Now I know why 904 was having issues

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Beast, oh hell no! I wasn't planning on using locktite of any color on the plugs! Was just wondering if that was what the PO had done to the extension bolts. I've got quite the assortment of sealant options at my disposal. Not averse to spending a few bucks if there's something better. My on hand options are; a veritable rainbow of the Permatex gasket\sealant products, Edelbrock Gasgacinch, real pipe dope, teflon and my personal fav, Aviation Form-A-Gasket Sealant Liquid. Just don't want to put anything in there that might affect something in a bad way.

Yup, managing the case during reassembly was puzzling me and after a couple beers, I came up with this. I can easily adjust the height to wherever is optimum and with all four corners held, it doesn't move much at all. Anybody see any issues with this before I proceed?
 

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Just make sure you can push in on the output shaft with a jack or something:

Fishy68
10-22-2012, 10:13 PM
I always push in on the output shaft until it's bottomed out. When you do that it reduces the end play to the minimum it can possibly be. If you do that and still have .015" or more your good.
 
Creedmoor said:
Beast, oh hell no! I wasn't planning on using locktite of any color on the plugs! Was just wondering if that was what the PO had done to the extension bolts. I've got quite the assortment of sealant options at my disposal. Not averse to spending a few bucks if there's something better. My on hand options are; a veritable rainbow of the Permatex gasket\sealant products, Edelbrock Gasgacinch, real pipe dope, teflon and my personal fav, Aviation Form-A-Gasket Sealant Liquid. Just don't want to put anything in there that might affect something in a bad way.

Yup, managing the case during reassembly was puzzling me and after a couple beers, I came up with this. I can easily adjust the height to wherever is optimum and with all four corners held, it doesn't move much at all. Anybody see any issues with this before I proceed?
Click to expand...

The aviation form a gasket is perfect for the plugs and seals both.
Output seal AND pump seal.
Just wipe some on the surface with the brush and pop the seals in. (Or on the outside of the seals if you must) :D
That stuff wont come loose in the trans either.
 
Woods, oh yeah I didn't forget that advice. Jack? I don' need no stinking jack. I can raise and lower it at will. I planned on just lowering it until most of the weight was on the tailshaft.
 

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Now that's creative.But it may be a PITA to install the pump.I find it easiest to have the top of the case a little below waist height, to install the clutches and front end. Use plenty of silicon O-ring lube on that big rubber O-ring,and on the lead-in chamfer.If the pump halves are well lined up, you can almost feel the cast rings entering the bore.Just make sure the front clutch is fully engaged.
When it is right you can feel the clutch thrust face rocking on the T-washer. I pre-assemble the clutches together,on the bench and then transfer them as a sub-assembly,into the case. Some guys count the discs as the front clutch drops down, but I've never had much luck with that.Sometimes the plates are so well lined up, that the dang front clutch drops down past 2 or 3 discs, and then what? No, I'm not backing up and starting over.A little wiggle or a little twist, and poof!Then the rocker test proves it's right.
When you drop the clutches in, you need to keep them together.I usually drop them in with the front band on,too. It is all too easy to snag the front clutch on something as the pack goes into the case.So I push the pack down with one hand and pull the rear clutch up with the other, as I carefully drop it all down. Sounds complicated, but really it isn't. When it's all finally down, repeat the rocking test.Engage the KD band, center the cast-rings, and move on to the pump assy.
Good luck!
 
bOb, I actually toyed with doing that. However, I was concerned that the aluminum mounting ears might snap off being on the end of such long levers (bolts), once all the weight of the internals was added. I'm guessing you didn't have any problems? Might have to revisit that option. Work height seems kinda low though.
 
Your gonna need to put the pump on and off several times to get the final setting right. So keep that in mind. Also, don't put the sealing washers on the pump bolts until the final trip through.
 
I have a question I forgot to ask about the tailshaft bushing. Here's a decent pic of the inside before I drive out the old one. Tell me, is this how it's supposed to be oriented?

Thanks fellas.
 

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I think Trailbeast mention before; the top hole is supposed to be up so it can get fluid, and flush with the step in the case. A socket the 'right size' and a block of wood can be your best friend installing bushings.
 
In my opinion,that working height on the stand,is almost ideal, if a tad high for a 68 incher like me. Since the front end could be going in and out several times, as mentioned, it's nice to have the bell at a comfortable height. Having it on a stand,such that it is rotate-able, is super for putting the bottom on(which I usually do on the bench).
I like it!
 
Creedmoor said:
I have a question I forgot to ask about the tailshaft bushing. Here's a decent pic of the inside before I drive out the old one. Tell me, is this how it's supposed to be oriented? Thanks fellas.
Click to expand...

