1. j par

    j par Well-hung Member

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    I don't know mine is a 10 and a half inch clutch and I have a act technologies clutch and desk and also a Hayes disc and if I put the Springs towards the flywheel they'll hit the flywheel. It won't lie flat on the flywheel. Maybe it's the make of clutch or something like that but both of my disks the more protruded part goes inside the bigger circumference of the pressure plate... I guess it's theoretically possible to clamp the pressure plate over top of it but it would seem like it would just block it in there and I would have a major problem...
    And even if I'm 100% proven completely wrong about this I don't need somebody's big potty mouth putting me down and talking a lot of Internet hero crap... (not talking about you triple-r) I try to tell the truth about my experience to the best of my knowledge...
     
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    • RustyRatRod

      RustyRatRod Bla de blizhibliz de blatde blizi bla bla FABO Gold Member

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      It's probably the fact that mine is a stock replacement disc with a small spring pack. Larger springs could certainly make a difference.
       
      Last edited: Sep 23, 2020
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      • CRUZE 418

        CRUZE 418 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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        All points taken, it's gotta come apart and see what the facts are. Take a look at everything.
         
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        • j par

          j par Well-hung Member

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          That's what I'd do without question..
          Wouldn't be happy about it but....
           
        • Daves69

          Daves69 Well-Known Member

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          FWIW.......
          Backwards is possible if you're not attentive. An MP disc centered and sitting on bolts does leave a small gap here. (.030" faced off this FW)
          Wrong.....
          upload_2020-9-23_8-54-9.png

          Correct......
          upload_2020-9-23_8-55-35.png


          OP, after the install, when you first cranked this vehicle up and pushed in the clutch, did you possibly find you had too much pedal and drove the back side of the clutch cover fingers into the disc springs?
           
        • AJ/FormS

          AJ/FormS 68 B'cuda fb, Form S clone ... 367/A833/3.55s

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          Here's how it happens;
          You put the disc up and slide the line-up tool in to hold it. Looks good right?
          Then you heave the PP up there and try to start one bolt. You fumble around long enough that , laying directly under it, you get concerned that it it's gonna fall on your face, so you let it down onto the line-up tool. After the blood gets back into your arms, you get the idea to start a bolt while it's hanging there, which sorta works. Then you rotate the PP up and start another and so on. Now yer getting excited so you start tightening them up. Then you remember that yur supposed to draw the PP down somewhat evenly, so you square it up. You notice that there's a bit of a gap there, but it doesn't raise any flags cuz it's your first time. So you run the bolts in, by degree and shazzam it's done.
          You pull the line-up pin, and toss the pregnant sow of an A833 up there , install the linkage and Huh, that's odd, the adjuster looks a lil off, but still no flag. After everything is done.......you start the engine up and realize; "ohchit, something is wrong".
          Now the flags go up.
          Now you remember that gap looked a lil big, and the adjuster was off, lol.
          Brewski-time; tomorrow is a new day.
          No this never happened to me, just saying, for a friend.
           
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          • inertia

            inertia Well-Known Member

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            Do you have the crank bolts in place, Dave ?
             
            Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
          • Daves69

            Daves69 Well-Known Member

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            That's what I'm saying here..........
            I had it on two bolts. Indexing the disc around did not make a difference.......
            upload_2020-9-23_13-46-32.png
             
          • inertia

            inertia Well-Known Member

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            So there IS interference .
            Thank-you Dave .
             
            Last edited: Sep 24, 2020
          • matthon

            matthon Well-Known Member

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            Curious, if the alignment tool was off, screwed up either by design or user error, and it pulled out fine and the trans slid in fine.

            Would the disc align once the clutch pedal is depressed?

            I've always aligned the disc, but also always wondered why I'm relying on a piece of plastic to align machined metal surfaces, and the consequences of doing so.
             
          • CRUZE 418

            CRUZE 418 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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            Try not using the alignment tool.
             
          • Daves69

            Daves69 Well-Known Member

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            It will align to the input shaft location when once released from the cover.

            Lol, Way back, you quickly learned how to line it up as close as possible using other means.
             
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            • CRUZE 418

              CRUZE 418 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              I had a tool in the end, but before that, yes, you got it as close as possible, then, someone had to be in the car to push the clutch in for the final push to alignment.

