Considering Holley sniper EFI for my 1969 340. Thoughts from people who have that set up?

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i've installed two tanks inc setups with their pumps in a-bodies and the work was smooth as silk. everything fit as it should and the pumps are extremely quiet-- these were the GPA series pumps, both standard and hi-flow.

i also have a tanks inc tank in my D300. it's a blazer tank with their pump and the "carb" set up that's got all the appropriate lines and regulator. couldn't be happier with it.

wound up picking up their EFI tank for my 68 dart that i'll be running a carb with, but when i switch to EFI it'll be all set-- basically the same set up as the D300

currently doing a J2000 with that you know what swap, and the owner insisted on fuel pump be much like the set up DionR showed above, in fact i used the camaro pump as well. while i understand the logic behind it and how it could be potentially beneficial i wouldn't consider that direction unless the application was much more performance oriented.

to me the tank inc set up if VFM and the easy button.
 
Thanks for all the input guys. I think I'll stick with what I have. All of the add-ons you guys say are necessary is more than I care to deal with/buy.
Thanks again.
 
One thing not mentioned is that while the cost of a surge tank set-up may be near or above the cost of a custom or dedicated EFI tank, the performance at low fuel levels (even down to the last gallon or two) during routine and/or spirited driving situations. A surge tank system will vastly out-perform any of the EFI tanks that are available whether they have some internal baffling or not.

Search some road racing fuel tank designs if you want to see how much it costs to even get close to a simple surge tank set-up.

eng5 (Medium).png


Sending unit mod 2.jpg
 
harrisonm said:
Thanks for all the input guys. I think I'll stick with what I have. All of the add-ons you guys say are necessary is more than I care to deal with/buy.
Thanks again.
Click to expand...
I think you are making the right choice. If you're not willing to put the time and money into it it would be an exercise in frustration. Spend the time and effort optimizing what you already have.

Here's a story that seems typical of this scenario. A couple years ago one of my neighbors with a '60s GM product saw the Sniper setup on my Dodge and decided he wanted it too. He admitted to not really knowing much about it and that he was "not a computer guy". I was skeptical of whether he understood what he was getting into but I agreed to to go look over his car and discuss what was needed.

So I'm at his place one night and find the wiring was just a mess - it was all the original 50-odd year old wiring that over the years had been randomly butchered by wayward hands. The OE battery cable was literally hanging on the terminal by one strand of copper - seriously. It was hard to understand how the car even ran or didn't burn to the ground - it was that bad.

I suggested straight out that he should re-wire the whole thing or at least fix all the obvious issues before attempting to install the Sniper. He wasn't saying anything but I could see the the gears turning. I left waiting for him to call me to say forget it or that he was going to need help re-wiring the car but he did neither. What he did do was ignore all my suggestions regarding the wiring and the fuel system and did the install himself without even telling me. Needless to say, it turned into a total clusterf*ck. A few weeks later he called me saying it wouldn't start. No ****.

One night I go over and try to help him figure out what was going on. I asked if he had done this or that and I got blank stares - he barely read the instructions. Neither of us had any idea what he had done and I left without making any progress. Over the next few weeks he tried again and again on his own with no luck. At one point he called me and said he was about to shitcan the whole works and go back to a carb. but I talked him off the ledge. To his credit, he saw it through. It took hours and hours on the phone with Holley tech support though. They eventually helped him get it up and running on the generic tune. He finally seemed OK with it but that was basically the end of it.

Once he had it running, I offered to go over and load the tune from my car since his combo was similar to mine. That never happened but he ended up dropping his SD card off at my house so I could load it for him. After several calls, he never came to pick it up even though he lived right up the road. I didn't hear from him for long time, I figured he was busy or whatever and we weren't close friends. After almost a year I found out from another neighbor he moved. Two years later, I still have the card.

He should have just stayed with the carburetor!
 
jbc426 said:
One thing not mentioned is that while the cost of a surge tank set-up may be near or above the cost of a custom or dedicated EFI tank, the performance at low fuel levels (even down to the last gallon or two) during routine and/or spirited driving situations. A surge tank system will vastly out-perform any of the EFI tanks that are available whether they have some internal baffling or not.

