Please, help me with this steering column insulator

[French demon]

Still having troubles with my turn signal switch, I wonder what is the utility of this insulator :

I think that the insulator is missing into my steering column, maybe causing malfunction of my T/S switch.

Doesn't this insulator prevent the horn ring (incorporated into the steering wheel) from touching the T/S wires..?

 

[CFD244]

I doubt that they are missing Francois. That bearing keeps the upper steering shaft centered in the collar. The insulator is a rubber ring around the bearing and it should have a staple in it by design. The staple is to ground the bearing to the collar. These parts are all located under the turn signal assembly. Here's what they look like. In this pic, the plate has been removed, and the snap ring is being removed. The black thing is the rubber insulator that goes around the bearing. This is an internet picture, not mine.

 

[French demon]

Hi Troy. Thanks
I was wondering about this insulator as I still have troubles with my T/S switch when I turn the steering wheel (and sometimes not).
Here's an old pic of my steering column with the T/S switch out.
Everything is normal?

Except for the turn signals, everything works correctly : horn, hazzard. No play, nor scraping noise from the shaft.

When the T/S don't work, I slightly pull onto the upper part of the steering wheel and the T/S are back.
I stop pulling on the wheel, and the T/S stop working.
Another issue : with straight wheels, the T/S work. I slightly turn the steering wheel, they don't work anymore.
Depending of the steering wheel position, the T/S switch seems to be faulty grounded... I don't know why

Tomorrow, I will remove the steering wheel again to check the insulator.

 

[DentalDart]

Bearing, insulator, snap ring then turn signal switch with the little metal piece holding the TSS down.

PS - I have no clue why yours doesn’t work. I don’t have a problem “installing” stuff but I have no clue why or why certain things dont work or how they work haha.

 

[Murray]

The T/S switch needs no grounding except for the horn circuit running through it. Electrical circuits run through the switch, in and out, but are not grounded at the switch. Operation of the T/S should be unaffected by steering wheel position. From your description, I would suspect faulty wiring in the column tube between the switch itself and it's exit lower in the tube.

 

[DentalDart]

If you have a new TSS here is the wiring for it.

 

[French demon]

Bearing, insulator, snap ring then turn signal switch with the little metal piece holding the TSS down.

PS - I have no clue why yours doesn’t work. I don’t have a problem “installing” stuff but I have no clue why or why certain things dont work or how they work haha.

View attachment 1716110365

I don't have this metal part holding the switch but I see that you have a pre-1970 TSS.
Mine is a '71 including hazzard and seemingly no metal plate to hold the TSS... Different connector too.

The T/S switch needs no grounding except for the horn circuit running through it. Electrical circuits run through the switch, in and out, but are not grounded at the switch. Operation of the T/S should be unaffected by steering wheel position. From your description, I would suspect faulty wiring in the column tube between the switch itself and it's exit lower in the tube.

Another clue, thanks Murray. I will check the switch wires in the tube...

François

 

[CFD244]

Hi Troy. Thanks
I was wondering about this insulator as I still have troubles with my T/S switch when I turn the steering wheel (and sometimes not).
Here's an old pic of my steering column with the T/S switch out.
Everything is normal?
View attachment 1716110321

Except for the turn signals, everything works correctly : horn, hazzard. No play, nor scraping noise from the shaft.

When the T/S don't work, I slightly pull onto the upper part of the steering wheel and the T/S are back.
I stop pulling on the wheel, and the T/S stop working.
Another issue : with straight wheels, the T/S work. I slightly turn the steering wheel, they don't work anymore.
Depending of the steering wheel position, the T/S switch seems to be faulty grounded... I don't know why

Tomorrow, I will remove the steering wheel again to check the insulator.

Geez, from this pic it sure does look like the bearing is missing!! I never would have guessed that!!!

 

[CFD244]

I don't have this metal part holding the switch but I see that you have a pre-1970 TSS.
Mine is a '71 including hazzard and seemingly no metal plate to hold the TSS... Different connector too.



Another clue, thanks Murray. I will check the switch wires in the tube...

François

Hang on, I'll get you a picture.

 

[Murray]

While apart, check your "cancelling fingers" on the switch. This is the only thing that is steering wheel position sensitive. Your switch has a "finger" at the top and a "finger" at the bottom. Under your steering wheel is a large metal ring with a "finger" pointed down. When the wheel is installed, this "finger" should be located in the middle of the two plastic "fingers" on the switch. These three "fingers" are responsible for the cancelling of the T/S during turns. If they are not correctly oriented you may have a problem. Good luck.

 

[French demon]

I will remove my steering wheel tomorrow to make a global checking of all the internal parts.
But my TSS is brand new (reproduction), the blinkers cancelling works perfectly.
It's rather an electrical issue.

@troy :
A closer view of my TSS housing. Missing bearing? Do you confirm?

