extremely soft 2nd to 3rd shift

-
P

pjc360

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2011
Messages
981
Reaction score
15
Location
montana
I've got a freshly re-built non lock up A-518 transmission that up untill now has been performing flawlessely, But the other day i decided to take my 1 inch carburetor spacer off of my engine and when i did i noticed my 2nd to 3rd gear shift was extremely soft, coyuld barely feel it shifting into 3rd gear :confused:. Thinking it was the throttle valve cable adjustment i re-adjusted it several different times, and nothing i did changed howe soft it shifted into 3rd gear all it did was change when it shifted into 3rd gear.
So last night i decided to put my spacer back on just to see if that would do anything and it didnt :confused:, it still shifts into 3rd gear very soft.
Whats going on here? The 1st to 2nd gear shift is great, nice and firm but when it shifts into 3rd you can barely feel it.
This transmission still has 8 months left on its warranty, so i need to figure this out soon so i can bring it back to the transmission shop fior repair if need be, i just dont understand what could have happened here, it was shifting great for months and then all a sudden out of no where its shifting into 3rd gear extremely sloppy.
 
I'm wondering if the transmission just needs a simple band adjustment? Because it has been about a year and 5 months since it was re-built and it has not had the bands adjusted.... I did however drop the pan and put a new filter on about 2 months ago and i while i was down there i backed out the line pressure screw 1 full turn wich i read one complete turn of the adjusting screw raises closed throttle pressure by 1 2/3 psi.
Should i drop the pan and adjust the bands and turn that line pressure screw out one more turn?
 
everything i have read in my automatic transmission service group book on the 727, ( dont have one on the A-518) points to the rear clutch or over running clutch, But what is strange is the transmission is not slipping in any gear, it will pull good in 2nd gear and pull good in 3rd gear, it's just the shift from 2nd to 3rd gear is very loose and sloppy feeling but it still pulls fine and doesnt slip.
 
no i do not have any shift kit in the transmission, just the standard valve body that came in the transmission.
 
This is just scaring me because its the only form of transportation i have the moment and getting that transmission shop to do anything is like pulling teeth out of a tiger. I really hope its something simple that i can fix on my own. But this just came out of no where, it was shifting thru all gears perfectly, not to firm but not to soft and no all a sudden the shift from 2nd to 3rd is extremely sloppy and soft.
 
since the rear clutch is already engaged while in second gear we can eliminate that. so that leaves the kickdown band..(releasing to slowly) or the front clutch...(engaging to slowly) with that said the kickdown band is applied by the kickdown servo. The piston is applied by line pressure...release is achieved by line pressure and return spring force combined. check the servo spring...if that is ok check the little orifice in the large piston...if that is plugged at all the release will be slow. The front clutch could have a piston seal that is leaking but not as likely because you aren't slipping. That line pressure adjustment may be a problem too...
 
what i meant by that last sentence is that governor pressure has to overcome line pressure to move the 2-3 shift valve...if line pressure is too high gov. cant overcome it...
 
thank you for your reply harlydartguy, while i was on my linch break i re-adjusted my throttle valve cable, pulled it out a little bit more. And i took it out on the highway and 1st to 2nd shift was alot firmer and 2nd to 3rd was firmer as well but i had to let up on the gas pedal to get it to shift into 3rd when i wanted it to, but the 2nd to 3rd shift is alot firmer now, wich is what i like. I dont like that real hard tear your head off shifts and i dont like the soft sloppy shifts, just a nice noticeable firm shift is what i'm after.
So since i had to let off of the pedal to get it to shift into 3rd when i wanted it to does that mean i have to drop the pan and adjust my shift points? And i sure wish i had a pressure guage, but i dont. The technician who was in controll of my re-build told me that the shift points and the line pressure were all set to factory specs for my transmission. And this transmission is in a 1991 dodge power ram 150 4x4 truck. I'm sure factory line pressure setting for the A-518 in 1991 is probly fairly low, at least i have been told factory settings are normally too low. Thats why when i had the pan down i increased the line pressure screw by one turn and to be honest i can hardly tell if it made a difference, maybe a very slight difference, how much can i increase line pressure before i'm in a danger zone? I went 1 turn out (counter clockwise) from what the transmission shop had it set at, and according to them it was set at factory spec.
 
I know you don't want to hear it, I'm gonna say it anyway: Hold the phone on the technical jargon, first thing that needs to happen is to stop, take it in to the dude and have him fix it, he built it. This is why you pay him a ridiculous amount of money. Dicking with it will only piss him off and possibly void your warranty.

If he takes the pan off, have him throw a TFOD-JR in there, no more issues and way more firm and strong. Can't really believe he didn't put one in there the first time.

I know I sound like a dick, don't mean to. Just be careful.
 
