Installing new timing chain on a 318, questioning the oil slinger

[ProjectBazza]

I'm in the middle of changing-out a timing chain on a '71 318 for a very good friend, and I just ran into something that seems odd to me. (Note: This is the first 318 I've ever worked-on....)

New TC set is installed, but when I installed the oil slinger I noticed it rides in a shallow groove on the crank snout, and I couldn't help but think, "This is gonna flop all over the place! This can't be right!" (And, yes. It is loose there, and there is considerable play in the slinger.)

So I pulled the TC set off, put the old crank gear back on, and....same thing!

Both crank gears also have the same depth measurements, so that groove "is what it is", and the new TC set is NOT the issue here.

I've read that it may be ok to run without the oil slinger, and I've seen claims that some engines never had one in the first place, but......
1. If it's to run without it, why did Mopar put one there in the first place? The people who engineered the engine obviously knew what was best for it.
2. Is it supposed to run in this groove, or is there something "funky" going on with this engine?

If this was my car I'd probably just slap it in and run with it, considering I'm just reinstalling what came out of it...and knowing I could always fix it later if it isn't right.

But this isn't my car, and my good friend deserves to have this done correctly.

So, is it ok to run with the oil slinger "flopping around" (my term) in that groove?

Engine project is on "hold" until I feel more comfortable about this. (But that's ok, as I have to put the gas tank back in this weekend as well.)

Thanks.

Jim

 

[RustyRatRod]

First, we need to dispel the MYTH that it's an oil slinger. It's not. It's an oil shield whose only purpose is to keep oil from splashing directly on the front crank seal and causing a leak. Yes, that's installed correctly. Once the balancer is installed, the balancer snout will back up right against the oil shield.

 

[Professor Fate]

Agreed- that oil shield gets tightly sandwiched between the harmonic balancer and the crank gear; there'll be no flopping around, it ain't goin' nowhere!
And don't omit it- if you've got it, run it.

 

[PRH]

I’ve never seen a crank with a groove like that.

But as has been said, the slinger gets sandwiched between the damper and the gear.

 

[MoparLeo]

The "myth" most likely comes from the fact that the Factory Service Manual calls it an oil slinger. It just keeps direct oil off of the front crank/timing cover seal.
Older engines used to have a large, felt washer installed there.

 

[ProjectBazza]

Yes, that's installed correctly. Once the balancer is installed, the balancer snout will back up right against the oil shield.

Agreed- that oil shield gets tightly sandwiched between the harmonic balancer and the crank gear; there'll be no flopping around, it ain't goin' nowhere!
And don't omit it- if you've got it, run it.

I never considered that! 58 years old, and worked on more than a few engines in my day, but I just learned something new.

Thank you!

Older engines used to have a large, felt washer installed there.

I guess that explains the large felt washer in the Fel-Pro TC gasket set I bought. I was scratching my head a bit on that one....

Thank you!

 

[RustyRatRod]

You were smart to ask.

And regarding what the service manual says, they can call it whatever they want, but what they call it and what it does are two different things. Maybe oil deflector would have been better.

 

[MoparLeo]

I am a little older than you. Same here sometimes. Never too old to learn something. My first two engine builds were on a
291 CI Firedome De Soto and a 354 CI Firepower Hemi. in High School. Ed Iskenderian supplied us with custom ground cams.
Our auto shop teacher was buddies with all the old So California racing parts manufacturers. Isky, Halibrand, Ansen, Moon Equip., Edelbrock, Offenhauser, etc.. We got to meet most of them at their shops.
Did a lot of shopping at Blair's Speed shop in Pasadena. Lots of iron there.

 

[MoparLeo]

Slingers were used in the old days before oil pumps on most engines. Maybe just a carryover slang term when they wrote these manuals. The guys that wrote them most likely grew up in the pre war (WWII) days...

 

[RustyRatRod]

Same here sometimes. Never too old to learn something. My first two engine builds were on a Firedome De Soto and 354 Firepower Hemi.

Super cool way to get started!

 

[mygasser]

you could alway degrease the front of the crank gear and rear of the 'slinger/deflector' and super glue it to the gear nice and central. it'll stay put until the damper's installed that way.
neil.

 

[ProjectBazza]

Quick update:

Every time I tried bolting-on the timing chain cover today those tiny little da** cork oil pan "gasket-ends" would squirt out on me, and after several failed attempts I decided it's better to do the job "right" than "right now" (not my car, remember?), so tomorrow morning I'll be borrowing an engine stand from a buddy (mine is in-use), and by 3:00 or so that 318 should be swinging in the air and on its way onto the stand.

Yeah, I'm frustrated, and I've had enough of playing around with those little half-assed gaskets. Gonna take 'er out, spin 'er over, and do the da** job right!

I'll probably put a new oil pump in it was well, long as I've got the bottom-end opened up.

Punch list is getting longer, but I'm still shooting for Labor Day to return the car to it's owner. Hopefully....

 

[Bewy]

It is an oil slinger. It is slinging off the oil that come in contact with the back of it. You could also call it a deflector, both are correct.

The Pontiac V8 is veeeeery similar in the front to the SBM. Cam is retained by a thrust plate; fuel pump is driven by an eccentric bolted to the cam sprocket. It doesn't use the slinger & they do not leak oil in that area.

 

[perfacar]

the slinger keeps oil off seal, also, slings oil around timing chain, only oiling it gets, i've ran with out one once, chain had lots of stretch and wear. just food for thought

 

[Bewy]

On many engine brands, the oiling for the t/chain leaves much to be desired. It is like an afterthought & could have been done better to improve chain life.

 

[RedFish]

They did add drip leg up at the top to get more oil on the chain. The smooth edge of that slinger would only produce a solid strem of oil upward. If it had been serrated/finned/other, it would have foamed the oil.
A lot of owners/builders have opted for the tensioner found in later model mopar V6 engines. It will oil the timing chain and take up slack in it also. First example my quick search found... Chrysler V6 timing chain tensioner for 318 V8 - Bing video

 

[iScamp]

Quick update:

Every time I tried bolting-on the timing chain cover today those tiny little da** cork oil pan "gasket-ends" would squirt out on me, and after several failed attempts I decided it's better to do the job "right" than "right now" (not my car, remember?), so tomorrow morning I'll be borrowing an engine stand from a buddy (mine is in-use), and by 3:00 or so that 318 should be swinging in the air and on its way onto the stand.

Yeah, I'm frustrated, and I've had enough of playing around with those little half-assed gaskets. Gonna take 'er out, spin 'er over, and do the da** job right!

I'll probably put a new oil pump in it was well, long as I've got the bottom-end opened up.

Punch list is getting longer, but I'm still shooting for Labor Day to return the car to it's owner. Hopefully....

just my 2 cents and this will probably start a keyboard war but.... if you replace the oil pump, don't put a high volume pump on it.

 

[ProjectBazza]

Yup! Been there, done that.