Keisler 5-speed conversion on Early A-body: Install has begun

[Longgone]

With 3.91's you better buy some more tires!

:headbang: Been there..........done that. Dave, you will love the five speed!!!:thumbup:

 

[daves66valiant]

With 3.91's you better buy some more tires!

Wheel Stands baby!! :headbang:

 

[daves66valiant]

Well, I got a chance to talk to Richard at Keisler again and he told me that yes you do have to cut the rear crossmember on the a-bodies. The directions are not very clear on this at all. IMHO. He did inform me that the Keisler tranny mount was over engineered in order to stregthen the cutout rear crossmember. He is a super guy to talk to and is very helpful. This was helpful information that I wish I would have known beforehand. I may not have been so upset about cutting the rear torsion bar crossmember.

Anyways, my drive shaft should be arriving tomorrow so I may pull the old rear and get things started on the rear this weekend.

Word of warning>>>>>you do have to cut significantly for this project but it can be done. Good thing I have lots of patience.

 

[Longgone]

On my `68 Barracuda I didn`t have to cut the crossmember(maybe because it`s the next generation) but I did have to bend the top cover plates to give me clearance. The cover plate is one thing that Keisler really needs to re-engineer. The thin little stamped top plate they`re using(it`s bent 3 ways) is quite inferior compared to the rest of the trans. A good cast cover would be much nicer and cut down on the RTV needed to seal everything. Just another opinion.................and you know what they say about opinions. Lol! Bottom line is I LOVE what the Tremec trans has done for my car. It`s the best mod I ever made to it!!!

 

[Dodgenut64]

Well, I got a chance to talk to Richard at Keisler again and he told me that yes you do have to cut the rear crossmember on the a-bodies. The directions are not very clear on this at all. IMHO. He did inform me that the Keisler tranny mount was over engineered in order to stregthen the cutout rear crossmember. He is a super guy to talk to and is very helpful. This was helpful information that I wish I would have known beforehand. I may not have been so upset about cutting the rear torsion bar crossmember.

Anyways, my drive shaft should be arriving tomorrow so I may pull the old rear and get things started on the rear this weekend.

Word of warning>>>>>you do have to cut significantly for this project but it can be done. Good thing I have lots of patience.

Im willing to cut, no problem there. I beat out two grooves so that my valve cover on the passengerside would clear (5.7 hemi is wide). Did you get the kit with the drive shaft?

 

[daves66valiant]

On my `68 Barracuda I didn`t have to cut the crossmember(maybe because it`s the next generation) but I did have to bend the top cover plates to give me clearance. The cover plate is one thing that Keisler really needs to re-engineer. The thin little stamped top plate they`re using(it`s bent 3 ways) is quite inferior compared to the rest of the trans. A good cast cover would be much nicer and cut down on the RTV needed to seal everything. Just another opinion.................and you know what they say about opinions. Lol! Bottom line is I LOVE what the Tremec trans has done for my car. It`s the best mod I ever made to it!!!

Yeah the step down on the tranny could be better engineered I agree. Keisler does not do the casting though. They just modify it. I would be nice though.

Im willing to cut, no problem there. I beat out two grooves so that my valve cover on the passengerside would clear (5.7 hemi is wide). Did you get the kit with the drive shaft?

The drive shaft is included with the kit.

 

[fstfish66]

dave; from the pics i have seen,,that tranny cross member is not over engineered,,and wil not make up for what you have cut out,,he is handing you a lot of crap,,its good that you didnt cut that top hoop out completly,, from seeing what you have done,,when i get that far i wil reinforce the hoop some how,, either put a piece of flat stock back in,,or remove it completly and reshape some thing,,,even tho i do not have torsion bars any longer,,

the part that didnt clear that top hoop part,,,is it a spot on the trany that can be milled off like the other spot milled and covered ???

glad you got your car back,and your under construction,,cant wait to se if finished,,,,

if you can i would put a piece in there,,,just my 2 cents no harm intended,,,

 

[daves66valiant]

dave; from the pics i have seen,,that tranny cross member is not over engineered,,and wil not make up for what you have cut out,,he is handing you a lot of crap,,its good that you didnt cut that top hoop out completly,, from seeing what you have done,,when i get that far i wil reinforce the hoop some how,, either put a piece of flat stock back in,,or remove it completly and reshape some thing,,,even tho i do not have torsion bars any longer,,

the part that didnt clear that top hoop part,,,is it a spot on the trany that can be milled off like the other spot milled and covered ???

glad you got your car back,and your under construction,,cant wait to se if finished,,,,

if you can i would put a piece in there,,,just my 2 cents no harm intended,,,

That is what I was told but he did say that many people have gone ahead and reinforced that area or built a new brace there. He did say it was not a bad idea to do so but that it would be fine either way according to their engineers. :violent1: I still have the chance to do it this weekend. I just need to figure something out.

I don't think that spot can be milled off enough. If it could be done I'm not sure they are going to do it at this point in time. You would be better off making your own hoop before you fabricate your floor tunnel sheet metal. Otherwise you will be my position and not able to get in there with a welder. It's going to work out though.

 

[fstfish66]

al the work you have put in to it dave,,would be a shame to not finish that,in my eyes thats a main support,,using torsion bars or not,,i woukd thing the car could shift or buckel if not supported correctly,,i know you will do the corrent thing,,,,

 

[daves66valiant]

Well I ended up welding in a piece of steel last night to give better support to the rear crossmember cutout. This was pretty cool because I ended up using the original piece I cut out. It was just about perfectly shaped already, it took just a couple minutes on the grinder and fit right in there. Man welding upside down is tough. This ought to do it though.

