphasis on pointing the rotor to a specific place that just confuses people. I don't give a damn where it points to as long as its firing the #1 wire at tdc. all it does is put the #1 terminal on the cap in a different spot
 
like I said, i have put a timing light on it and it's not even close. I get the whole thing about setting the rotor to any point as long as the firing orders starts at that point. But.... It's a brand new engine so why wouldn't I just start it #1 like it's supposed to be? I have the rotor set pointing to #1 at TDC and the firing order is correct running clockwise. It'll run and sounds good with the throttle pegged. when I let off it dies. I've advanced and retarded as much as possible and it'll only really run when I start it with the #1 on the cap lined up with the rotor pointing at #1 cylinder at TDC which is how it should be. It's a weird one. Rapid Robert, how do I check the rockover exactly?

thanks
 
Rapid Robert said:
massive vac leak. & set the timing marks at 15BTDC. turn dist housing slightly till the magnet is dead even with the tooth. (the rotor will be at either #1 or #6). find the leak first tho, intake gasket shifted/mismatch/open (uncapped) nipple/bad carb base gasket/leaking vac line/hose. EDIT one tooth off on the t chain will shift phasing 15.6 deg on the crank, not sure it'd even run like that unless the chain set/cam was mismarked which it does happen. You might get rockover on #1 or #6 & see if the dampener slit is within a degree or two of TDC. pull the plugs for easy turning. get the slit on TDC & using a 1&1/4" socket/breaker bar move the crank back & forth a bit from TDC & note which (#1 or #6) pushrods both are moving, the cyl that they are moving then move the crank back & forth & hit the spot where both pushrods are moving and are at the SAME height & at that point (rockover) the TDC slit should be within that 1 deg (2 maybe) of TDC & this is with a tight/no slop chain. if so your phasing is OK & the prob is elsewhere & you dont have to open up the t cover & mess with the chain. keep us updated on how it goes. MORE EDIT for dist phasing, with the slit at 15 BTDC and the magnet dead even with the tooth, the rotor should be pointing (with springs retracted which they should be at rest) somewhat close to the cap terminal and the can will shift it CCW (on a SB) from that at rest position when it starts and you are above ported. SHORT VERSION: Confirm cam and dist phasing (dist phasing first cuz its easier) & if one of them ain't it then start searching for a vac leak
Click to expand...

Just re read this! I get it now. Your saying if my cam is out of phase by one tooth it would be corrected by setting the cam 15 degreed BTDC and then inserting the oil gear rotor &cap pointing at #1 cylinder and starting from there. I'm gonna give this a shot. thanks
 
Just re read this! I get it now. Your saying if my cam is out of phase by one tooth it would be corrected by setting the cam 15 degreed BTDC and then inserting the oil gear rotor &cap pointing at #1 cylinder and starting from there. I'm gonna give this a shot. thanks
Click to expand...
Decide which valve cover you want to pull (some have more addons to deal with). If Dr VC then turn crank till the dampener slit is at TDC with rotor is at #6 plug wire. If Pass VC then turn crank till dampener slit is at TDC with rotor at #1 plug wire. pull the plugs to make for easier turning with the 1&1/4 socket/breaker bar. with the breaker bar move the dampener till the rocker arms on either the #1 or the #6 cyl you are working with are at the same height (amt of open or closed). go back & forth a bit till you get it (the height) dead on. at that point the dampener slit must be within a degree or two of TDC on the timing marks. this will confirm (hopefully) that you are good dot to dot and there ain't no gross errors in the crank keyway (wouldn't be that IF it ran OK prior to rebuild ex for being worn out) or the new timing gear keyway slot or where the dot was (mis)stamped or if a person used the wrong dot or a cam can be fubared (rare tho). If its off then open her up. If we are good on this then back up the dampener slightly to 15 BTDC & install dist with can on pass side with room to be turned and the magnet lined up dead even with the tooth and if you are doing rockover on the #1 rocker arms then install dist bottom tang so the rotor is facing rearward and if rockover on #6 then have the rotor pointing forward. eyeball if the rotor is under or fairly close to being centered under the cap terminal. if forward plug in #1 plug wire there and if rearward plug in #6 plug wire there. This covers cam phasing, dist timing. Holler back which how it goes, I'm ready for some breakfast & coffee! EDIT if you are a (tchain) tooth off then you'd need to open it up & move the cam. I ain't thinking that, but a vac leak keeps hitting me the more I think
 
Rapid Robert said:
with the breaker bar move the dampener till the rocker arms on either the #1 or the #6 cyl you are working with are at the same height (amt of open or closed). go back & forth a bit till you get it (the height) dead on. at that point the dampener slit must be within a degree or two of TDC on the timing marks. this will confirm (hopefully) that you are good dot to dot and there ain't no gross errors in the crank keyway (wouldn't be that IF it ran OK prior to rebuild ex for being worn out) or the new timing gear keyway slot or where the dot was (mis)stamped or if a person used the wrong dot or a cam can be fubared (rare tho).
Click to expand...
FYI....This point of equal lift may as much as 6 or 8 degrees off TDC if the if the cam has different durations for intake and exhaust and had ground in advance, plus errors in the damper markings. If it is up near 15 degrees off or more, then look for something to be a tooth off.
 
I agree & I was assuming a symmetrical cam & with one tooth being a 15.6 deg shift I figure we'll know something when he does it & gets back to us with a number & I'd hate to see him pull the dampener/tcover if it ain't needed.
 
You say the timing "isn't even close". Do you really want help, or is this all to play with us? Where exactly IS the timing? This is pertinent information that we shouldn;t even have to be asking. This could be the key to something and we're having to pull it out of you like pullin teeth.
 
Ok so here's my latest test. I tried Rapid Robert's rockover test and everything seems to be correct. I again set the #1 at TDC back it up 15 degrees reinstalled dist. and fired it and it's the same thing. It'll run with the throttle pegged but if I let off it dies. I can't get a reading with the timing light because it seems to advanced passed the marks on the dampener. I have moved the oil gear a tooth in each direction and reset everytime pointing the cap and rotor in the same direction and keeping the dist. magnet parralel to the dist tooth. and it doesn't change anything. I've never had one like this but it's starting to seem like my timing kit or cam was installed wrong by the machine shop. If that is the case is it possible to find the sweet spot by just resetting the distributor to every possible setting with the oil gear? And if so would I treat whichever cylinder that the rotor is pointing at as #1?
 
Does it run smooth when it runs? Does it seem to be missing when it runs?

Have you by any chance checked for vacuum leaks?
 
Valve timing is different then Spark timing. only way to get correct valve timing is by the timing chain and sprockets. Correct spark timing is achieved by getting the dist in the correct position. Now of course the dist is driven by the Cam, which is driven by the timing chain and related parts. First and foremost, the Cam needs to be lined up correctly in relation to the Crankshaft. If it were me, it would be coming apart and make sure Valve timing is right. :burnout:MT
 
it sounds great with the throttle pegged. as soon as i start to let off it shimy's and dies.
 
Mophile said:
that's what i thought. thanks for your help. I guess I'm gonna open her up.
Click to expand...
When its opened up make sure the cam is not a boat cam, they made a reverse rotation 318 for boats. Could have got in there. Just a thought. If it were me and I opened it up and found valve timing is spot on, I would swap the camshaft. :burnout:MT
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top