abdywgn
dismantler
basically this is a "blueprinted" 318?
David Vizard bench flows a BBD 2bbl
- Thread starter 318willrun
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Just because he said something about offset grinding the crank, doesn't mean the stroke will be any different. Just that they want to move the piston higher in the bore at TDC closer to zero deck.
If they are using original 318 rods they can't move it much, a 30 thou regrind usually means 15 thou off of stock "all the way around" I guess they could take most of the 30 off the underside of the crank throw, and little off the "top side" which wouldn't alter the stroke from oem.
If they are using original 318 rods they can't move it much, a 30 thou regrind usually means 15 thou off of stock "all the way around" I guess they could take most of the 30 off the underside of the crank throw, and little off the "top side" which wouldn't alter the stroke from oem.
NC Engine Builder
Grumpy Old Man
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It would appear that you dont understand how offset grinding a crank works
For the 4 bbl wasn't a TQ stock on 318s some years? Like around 78 and newer?
I had an 81 W 150 that had a factory stock TQ on it's 318 and I still kick myself for getting rid of that one.
The whole overall combo was fantastic the way that one was set up/ and I did nothing to it but drive the snot out of it and maintain it. Never altered anything except for deleted cat.
I had an 81 W 150 that had a factory stock TQ on it's 318 and I still kick myself for getting rid of that one.
The whole overall combo was fantastic the way that one was set up/ and I did nothing to it but drive the snot out of it and maintain it. Never altered anything except for deleted cat.
I sure do.i guess that would extend the stoke by the amount of offset.
Furious65
C-body Guy
They already said that is exactly what they plan to do. So, we will get to see that difference.
Personally, I think this is the most interesting build going on at the moment that I've heard of. Seems it is mainly all about the small details and not the big dollar parts most throw at a build. It will be really interesting to see what they all do and what the final result will be.
Here one of Steve Dulcich's 400hp 318, this one has stock pistons but lot if milling to get cr and ported 318 heads but with 2.02/1.60 and fairly mild 268 comp cam.
318 Small Block Build - How To - Hot Rod Magazine
318 Small Block Build - How To - Hot Rod Magazine
As much as i like what they are doing, I will say that I don't know how budget friendly this would be for the common man. All 3 of those guys would tell you that 318 hp would come much cheaper if you could just buy performance parts. I think turning a crank to stroke, porting heads and bench flowing, and such as that would be high dollar prices if a common man had to pay it at a machine/performance shop.
There's no way you will even get close to a 3.58" stroke by offset grinding a 318 crank.
If he offset grinds it to small journal SBC size, he could gain about 0.13 which would put the stroke about half way between a 318 and a 360. Hopefully he's just adding a little to get the pistons to the top of the bore as others have suggested.
junkyardhero
Well-Known Member
this, 100% this.
as soon as machine and port work enters the equation it's immediately out of reach for most people's budget.
I'm all for blueprinting a 318, heck even with some cheapy aftermarket slugs. throw the best 318 heads mopar offered on there and whichever 2V cam, carb and intake shows the most promise and have at it. degree the cam, port match the intakes, replace the springs, give the valves a good 3 angle, run thinner head gaskets to bump the compression-- all the stuff that's cheap and doable on a backyard beer budget with common tools and know how.
run it on the dyno thru manifolds and see what it does. then snap on a set of headers and repeat. then plop on a $100 swap meet manifold and a 4bbl of choice and see what happens. icing on the cake, buy the cheapest summit +1 cam and see what that does.
that's all practical stuff that somebody just getting into the hobby would do. it's cheap, it's readily available and it's all doable without spending an arm and a leg.
once you start machine work and porting, you're just putting a monocle and top hat on a chicken and calling it a duck.
abdywgn
dismantler
^like^
dirty white boy
50 yr old Juvenal delinquent
offset crank grinding a 3.31 crank, ive researched it! thickest rod bearing i could find was .060 undersized, cant get the hole .060 added to the stroke, gotta take lest .010 off the back side of journal to maintain a true round journal so you end up with a .050 stroke gain for a 3.36 stroke crank! so you only gain .025 towards 0 deck!! with a late 80s roller cam la318 piston with a CH of 1.765 you will be some wheres around .020ish below deck still, depending on block deck height!! now a .040 over chevy 283 sealed power 235NP 40 fits a 3.915 bore (a SP 235NP 60 fits a 3.935) and has a CH of 1.785 for a .020 gain toward 0 deck but ya got a .056 pin difference to over com, if over come with a off set that would be a CH of 1.808,..pretty damn close to 0 deck! witch is more cost effective vs 0 decking block or buying KB hypo's idk, witch would cause dependability issues idk, how outta balance would stroking crank cause idk, but it is interesting crunching the numbers....DWB
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Dartswinger70
Well-Known Member
Tony said in his latest video something to the effect of "there has been a misunderstanding this isn't a low cost budget build" that in my opinion negates or even alienates a 318 builder. If one is going to
spend money... alot of money they would go 5.9/360 no? This is an issue I see with Tony he makes it up as he goes along, if things don't go his way change the beat of the tune. He's a
story teller. I get it that he's a Youtuber but don't put BS out there, that is a disservice to the community. 318's as far as big buck builds are nonsense. I saw a 5.2 magnum truck engine on Craigslist where the
person is selling it for $4200. It's an obvious COVID build from being on the internet too much beleiving the hype and now the person wants to unload it. No dyno sheet no warranty. You
can get a 320 HP crate 5.9/360 from Jegs for 3 grand.