Search some road racing fuel tank designs if you want to see how much it costs to even get close to a simple surge tank set-up.
Click to expand...

I think the Camaro setup is at least equal to the surge tank.

The article I linked above said:

Over 800 on-track and 3000+ street miles were put on the fuel module during testing.​

At no time did the engine suffer due to fuel starvation except when it drained the tank dry on a road racing course.

Don't forget this is the OEM's solution for probably all late model cars.

In addition, the following components are no longer needed:

1. External filters
2. External pressure regulators
3. Return lines
4. Fittings, mounts, clamps, etc. to connect it all
5. The room all of the above components take

No idea what the surge tank setup costs, but I see the Tanks Inc kit on Summit for $530. The Camaro setup I built could use a $130 Spectra tank or a $180 Tanks Inc non-EFI tank and a GM fuel module for an LS3 is $155 on RockAuto plus a $15 adapter and a FPR to replace the release valve. I spent $100 to buy a late model GTO tank I cut up for the ring. So $430-480 plus some tax and shipping for the Camaro setup?

Frankly, the Camaro setup requires fabrication so the Tanks Inc kit is the easy button and isn't that much more expensive. And if people aren't having issues with how the tank works with low fuel, seems like a reasonable solution. I am curious how the Tanks Inc setup work in a hard use autocross and/or road course, but for most people I am sure it is way more than enough.

I have heard reports on the Holley sending unit replacement working really well, too. It's currently only $373 on Holley's website and doesn't require a new fuel tank or return lines or FPR. For the OP, that's what I would recommend. Wouldn't even have to swap out his hard line, just plumb the Holley pump to it and wire it up and call the fuel system done.

https://www.holley.com/products/fue...uel_pumps/muscle_car_efi_modules/parts/12-319
 
DionR said:
I think the Camaro setup is at least equal to the surge tank.

The article I linked above said:

Over 800 on-track and 3000+ street miles were put on the fuel module during testing.​

At no time did the engine suffer due to fuel starvation except when it drained the tank dry on a road racing course.

Don't forget this is the OEM's solution for probably all late model cars.

In addition, the following components are no longer needed:

1. External filters
2. External pressure regulators
3. Return lines
4. Fittings, mounts, clamps, etc. to connect it all
5. The room all of the above components take

No idea what the surge tank setup costs, but I see the Tanks Inc kit on Summit for $530. The Camaro setup I built could use a $130 Spectra tank or a $180 Tanks Inc non-EFI tank and a GM fuel module for an LS3 is $155 on RockAuto plus a $15 adapter and a FPR to replace the release valve. I spent $100 to buy a late model GTO tank I cut up for the ring. So $430-480 plus some tax and shipping for the Camaro setup?

Frankly, the Camaro setup requires fabrication so the Tanks Inc kit is the easy button and isn't that much more expensive. And if people aren't having issues with how the tank works with low fuel, seems like a reasonable solution. I am curious how the Tanks Inc setup work in a hard use autocross and/or road course, but for most people I am sure it is way more than enough.

I have heard reports on the Holley sending unit replacement working really well, too. It's currently only $373 on Holley's website and doesn't require a new fuel tank or return lines or FPR. For the OP, that's what I would recommend. Wouldn't even have to swap out his hard line, just plumb the Holley pump to it and wire it up and call the fuel system done.

https://www.holley.com/products/fue...uel_pumps/muscle_car_efi_modules/parts/12-319
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Depending on how much power you are trying to build, a surge tank (less pump) begins at around $65 bucks and up. Competition in the Surge Tank Market has driven down costs since I did my install 10 years ago. At that time, the GM high performance EFI fuel module stuff was in it's infancy compared to what's available today.

Then figure it takes 2 fuel pumps, one in the stock tank attached to the factory style pick-up and one in the surge tank starting at $65 each. Also the cost of a pressure regulator plumbed on the high pressure circuit between the surge tank and the fuel rails.

You would need to increase the size of the fuel return line to match the outlet size and plumb everything, I silver soldered mine and run 2 Permacool 10 micron water trap/fuel filters in-line on the low pressure tank to surge tank circuit. I ran 7/16ths aluminum fuel line and rubber EFI hose to keep cost down.