Ya, no offense taking. I talked to the owner about using a shift kit or installing one and he told me that it would cost me 150 to 200 bucks for him to install a shift kit and he said that he doesnt reccomend a shift kit because he can make adjustements to the valve body himself that would give me firmer shifts if thats what i'm after.
So I have been trying to figure out what shift kit to go with, I have looked at the ones from transgo and the ones from B&M. I'm not looking for the shifts that tear your head off, but would like a firm shift. Aparently all that was needed was the throttle valve cable adjustment, because i adjusted the cable out further and that made my 2nd to 3rd gear shift firmer again. And aparently my carburetor spacer has an affect on the shifts as well, because with the spacer the shifts feel better (firmer) and without the spacer they are softer. My thorttle valve cable is a nice tv cable, it's made by lokar and it cost me 80 bucks. But for now, i will just leave it alone and figure out what shift kit i want to go with and go about having it installed.
 
I agree with the suggestion that you should take it back to your rebuilder. It's under warranty & by you messing with adjustments you may void the warranty. I can tell you in my shop if anybody goes inside a component, i.e. Transmission or engine or whatever, we rebuilt or installed the warranty is void. Even the cable adjustments should be made by their trans tech. Play it safe, leave it to the pros & protect your warranty.
 
Would it be a bad idea for me to adjust the front bad? Since i can get to it without having to drop the pan? I know you back the lock nut out 4 to 5 turns then tighten the screw to 72 ft lbs then back the screw out 2 or 21/2 turns and then re-tighten the lock nut, correct?
 
Your cable is still out of adjustment if you have to let off the throttle to get it to shift 2-3. Your merely masking a problem & potentially causing another. Now you're in that area of voiding a warranty by making adjustments to things that aren't the cause.
 
Ya, i have brought it to them with a couple other issues and i have brought it to them for there inspections they have to do in order to keep my warranty valid with them, i have never missed an appointment with them. In fact i'm sure they have seen this transmission more then they'd like lol. when they first re-built it, i took it home and there was fluid pooring out the bell housing area.... And what it ended up being was they gave me a different dip stick tube and dip stick that went behind the engine instead of next to the hedders , anyways the dip stick and tube they gave me was reading the fluid level wrong, it was accually 3 quarts over full, so it was pooring out the vent. They had the truck for a week trying to resolve that issue.
Then i brought it to them for there 90 day inspection and there 6 month inspection and my year inspection.
So I have been very compliant with them, i will just get a shift kit and schedule an appointment with them to put it in. How do the B&M transpack kits do in the A-518's? I read they are pretty good? But i know the favorite is the transgo kits, would the tfod-hd2 transgo kit be too much for what i'm after?
 
I will back the throttle valve cable off a little bit to where it shifts into 3rd without having to back off the throttle, The owner told me that i could adjust the throttle valve cable to my liking and that i could service the transmission fluid and filter without voiding the warranty. They only require a 3 month inspection visit and a 6 month inspection visit and a year inspection visit and a year and a half inspection visist wich is coming up this next april. If you miss those inspection visits your warranty is voided, they drive the truck and drop the pan and check on things during the inspection visists.
But i will get a shift kit and and make an appointment with them to install it and go from there. Thanks for the advice guys. Any advice on what shift kit to look at would be appriciated to is the tfod-jr a good kit? how much more aggressive are the shifts with one? I was looking at the tfod-hd2, would the hd2 kit be a little to aggressive for what i want?
 
And i meant to say 72 inch pounds lonewolf lol wich is 6 ft lbs on a ft lb torque wrench, I had a brain fart and typed ft lbs but i meant to say inch pounds.
 
My lokar shifter cable is just under full taught at WOT, I have the throttle cable adjustments in PDF format if you'd like them. PM me.

Since your trans guy is a self proclaimed bad ***, (aren't they all?) have him set it up so you get the most out of your shift kit. It would be a safe bet to go with the big dog, the tfod-hd2, for extra insurance. On the same coin, the tfod-jr should be all you'll ever need. It fixes the factory short comings and leaves it at that. No one seems to complain about them. All can be tailored to your liking.

Here is some light reading on selection:

http://www.dodgedakotas.com/boards/gen/14060.html

http://dodgeforum.com/forum/2nd-gen-ram/266691-sonnax-or-transgo-2.html
 
As for the shift kit, if it shifts like you like it now going from 1st to 2nd I'd leave it alone. Most shift kits affect the 1-2 shift far more than the 2-3 shift kit. Adjusting the front band may help the shift some but the front band is mostly for the 1-2 shift so it may not help much, unless it's way out of adjustment now. How I get a better 2-3 shift out of them is to adjust the line pressure up 2 turns and drill out a passage in the transfer plate that is for the front clutch feed. Here's the only problem, the rebuilder told you he did some tricks to it but what did he really do? He may have already turned up the line pressure and drilled the front clutch feed port. Or something else. Or he might not have done much at all. Hard to guess.
 
It worked perfectly until you disconnected the tv cable when you removed the spacer? Has to be adjustment. The cable in my Dakota was out of adjustment and it shifted early and shift flared into 3 rd. (very soft shift) I got a manual and adjusted it in the idle position and it works perfect. A trans shop I know kept telling me to adjust it like the GM trannys. (full throttle and reset the button) Wrong! LOL good luck. tmm
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
-

Back
Top