73 E body front disc brakes conversion on A body. Where did I mess up?

[67Dart273]

Thanks for suggestion. Just going to do without sway bar. Saves me $500.00. Control arms (with tabs), if you read entire thread, has been a hassle. My originals (w/o tabs) are painted ready to go. Could order different lower ball joints but that would be Moog and who wants that.

Wish I could change your mind on the bar. A front bar completely changes the way these girls handle. My old 64 426 Dodge had no bar, both RR's did. My Dart had none when I bought it and I put one on. Very VERY much worth the effort, I believe

 

[jawbone]

I have Proforged lower ball joints on my Duster and have the calipers to the rear. No issue with clearance at all.

It looks like when that particular lower ball joint was spot faced they left a little shoulder, probably wasn’t intentional. It doesn’t serve any purpose so you could just grind that lip down until it clears. As long as you don’t touch the machined surface it won’t make a difference to the mounting. I’ve see a number of different castings and amount of machining done on various different lower ball joints depending on the manufacturer and origin, they’re not particularly consistent with that area. Heck even the spindles vary some with extra casting material depending on the year/model.

Adding washers/spacers there will add negative camber.

Yea but it happened on my watch. Lot of time spent on this project to understand the do and do not. This was to be the simple assembly of parts but what happens? All the prep that went into this. Not only the front but the entire car was affected. The front end rebuild is the final stage. Been on this since 2018. Yes I know I'm crying in my soup.

 

[jawbone]

Wish I could change your mind on the bar. A front bar completely changes the way these girls handle. My old 64 426 Dodge had no bar, both RR's did. My Dart had none when I bought it and I put one on. Very VERY much worth the effort, I believe

Thanks for the comment. Just don't think it was meant to be. Still missing all the parts. Could go get the hardware plated. Maybe missing LCA will show up by then. Really wanted sway bar.

 

[Kern Dog]

Just a clarification.....
THIS is a steering knuckle:

The factory even clearly defines it.

The red arrows point to the knuckle. The yellow arrow points to the spindle which is part of the knuckle.

The term "dropped spindle" referred to the actual spindle being placed up higher on the knuckle (Closer to the upper ball joint) to effectively lower the vehicle, all else being equal.

 

[jawbone]

Just a clarification.....
THIS is a steering knuckle:

View attachment 1716338906

The factory even clearly defines it.

View attachment 1716338907

The red arrows point to the knuckle. The yellow arrow points to the spindle which is part of the knuckle.

View attachment 1716338908

The term "dropped spindle" referred to the actual spindle being placed up higher on the knuckle (Closer to the upper ball joint) to effectively lower the vehicle, all else being equal.

I can't spell knuckle so I said spindle.

 

[67Dart273]

Folks may find differing terminology in lots of places. Chrysler calls the input shaft/ clutch gear/ main drive gear in their transmissions a "pinion." If you look through various parts catalogs for other brands of transmissions, such as Clark, Spicer, GM, Ford, etc, you will find these other terms.

Not all steering knuckles/ spindles are one piece, so who says, what is correct?

 

[Kern Dog]

Well, technically, you never actually spoke either. You wrote the words here.
I know, we often use words that are comfortable to use even when they are not correct for the application.
Many dudes say that their Mopar has a Posi.
Some call the clutch torque shaft a Z bar.
Everyone that I know calls it a drive shaft even though the factory service manual calls it a propeller shaft.

 

[junkyardhero]

Really wanted sway bar.

then just run an aftermarket bar from hellwig. you don't need tabs, it bolts to the shock pick up on the arm

 

[72bluNblu]

Yea but it happened on my watch. Lot of time spent on this project to understand the do and do not. This was to be the simple assembly of parts but what happens? All the prep that went into this. Not only the front but the entire car was affected. The front end rebuild is the final stage. Been on this since 2018. Yes I know I'm crying in my soup.

Look man, you’ve got a little extra metal on a lower ball joint. You can let it derail your entire project, or you can just grind it off and put the thing back together.

There’s no such thing as a “simple assembly of parts”. The parts are 50+ years old and had a wide range of tolerances to begin with. The replacement parts are made off blue prints or maybe even off a scan of some other old parts and then the dimensions are fed into machines that also have tolerances and the whole thing is put together by someone that’s never seen an old Mopar. Sometimes stuff doesn’t quite fit.