Competition in the Surge Tank Market has driven down costs since I did my install 10 years ago.
 
I've had an Aeromotive Phantom system in my Duster with port EFI for 9 years and I have never once had any hickups from fuel pump pickup. It's even in the front half of the tank. I wouldn't expect the performance of the Tanks, Inc one to be much different.

Succeeding with an EFI fuel system is using an in-tank pump, having a return line, and mounting the regulator after the fuel rails.

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You can do a surge tank, but pretty much nobody actually needs one. It's also a lot more connections, 2 fuel pumps, etc. The fuel will get heated more under the hood as well.

I'd tell everyone to run a multiport setup with the ECU mounted in the car for max gain and reliablity but its not in everyone's wheelhouse.
 
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DionR said:
Here is another gas tank idea. I bought a Gen5 Camaro pump with the basket and welded the top of GTO tank into a new A-Body tank.

The GM pump works like a surge tank in that it has a basket that surrounds the pump and a suction nozzle that fills the basket. In theory, shouldn't have any issues with slosh even at almost empty as the suction pump side of the setup keeps the basket overflowing with fuel.

Only downside I see is that I lost a little fuel capacity.

And it is untested as I still haven't installed it and used it. I am working on my G3 swap finally so maybe next summer?

p5150536-jpg.1716108677
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Any ways to do this if I don't trust my welding enough for a fuel tank? Haha! This is a great idea and lets you use easily available and robust oem pumps.
 
bjkadron said:
Any ways to do this if I don't trust my welding enough for a fuel tank? Haha! This is a great idea and lets you use easily available and robust oem pumps.
Click to expand...

I got a friend who welds to do it for me, if that helps.

We cut plates for the factory sending unit and fill hole so we could put some low pressure air in the tank and check for leaks and fix them. Probably worth sealing the tank with some of that liquid stuff, too.

Also, buy a new tank, don't use an old one. :D
 
bjkadron said:
Any ways to do this if I don't trust my welding enough for a fuel tank? Haha! This is a great idea and lets you use easily available and robust oem pumps.
Click to expand...

Couple of things to be aware of:

The C5 Camaro uses PWM for fuel pressure control so what looks like a FPR on the bottom of the module is actually just a safety valve. If you wire up the module with constant power, it will max out the fuel pressure. So you either have to run PWM controls or swap in an actual FPR with the following part to function correctly:

www.vaporworx.com

Fuel Pressure Regulator Adapter - Gen5/6 Fuel Module - VaporWorx​

Convert the Gen5 Camaro SS fuel pump to 60psi! For use with Gen4 Camaro 4bar/58psi pressure regulators ONLY on Gen5/6 Camaro SS fuel modules. Also fits Gen6 Camaro and CTS-V3 (2015+) fuel modules.
www.vaporworx.com
www.vaporworx.com

At least the part is only $15.

Also, the pump is on the short side for the A-Body tank. As I recall, I was able to add some spacers over the springs on the rods to get it to work, but the wires for the pump are too short then. I bought a couple of wire splices from Vaporworx to extend the wires but I suspect they aren't anything special.

The Gen6 Camaro is taller but the hat is rotated 180 degrees compared to the Gen5 module. Might be a better fit, and I know I was able to free the module rods from the housing on my Gen5 module so maybe the hat could be rotated.

https://www.vaporworx.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/Fuel-Module-Dims.pdf
 
I installed the sniper setup with the sniper distributor and retrofit in tank regulated pump. Hooked up to the factory fuel line. Added an inline FI filter around where the factory fuel pump would be. On a stock 71 340 4 speed.
Only issue I have had was a bad TPS. And the Fuel gauge stopped working early on.
Had to install a real alternator to handle the extra load too.
I also installed the progressive throttle linkage because it was so touchy with throttle response and a hard pedal.
I never had it professionally tuned.
Nor have I messed with Holley software. Just what I could fool around with on the touchscreen.
It runs absolutely awesome!
 
I forget where I seen it but a guy was whining and complaining up a storm about Holley sniper system...maybe it was YT... Uncle Tony maybe...? :lol: :thumbsup:
 
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