The bottom is a drain-back channel, the top is splash oiled. I grease 'em up as soon as it's in.
 
Creedmoor said:
bOb, I actually toyed with doing that. However, I was concerned that the aluminum mounting ears might snap off being on the end of such long levers (bolts), once all the weight of the internals was added. I'm guessing you didn't have any problems? Might have to revisit that option. Work height seems kinda low though.
Click to expand...

no trouble at all. notice the od unit on the table in the background. that's the 518 I installed in my truck. weight isn't a concern. the thing I will do someday when I rebuild another 727 is weld up brackets so the trans is 90* to the stand. that will make it easier to work on and install the valve body.
 
Well, it's nice enough out, I think I'll dig out my engine stand and try it out. It sure takes up a lot less room than the A-frame ladder.
 
Can the reaction shaft bushing be removed without the special tool the ATSG book uses? The tool they show actually cuts into the bushing and jacks it out. What do you guys do?
 
I almost never have had to change that bushing.I don't have the factory tool, but I have a bushing cutter......for if I need to.
You can make a bushing cutter from an old small cold chisel. You need one about 5/8 to 1/2 inch wide. Grind the front and rear off to make a shovel about 1/8" thick and 5/8 up towards the hitting end. Then the corners of the pre-existing chisel, cut those off at about 30 to degrees, and about 3/16 up the side.
Then just cut a V-notch across that shovel, a little offset from center, and wide enough to meet those previously ground corners.Sharpen the 4 edges of the notch to be a chisel(about 60*).
Voila!
Put the V-notch over the bush, and with the previously ground corner against the housing,start cutting by smacking the end with a hammer. The smacking takes a bit of a knack. You want to drive the chisel down, but also want to keep the heel in full contact with the housing, but just skimming it, so you don't gouge it out.The tool likes to creep away from the housing and slip out of the rut that you are cutting. If that happens start over in a new place, cuz it's really hard to recover from the slipping out.If there is a drain back channel it's real easy to use that and cut the bushing down.
You may have to doctor the tool several times to get it to work right, cuz it's really hard to describe the dang thing. I did the best I could in the describing.When you get it right, it cuts pretty sweetly.
I bet the tool truck might have one.
Good luck
 
I use a hacksaw blade length wise by hand to cut the bushings down close to the base metal, then a screw-driver or a drift to finish them off.

The main bushings that wear on these are:

Front Pump
Direct Drum
Tailshaft

Everything else is, if it looks good run it. Do a Babbit front if you can.
 
Allrighty then, thank goodness my reaction shaft bushing looks OK. Still good to know how to do it if necessary! As I had to replace the front clutch drum, it came with a nice shiny new bushing installed. Good thing too, that bushing is just over two inches OD, and I don't have any sockets that big. The bushings in my old and new drums are over a quarter inch wider than the replacement in my bushing kit, which seems odd. I'm guessing it works adequately but costs less to make?

Couple more bushing questions-
My sun gear bushes look ok, so I'll probably leave them. The kit did have new ones. I was wondering about the procedure since it looks like you have to either extract one of them or drive them out together.

Red locktite on the pump bushing?

Since I got a bushing kit I'm guessing the two "extra" bushings are for a different tranny from the same family. The two extras are close to the same dimensions as the ones for the pump and forward clutch drum. Both are narrower.

Now I just need to find a socket to match the pump bushing.

Thanks fellas.
 
Pump bushing is in with red loctite but not staked yet. It's in as far as I could get it with the sockets I have. Take a look. The bushing is just below the chamfer on the inside. If that's OK, I'll go ahead and stake it. Please advise.
 

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Looks good, I did the same thing; split the difference ans stake it. The only thing I'd add is do a babbit bushing instead. You '1' uped me with the red-loctite though.

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads...3660/front-pump-bushing-babbit-or-bronze.html


"Babbit is the only way to go--it will not damage the hub metal like the bronze factory style can--it also conforms to smallamounts of- out of round, off center etc present in almost all aftermarket converters--the hubs used in aftermarket units seems softer than factory to me--Bronze ( tough, hard) equals trouble--always , always go with babbit on pump bushing IMO and experience "
 
Woods, I can take no credit for the red loctite. Fishy, AJ, Beast or 70aar mentioned it somewhere in this very thread. Not sure what ya mean on "split the difference"? Am I good to stake it where it's at? Don't think I can move it any more. By the way, this was the first new part put in. The assembly begins!!

:D
 
Didn't hear back, so decided the way I had it will have to do. Staked, packed, ready for bolts. Look copacetic?
 

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