You’ve mocked it up, you can see what’s hitting, knock it down with a grinder until it clears and bolt it together. It would take less time than I’ve spent responding to this thread.

Just a clarification.....
THIS is a steering knuckle:

View attachment 1716338906

The factory even clearly defines it.

View attachment 1716338907

The red arrows point to the knuckle. The yellow arrow points to the spindle which is part of the knuckle.

View attachment 1716338908

The term "dropped spindle" referred to the actual spindle being placed up higher on the knuckle (Closer to the upper ball joint) to effectively lower the vehicle, all else being equal.

No, this is a knuckle

This is a spindle

And this is BOTH

So let’s drop the grammar police routine and not muddy up threads for no reason since we all know what part we’re talking about?

 

[harrisonm]

@jawbone
OK, I apologize in advance, but I am wondering why, with so many good options for A body disc brakes, would you try the E body route? I am NOT judging, I just want to know why? I went with the Stainless Steel Brake Corp kit, and it was super easy.

 

[72bluNblu]

@jawbone
OK, I apologize in advance, but I am wondering why, with so many good options for A body disc brakes, would you try the E body route? I am NOT judging, I just want to know why? I went with the Stainless Steel Brake Corp kit, and it was super easy.

Because it’s literally the same spindle as the 73+ A body? And he’s using slider calipers which is the same as 73+ A body? And SSBC is a flaming disaster?

 

[jawbone]

@jawbone
OK, I apologize in advance, but I am wondering why, with so many good options for A body disc brakes, would you try the E body route? I am NOT judging, I just want to know why? I went with the Stainless Steel Brake Corp kit, and it was super easy.

It's the what if I need a replacement part issue. I am more comfortable knowing what's on the car and what fits. Granted it's a big learning curve for me especially when reading through the off topic threads.

 

[jawbone]

then just run an aftermarket bar from hellwig. you don't need tabs, it bolts to the shock pick up on the arm

Did not know that. In fact, hellwig was my choice of sway bars.

 

[cudamark]

Because it’s literally the same spindle as the 73+ A body? And he’s using slider calipers which is the same as 73+ A body? And SSBC is a flaming disaster?

Yup, same exact spindle/knuckle and rotor are used in the '73-6 A-body and '73-4 E-body. I've done dozens of those swaps (both front and rear caliper locations) without an issue. You do have to use the '73-6 A-body upper control arm and ball joint, or, the tapered adaptor for the early ball joint stud though. Swapping caliper locations requires some different hoses too so they don't rub or bind.

 

[Kern Dog]

No, this is a knuckle
View attachment 1716338956

This is a spindle
View attachment 1716338954

Why? Because you think so?

And this is BOTH

View attachment 1716338955

Well, technically it is still the knuckle according to the factory literature.

You want to argue what the factory called it? Go ahead. As stated, few people refer to the "drive shaft" as a propeller shaft.

So let’s drop the grammar police routine and not muddy up threads for no reason since we all know what part we’re talking about?

You mean now that you got your jabs in, you want it shut down?
No. I didn't "police" any grammar, I merely pointed out what term that the factory used.

Because it’s literally the same spindle as the 73+ A body? And he’s using slider calipers which is the same as 73+ A body? And SSBC is a flaming disaster?

Yeah.....

 

[cudamark]

Why? Because you think so?




Well, technically it is still the knuckle according to the factory literature.

View attachment 1716339012

You want to argue what the factory called it? Go ahead. As stated, few people refer to the "drive shaft" as a propeller shaft.



You mean now that you got your jabs in, you want it shut down?
No. I didn't "police" any grammar, I merely pointed out what term that the factory used.



Yeah.....


View attachment 1716339012

Yup, the factory calls an axle shaft as a driveshaft, and a driveshaft as a propeller shaft....but, nobody in the business does.....I just use the most common names so there is less confusion....at least here in the states. Now you start talking with our British, Aussie, and Kiwi friends and you get a whole different vocabulary with using spanners, dealing with panel beaters taking dents out of your boot, bonnet, guard, etc.....

 

[Kern Dog]

No kidding.
Bonnet? Boot? Door cards ???

