Dyno testing a stock(?) 1972 440

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RustyRatRod said:
The only reason I would want to see Shitlash or a Dumpr cam numbers would be to see that they don't make any more power than any other "good" match for the engine. I think they are mostly marketing hype.
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I tend to agree with you, but there is only one way to actually find out. Remember, this engine is handicapped with static compression, not dynamic. What happens when you play into the dynamic part of the equation? That's what those cams are supposed to be doing.
 
Yeah but here's my argument on that. Grinders have been grinding cams just like those for YEARS. Crower's Hydraulic Hauler series always comes to mind. Those grinds are almost 40 years old. Long exhaust duration and a narrow LSA and a late intake valve closing.....much like the shitlash and dumpr. Those cams didn't do anything special for low compression engines. I don't know man. You're right though. Ain't but one way to figure it.
 
"Nothing new here?" Maybe not to some, but there are a lot of people here, myself included who find this incredibly informative. Thanks to IQ for taking time and effort to share all this with us. Many professionals would never do that, but we have some on FABO who do it freely. THANK YOU to all of them.
 
SpikeWills69 said:
"Nothing new here?"
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Who said that? I was talkin about thumpr and whiplash cams. He's used neither. I think he's makin more power than they would. That's my whole point. You inferred incorrectly.
 
I love the fact that IQ is giving us a window into his personal testing. Thank you so much :thumleft:.

But we are hotrodders, and always thinking of something better. It's just our nature...lol.

Since there was some cam talk, I believe i'm thinking like Rob on this. I'd love to try a high lift, [email protected], some split, with a lsa around 112* with the decent flow on a low compression engine like this. Might actually require a custom grind or high ratio rockers?

Sorry if I stepped on the original intent of this thread...
 
Naw, I think Jim appreciates all ideas. And might I add that since this is what he does FOR A LIVING, we should be thanking him. He's providing all this info free of charge.
 
I'll say it again, I absolutely love the "scientific method" analysis that's going on here.

Way too many times people just "shotgun" a project, and then if one of the things that was added or changed happens to work, everyone's happy.

The problem with that, is it doesn't build a knowledge base, and it's very inefficient and costly.

I publicly applaud this thread.
 
RustyRatRod said:
Who said that? I was talkin about thumpr and whiplash cams. He's used neither. I think he's makin more power than they would. That's my whole point. You inferred incorrectly.
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I think he was talking about my comment. I said that. I stand by it. He's not making any more or less power than anyone else could or did. But his approach is decidedly not "modern" - using an original mid 70s lower end and door stop 516s (albeit reworked) and a cam designed in the 70s. I applaud the effort and it's cool to see the results reagrdless. but as far as this being possibly a new and unknown power combo - it's nothing even close. It's not my dyno, nor my time, but what might be fun would be a complete modern machined short block, using stock lower end parts but IQ's high level of machining quality, and a set of unmodified 516s, or 452s, or 346s, with a modern out of a catalog/off the shelf camshaft to note the differences between yesterday and today.
 
moper said:
I think he was talking about my comment. I said that. I stand by it. He's not making any more or less power than anyone else could or did. But his approach is decidedly not "modern" - using an original mid 70s lower end and door stop 516s (albeit reworked) and a cam designed in the 70s. I applaud the effort and it's cool to see the results reagrdless. but as far as this being possibly a new and unknown power combo - it's nothing even close. It's not my dyno, nor my time, but what might be fun would be a complete modern machined short block, using stock lower end parts but IQ's high level of machining quality, and a set of unmodified 516s, or 452s, or 346s, with a modern out of a catalog/off the shelf camshaft to note the differences between yesterday and today.
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You're missing the entire point of this exercize. The point is to show what can be done with a STOCK LOW COMPRESSION shortblock, and the most basic of bolt ons. If you want to see what can be done with a modern shortblock, just Google the zillion stories done by all of the various magazines over the years. This is about making 400 plus horsepower and spending less than a thousand dollars total on the effort. Pure simple brilliance!
 
This thread is awesome, keep the results coming! This is the kind of build I am used to lol. Find a sound bottom end, compression be damned. Find a cheap cam, port the heads myself, lap in the valves, throw some new springs, and whatever intake/carb/headers I could find. Have very little invested, a ton of fun, and a great learning experience. Its also fun to keep up with cars that have thousands invested, and you might have a grand if you didn't shop well.
This shows that with a little thought, not much money, you can make anything fast and fun.
 
It's also nice to see real numbers for some of the most common "old school" mods.

Many of the newer builds do so many mods at the same time, and so many mods period...

It's nice to have a relatively concrete point of reference.
 
My apologies to Spike if that was the case.


moper said:
I think he was talking about my comment. I said that. I stand by it. He's not making any more or less power than anyone else could or did. But his approach is decidedly not "modern" - using an original mid 70s lower end and door stop 516s (albeit reworked) and a cam designed in the 70s. I applaud the effort and it's cool to see the results reagrdless. but as far as this being possibly a new and unknown power combo - it's nothing even close. It's not my dyno, nor my time, but what might be fun would be a complete modern machined short block, using stock lower end parts but IQ's high level of machining quality, and a set of unmodified 516s, or 452s, or 346s, with a modern out of a catalog/off the shelf camshaft to note the differences between yesterday and today.
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YY1 said:
It's also nice to see real numbers for some of the most common "old school" mods.

Many of the newer builds do so many mods at the same time, and so many mods period...

It's nice to have a relatively concrete point of reference.
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Yeah it's nice to see PROOF that all those old school low compression over cammed builds I did actually made some power. lol
 
Thanks for a realy good informative thread,this is some good information!
 
OldmanRick said:
Lol.....Me too!
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A lot of us did. That was always the first thing that got changed. CAM. LOL Then maybe headers and intake. those were some good runnin old motors too. I miss them days.
 
RustyRatRod said:
A lot of us did. That was always the first thing that got changed. CAM. LOL Then maybe headers and intake. those were some good runnin old motors too. I miss them days.
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I don't now how many cam swaps I did back in the 70's for guys, we'd call them yuppie's these days...lol, that just wanted there low comp GM's & Fords to just sound good with headers and a cam, but didn't want to spend any real coin or really care how fast they were. Many of those cars probably ran the same times as before the mods.....no gear, no converter, no tuning, etc. But with all the sound and commotion going on, they felt like they were driving Pro Stockers.:D And I was glad to take their money..lol.
 
Damn nice thread. Thanks for putting the work and effort in. Brutal combo and cheap. Care to speculate what bumping the compression 2pts would do for that engine power wise?
 
72ScampTramp said:
Damn nice thread. Thanks for putting the work and effort in. Brutal combo and cheap. Care to speculate what bumping the compression 2pts would do for that engine power wise?
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I remember reading somewhere that compression was worth approx. 4% HP gain per point. I'm thinking that was either Smokey or Da Grump with that number.
 
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