This is simply a challenge, can one get 1 hp/ci out of a stk. 2bbl 'Teener using/modding the OE/stk. replacement parts. Making the most from the least is never economical, I had no expectation of "B/RB numbers from a 'Teener on the cheap" results, this is going to have to be a restrictor-plate/2bbl circle track type of build to get the number. Not cheap.
Even if You have the skills & equipment to do most of it solo, there is still going to be a good amount of $$$ & time expenditure.
It's not Mine, so it'll be worth some entertainment, & maybe I'll learn something. Maybe not, but if I learn just 1 thing, that's good enough. There have been a number of "1 things" I've learned that were not free in My life, lol, so...
Even if You have the skills & equipment to do most of it solo, there is still going to be a good amount of $$$ & time expenditure.
It's not Mine, so it'll be worth some entertainment, & maybe I'll learn something. Maybe not, but if I learn just 1 thing, that's good enough. There have been a number of "1 things" I've learned that were not free in My life, lol, so...
Dartswinger70
Well-Known Member
If you like watching failure I suppose it is entertainment. That is the world of "mediocrity is acceptable" that we now live in . Vizard and Andy both have said upfront that "its an uphill
battle" meaning Tonys idea is hogwash but they are putting it nicely. I'd also like to add that to even attempt it They should have used a 5.2 magnum just because the heads are a better flowing casting, roller cam, lighter rotating assembly etc., etc. . But hey I know nothing...
battle" meaning Tonys idea is hogwash but they are putting it nicely. I'd also like to add that to even attempt it They should have used a 5.2 magnum just because the heads are a better flowing casting, roller cam, lighter rotating assembly etc., etc. . But hey I know nothing...
Furious65
C-body Guy
Like someone else has mentioned above, they never claimed it was going to be a budget build. Having someone do what they plan to do to any size or brand of engine won't be cheap. I think the idea is to show how to maximize what you are working with which in this case is a BBD fed 318.
Exactly about it not being cheap. Wrong on the second part of your statement as I love the 318 but also love using your brain to get the most out of what you have. I think most of you are missing the whole point of the build which is all the little details that add up.
yes, i agree. i was answering your post about it not being budget friendly after you said "not big dollar parts". These parts they will be using will be "bigger dollar parts" than if you bought aftermarket performance parts was my point.
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Rat Bastid
Dunamis Metron
Pick the low hanging fruit first. They are doing this one *** backwards. They will spend more for less performance. That’s idiotic where I come from.
Unless you like to fluff your ego.
This build is certainly not the cheapest way to try to achieve 318 hp from a 318 for the normal guy. This is a "see if we can" build.
To this remark ^^ I will say that I don't think most missed the point as much as maybe, by accident, were a little mislead. When it was announced by UTG, it was "see what we can do with a stock 318 using stock parts". The goal was 300 hp at that point. I think most believed the point was to take a 230 hp and tune/tweak/recurve/jet/ to get the 300. It wasn't very plain that they were going to grind, regrind, machine, piston swap, etc. Again, still a cool build. I think that is where the confusing was for most people.
Furious65
C-body Guy
Mmm, I think that was their assumption and they mislead themselves.
UTG, DV, and Andy are pretty much using stock parts yet they are modified and will be extensively so on some of them. Most anyone that thought you could "tune/tweak/recurve/jet/ to get the 300" out of a 318 with a BBD carb and 100% untouched OEM cam, or any piece for that matter, knew it wasn't possible and were looking forward to UTG's failure so they could point and laugh. Honestly, this build wouldn't get near the scrutiny it has so far if UTG wasn't involved. People need to take their bias out of it and just pay attention and learn from what DV is putting out there and let the chips fall where they may.
The core of this build is just a basically normal build, cam, cr, heads, just instead of aftermarket, just using crank offset and milling to gain cr, and a regrind cam and porting heads with 1.78/1.50 valves. Sure ordering new hew heads cam piston would make more $$$$ sense but who cares, and if they come up with a good combo could always use aftermarket parts to duplicate it. And sure the 2 bbl and stock intake and exhaust manifolds are gonna be a cork and senseless on a performance build so, and other than the head work and maybe a few other details most will have very few real world practical uses for most it. I don't get why this build bothers people so much.
There's only a handful of 318 builds with dyno numbers so for people who like 318 can't hurt may give some insights,. Would like to see them throw on a 4bbl and headers to.
There's only a handful of 318 builds with dyno numbers so for people who like 318 can't hurt may give some insights,. Would like to see them throw on a 4bbl and headers to.
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