 

[cudamark]

And be careful you don't break your windscreen! I would hope mine would do more than just screen the wind!

 

[junkyardhero]

 

[harrisonm]

Because it’s literally the same spindle as the 73+ A body? And he’s using slider calipers which is the same as 73+ A body? And SSBC is a flaming disaster?

Thanks for the info. I tried to ask as politely as possible. I didn't I know a lot about A Bodies, but I didn't know that. It has been about 20 years since I went with the SSBC brake kit. The kit was amazing back then. Has the company gone downhill since then?

It's the what if I need a replacement part issue. I am more comfortable knowing what's on the car and what fits. Granted it's a big learning curve for me especially when reading through the off topic threads.

I can see that.

 

[72bluNblu]

Why? Because you think so?

Literally the same thing you said with your little red and yellow arrows isn’t it?

Only difference is those are separate parts. The spindle is the part that holds the wheel yeah? Well, on these cars it’s all one part.

Well, technically it is still the knuckle according to the factory literature.

View attachment 1716339012

You want to argue what the factory called it? Go ahead. As stated, few people refer to the "drive shaft" as a propeller shaft.

I know what the parts catalog lists it as, no argument there. And I know you personally don’t call an axle a driveshaft or a driveshaft a propeller shaft, so it doesn’t really matter too much what the factory called it does it?

You’re just picking this one hill to die on and ignoring all the non-factory terms you use for other parts everyday.

No. I didn't "police" any grammar, I merely pointed out what term that the factory used.

Which added nothing to the thread any way. Everyone in the thread knew exactly what part was being referenced.

And this is like the third thread you’ve done the same thing. You’re just correcting people to use the factory term, when you yourself don’t use the factory term for every part of the car. You wanna call it a knuckle? Awesome. Someone else calls it a spindle? Awesome. It’s the same part on these cars, you can’t separate them, so it literally makes no difference which term is used.

Should I post a picture of a carrier every time you say 3rd member? Or a driveshaft every time you say axle? Would be annoying and pointless wouldn’t it?

 

[junkyardhero]

oh goodness, i seem to have the flatulence

 

[Kern Dog]

You’re just picking this one hill to die on and ignoring all the non-factory terms you use for other parts everyday.

There is no hill and nobody is dying on it.
Quit your complaining. YOU are the only one who is making a big deal of it.
I wasn't wrong. When I am, I admit it but this isn't one of those times.
You can be really cordial when you need something from someone and quite the opposite when you disagree.
Try repressing your desire to complain and embrace the part of you that is an asset to the forum.

 

[Swinger 340]

Thanks for the comment. Just don't think it was meant to be. Still missing all the parts. Could go get the hardware plated. Maybe missing LCA will show up by then. Really wanted sway bar.

Not sure if this helps. I did a drum 69' dart from a 70' dart disc brake swap last year and used the lower ball joint from the drum one, but I had to drill out the lower ball joint holes that attach to the disc spindle. I know the K&H is a different set up then what you have but just trying to give you an idea. As someone mentioned, you need to swap sides with the calipers for clearance and bleaders on top. If not I believe they will hit the suspension or frame. I forget which.

 

[72bluNblu]

There is no hill and nobody is dying on it.
Quit your complaining. YOU are the only one who is making a big deal of it.
I wasn't wrong. When I am, I admit it but this isn't one of those times.
You can be really cordial when you need something from someone and quite the opposite when you disagree.
Try repressing your desire to complain and embrace the part of you that is an asset to the forum.

Oh please! If you took your own advice and tried "repressing your desire to complain" you wouldn't have posted your whining about a minor vocabulary point to begin with, and this thread would have gone on just fine without your whining because everyone already knew what part was being referred to.

And I will continue to be who I am, I don't care if the forum sees me as an "asset" or not. I try to be cordial to cordial people but I see no need to be nice if people are being shitty. Everything you've posted in this thread has been 100% unnecessary, and it's not the first time you've mucked up a thread whining about factory terminology for no reason and to no ones benefit but your own amusement.

oh goodness, i seem to have the flatulence

Quite right, we have reached "jumped the shark" in thread progression. Nothing useful to see after page 1, Mr. Raccoons.