              You must either be bored today or just want to argue.
              Have a good one, got things to do!
               
            • 67Dart273

              67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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              Alignment tool will not prevent clutch chatter other than maybe help prevent permanent damage if misaligned and forced. A bigger issue was mentioned....leaving the weight of the gearbox hang when 1/2 way in
               
            • Daves69

              Daves69 Well-Known Member

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              What's the argument? matthon asked a question.
               
            • j par

              j par Well-hung Member

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              I guess my problem is I've never tried to put in a clutch while the motor was still in the car. I always pull the motor and transmission out and do it right in front of me. Also I have an input shaft that I use as a line up tool... Hard to get it wrong that way..
               
            • yellow rose

              yellow rose Master Of Insanity

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              Seems like extra work pulling the engine.
               
            • AJ/FormS

              AJ/FormS 68 B'cuda fb, Form S clone ... 367/A833/3.55s

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              My record to remove an A-833 is 17 minutes, on a drive-on hoist, including dropping the GVod, first. Hey I ain't superman, that crap all together is too much for me.
               
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              • 67Dart273

                67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                I've always been lucky, broke enough stuff to have a hosed up input shaft. Somewhere, I still have the cut-off shaft out of my 69 383 RR with a loop welded to the back. Unfortunately, that did me no good with the 70 440-6 which is 18 spline.

                The DO MAKE metal alignment tools...............I have no idea where mine is made by Lisle, I think

                You screw the correct pilot on the end, and off you go

                Lisle-Tools-55500-Clutch-Alignment-Tool.jpg
                 
              • yellow rose

                yellow rose Master Of Insanity

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                I bought that tool in 1980. Still have it. Used it so many times it’s hard to even think about it.
                 
              • Ron816

                Ron816 Well-Known Member

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                Removed the clutch again inspected did not find an issue, drove the car again, same problem violent shudder going into first gear but noticed no shudder in reverse or starting off in 2nd gear.
                 
              • Daves69

                Daves69 Well-Known Member

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                You might slide back under there and try to see if your release bearing is contacting all three plate fingers at the same time.
                 
              • 67Dart273

                67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                That to me indicates something sensitive to more/ less torque. Check motor mounts, rear suspension and clutch linkage. You need a second person to check clutch linkage, looking for "lost movement" etc.

                Something you might try.....even temporarily.......is to "rig" a torque strap to cinch the engine firmly down on the driver's side. This needs to be substantial, but not pretty. Build/ rig a rough bracket to fasten to an upper water pump/ intake bolt maybe incorporate an eye bolt to tension, and a chain, lots of ways down that road.
                 
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                • 67Dart273

                  67Dart273 FABO Gold Member FABO Gold Member

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                  WHAT CAUSES chatter related to motor mounts / suspension? (and add body mounts in "other" platforms)

                  When something like a driver side mount is loose, slipping the clutch causes the engine to rise up more than it should. At some point that movement affects the clutch linkage and changed the effective position of the clutch linkage. The "system" reaches that magic point and sort of oscillates. The clutch starts to engage, the engine rises, the clutch linkage changes, and releases the clutch, the engine falls back down. As it falls, the linkage changes position and once again causes the clutch to engage......and round and round we go.

                  Old friend of mine, --now gone---had a BEAUTIFUL Ford 1/2 ton stick This was a late 70's truck, "just like new" in the early 90's. New clutch, worked terrible. I TOLD him what to check (to have checked), it turns out the "transmission shop" had their head up their ass. A loose/ missing body mount between cab and chassis......simple......took him over a year to get it fixed.

                  Loose clutch Z bar bracket, loose/ missing bushings, cracked Z bar, bent/ cracked fork, on and on, you simply have to check it all.

                  And once again don't forget rear suspension.
                   
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                  • matthon

                    matthon Well-Known Member

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                    I've heard engine mount before, both driver side and passenger side, as well as trans mount.

                    I had the crap poly mounts, and after sending a bolt through the driver mount and adding a chain, I realized the passenger side would still slide down.
                    My engine sticks through the hood so it was noticable, more so when trying to open the hood.
                    Poly engine mounts, worst internal design ever.
                     
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