 

[redfastback]

are you getting paid by shafi to do the mods that they say you don't need to???????????????????????

it may be a good trans but the company needs to remain on their knees for a few more years and get better at suckin'.


good work though, dave. perserverence is a great quality.

 

[fstfish66]

DAVE great job as usuall,,any chance u can show what part of the tranny hit that piece you had to cut out,?? and did you have that problem in the trial car????

 

[daves66valiant]

DAVE great job as usuall,,any chance u can show what part of the tranny hit that piece you had to cut out,?? and did you have that problem in the trial car????

Thanks.

You can see it on one of the pictures. You can see the tremec logo. i'll PM it to you. On the trail car I did not have the motor and k-frame in place. With the motor in, it pushed everything back a good inch or so. On the trail car it fit just fine. I believe you will need to modify the rear torsion bar crossmember no matter what. This came from Richard at Keisler as well but it was not stated in the instructions. He was helpful though but I had to call of course. I think Keisler modifyied the tranny as far as they could possible go. At least that's what it looks like.

 

[fstfish66]

DAVE do you think the tranny case could be installed with out mods,, if you modified the torsion bar cross member??

 

[daves66valiant]

DAVE do you think the tranny case could be installed with out mods,, if you modified the torsion bar cross member??

You said you did not have torsion bars right?

If so, I think that if you fabricated your own floor tunnel to allow some extra room for the uncut tremec case you could get away with using a flat piece of steel for the rear crossmember hoop to maintain some strength and support for the floor tunnel. If you had an uncut tremec to trial fit I bet your floor can be modified fairly easy. The template I made for the floor might allow plenty of room without the top hoop of the rear crossmember for the uncut tremec. But, I have never seen what the uncut tremec looks like. Don't know if this helps any.

Dave

 

[daves66valiant]

Here is an uncut tremec. I bet you could get it to work. You need to make a new tranny mount though.

 

[fstfish66]

dave nice pic thanks,, i have not contacted tremec yet,, but i did talk with them last year on the power tour,,,

im guessing the area of concern is the plate that surrounds the shifter and the first big square plate forward of the shifter,, what shifter are you using? cant wait to see your shifter thru the floor to see if its ok in the middle of the tunnel verses off to the side like factory,,

 

[daves66valiant]

dave nice pic thanks,, i have not contacted tremec yet,, but i did talk with them last year on the power tour,,,

im guessing the area of concern is the plate that surrounds the shifter and the first big square plate forward of the shifter,, what shifter are you using? cant wait to see your shifter thru the floor to see if its ok in the middle of the tunnel verses off to the side like factory,,

Neither one of those areas should be a concern if you cut out the hoop of the rear crossmember. In the picture below You would just cut out the middle section that is left between the two holes. The rear crossmember hoop is just below this. It will take some doing but I think it would work fine. Your floor hump would be a little wider in front of the shifter.

It looks great though the middle. The Shifter rod is bent over towards the driver's side and feels very comfortable. Very short throw level too.

 

[dart4forte]

Hey Dave, it's looking good. Say, you going to FallFling?

 

[daves66valiant]

Hey Dave, it's looking good. Say, you going to FallFling?

Thanks.

I will be there but I'm not 100% on bringing the car yet. It would have to be trailored at this point and I'm not sure it would be worth the effort and gas money. I still think it would be fun though if I can get it down there as a rolling chassis.

 

[daves66valiant]

I thought I would update this thread since I now have the tranny installed and the car has moved under it's own power for the first time in over a year now.

After all the major modification were done I had the experience of installing the hydraulic slave master cylinder. It is very simple to install but there are a few things to look out for in the early a-body.

First, make sure that you secure the braided hydraulic hose onto the slave before bolting it completely in place. It is very difficult to get a wrench in the tight spaces once the engine is installed. The tti headers make it even tighter.

You can mount the reservoir with the bracket that Keisler supplies but it is designed for the 4 bolt master cylinders. This bracket will hit the stock voltage regulator, so I had to shave a little off the bracket. I have seen some people mount the reservoir to the inner fender but the bracket makes it look very clean.

Inside the car you must tap out the original pushrod mounting post and install the supplied shoulder bolt in its place. There is an adjustable rod from the slave cylinder that connects to shoulder bolt. Mine had to be shortened. Once all this is in place you are ready to bleed the system.

This is were I ran into a slight problem. The system was air locked and I could not get a firm pedal no matter how many times I depressed the clutch-held 2 sec- released - and repeat 50 times. I was frustrated to say the least. My setup did not come with a bleeder valve. The newer kits do as far as I know. My suggestion is to invest in a mightvac. I managed to get a syringe and forced fluid into the system from the top of the reservoir with the clutch pedal held down. It was just enough some fluid into the master cylinder bore and get the process started. The I bled it per the instructions. Depress clutch-hold 2 sec-release-repeat until no more air bubbles come up into the reservoir. It now feels like a normal clutch.

I also suggest getting the non-synthetic Wilwood 600+ hydraulic fluid if you are running headers. It can be bought from Summit Racing or a Wilwood distributor. About $18 a quart.

Here are pictures of the hydraulic slave master cylinder, reservoir and pedals. I don't have the front bench seat in the car yet or the carpet. The shifter ball sits right next to your thigh in the perfect spot IMO. I will update this thread again when I do my first burnout. :thumblef:

 

[Dodgenut64]

Wow, thanks for the update. Looks like your original peddles worked on fine.

 

[fstfish66]

looks good dave,,cant wait to see the seat in and you holding the shifter

 

[daves66valiant]

Here ya go Don. Got the seat in last night. Shot a couple pics this am. Shifter sits real nice and feels great. Very short throws.

My hand gets all twitchy thinking about being on the road. Even in my PJs.LOL

 

[Blues65]

Looks great Dave