 

[CFD244]

This is from a '71 Demon. Slotted screw for the signal lever on the left has to be removed. The 3 screws on the plate have to be removed and the plate slides off. You can pull the signal assembly away from the column. In pic 2, there is a snap ring on the steering shaft that has to be removed. It is in front of the bearing (which is surrounded by the insulator). Once the snap ring is removed, the phillips head screws can be removed and the first collar can be removed (with the bearing in)exposing the ignition switch components.

 

[CFD244]

I will remove my steering wheel tomorrow to make a global checking of all the internal parts.
But my TSS is brand new (reproduction), the blinkers cancelling works perfectly.
It's rather an electrical issue.

@troy :
A closer view of my TSS housing. Missing bearing? Do you confirm?
View attachment 1716110393

It looks like it is there from this pic.

 

[French demon]

It looks like it is there from this pic.

But it seems that the snap ring is absent. I do not have the little metal plate holding the TSS either...
Will check all this tomorrow.
Thanks for the pics. Great help

 

[CFD244]

You said that you replaced the signal switch with an aftermarket one. Any chance that you forgot to install the plate? That plate holds the switch in place. Without it, the switch assembly would be free to float around in there.

 

[French demon]

The metal plate wasn't provided with the TSS. Nevertheless, with the 3 screws, the TSS holds firmly into its housing.
I don't think that it's absolutely necessary.
Maybe it's just a reinforcing plate to protect the TSS plastic body from a virile usage onto the lever

 

[DentalDart]

The metal plate wasn't provided with the TSS. Nevertheless, with the 3 screws, the TSS holds firmly into its housing.
I don't think that it's absolutely necessary.
Maybe it's just a reinforcing plate to protect the TSS plastic body from a virile usage onto the lever

The metal piece is necessary, it has 3 screws that holds it and the TSS down and in the correct location. It prevents the TSS from moving within the collar while you’re driving and turning the steering wheel.

I circled the 3 spots where the metal plate is screwed into your collar.

 

[CFD244]

The metal piece is necessary, it has 3 screws that holds it and the TSS down and in the correct location. It prevents the TSS from moving within the collar while you’re driving and turning the steering wheel.

I circled the 3 spots where the metal plate is screwed into your collar.

View attachment 1716110431

I think he was saying that his screws just go through the plastic holes in the TSI without the plate.

 

[French demon]

I think he was saying that his screws just go through the plastic holes in the TSI without the plate.

That's right. The 3 screws hold the TSS firmly in place into the collar, even without the metallic plate.
I will take a picture tomorrow...

 

[mopar head]

Doesn't this insulator prevent the horn ring (incorporated into the steering wheel) from touching the T/S wires..?

I`d say yes, but probably just for extra insurance, my 72 NYer had one that just disintegrated when removed, and pieces were missing to even glue back together. Plastic specialty deal that would be extremely hard to duplicate and doubt very much, reproduced. Yours? I don`t know but doubt it. It might be simple enough to reproduce if someone has a pic of actual insulator .

 

[French demon]

Ok, this morning, I removed the steering wheel, TSS and collar.
I inspected all parts and wires, and except for absent "C" snap ring and metal plate onto the TSS, all seem to be normal.
I didn't make a road test today, but in the garage, all functions are ok.
Blinkers work
Cancelling cams work
Horns work
Hazzard works

The TSS without its metal plate :


But I bet that next time that I will go for a ride and as soon as I will turn the wheel, the trouble will be back
Wait and see

François

 

[mopar head]

Their`s a reason for every part. Chrysler or most any manufacture wouldn`t put a un necessary parts on a car. Though you may get by with out it? only you can determine that

 

[French demon]

I think I found the problem.
Even with all parts firmly screwed, the steering column has a tiny play from top to bottom causing a faulty ground bearing and the turn signal dysfunction.
And the problem comes from the worn-out upper bearing.
So, today I ordered a brand new bearing and rubber ring set. Thank God, these parts are available in Europe... I will get them quickly.

 

[French demon]

Ok, yesterday I received my new bearing/rubber ring set and have installed it. Very simple, a child's play.
But the TS problem remained

So, today, I spent my afternoon disassembling, testing and reassembling my steering column. I had to find.
And I finally found....

The problem comes from the lack of bearing snap ring (part #6). As the bearing (#7) is into a rubber ring (#8), it doesn't hold firmly into the collar and the snap ring prevents the bearing and its rubber ring to slightly move forward onto the column shaft. When the bearing moves forward, even just a little bit, this causes a little play of the column shaft -> causing a faulty ground -> causing a TS malfunction.

I replaced the absent snap ring with a little spring clip. Now, the bearing cannot move forward anymore and the turn signal works fine regardless of the steering wheel position.

 

[mopar head]

When a part goes flying... eh, it will still work