Stainless, Bushed PRW Rocker Arms

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For pushrod oiling to the rocker arms the adjusters should ideally look something like the picture below. The portion that is recessed and void of threads should intersect with the hole drilled in the rocker so it receives the oil. The hole coming up from the pushrod cup should be drilled a little past the intersecting rocker arm feeder hole so the rocker gets all the oil being fed from the pushrod.

These pictures are from a set of T&D shaft mounted rockers for small block heads.

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Just got my SM/Procomp 1.6 SS rockers and test fitting them onto new Speedmaster aluminium heads. Have a couple of questions please.
How many miles before you had these wear issues?
Did you have arm to spring retainer contact on your TF heads and did the B3 geometry kit fix that?
If not, what is the cure? Aside from replacing the valve springs is light clearancing of the arm ok?
No banana grooves on rocker shafts. Ok to do this with a grinding wheel? Of course deburr and clean.

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JoePole1 said:
Just got my SM/Procomp 1.6 SS rockers and test fitting them onto new Speedmaster aluminium heads. Have a couple of questions please.
How many miles before you had these wear issues?
Did you have arm to spring retainer contact on your TF heads and did the B3 geometry kit fix that?
If not, what is the cure? Aside from replacing the valve springs is light clearancing of the arm ok?
No banana grooves on rocker shafts. Ok to do this with a grinding wheel? Of course deburr and clean.
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Are you having contact issues with them? Can you post photos?
 
Pretty sure I’ve read here that the shaft Typically goes up and away from the valves so you might not have to clearance the rockers?
 
JoePole1 said:
With the B3 kit or when fully assembled on the block?
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Do NOT grind the rockers. You don’t run a big enough spring to warrant that.

Call Mike at B3 Racing Engines and let him make up a correction kit for you.

Do NOT buy pushrods until you have the kit installed or they will be too short.
 
JoePole1 said:
With the B3 kit or when fully assembled on the block?
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Mike will need certain measurements from you. Taking them is not too complicated, you need to measure a couple of times just to make sure you get them accurately. He might even ask you to re-check your measurements as he has a pretty good idea of what they should be. By now he likely has a pretty good database Regarding correction needed for those heads with those rockers.
 
Wasn’t there something about him not making kits for SM heads because the rocker arm saddles are machined with a slightly larger radius?
 
It almost looks like the arm needs to go toward the spring, it looks like it's running on the back edge of the valve.
 
fishmens67 said:
The roller skips across the valve tip because of spring pressure.
This has been tested by Racer Brown on a running engine. and someone else I know. lol
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Then why would you put a roller on it?
 
gzig5 said:
This is not correct. Bronze alloys are homogeneous in cross section when drawn, just like steel. Oilite is a commercial brand of a type of bronze that is recast with a special process that creates pockets throughout the material that hold oil. It looks a bit like a bronze sponge if examined under magnification. There are many alloys of bronze and some are very hard and tough, approaching mild steel. Oilite is weak in comparison and usually used in applications where the oil supply is limited and not continuous, such as on an electrical motor or all the shafts on my Sioux valve grinder. Because of it's porous and not a solid material, Oilite cannot carry the loads that regular bronze can and would never be used for a rocker bushing or highly stressed component like a main bearing or punch press slide.
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Ampco 21 is way harder than mild steel not to mention it resists abrasion and cutting with cutting tools like a lathe bit.
 
ch1ll said:
Ampco 21 is way harder than mild steel not to mention it resists abrasion and cutting with cutting tools like a lathe bit.
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There are some very strong bronze alloys but not all of them are. And just like certain steels, some of them excel in certain areas or features. I know they made non-sparking wrenches and other tools from very strong alloys that perform as well as steel without the potential of making a spark in an explosion sensitive area. I’ve got a punch from my dad made of that stuff and it’s amazing the beating it can take and not be damaged.
 
fishmens67 said:
Research it, you will find I'm right.
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You didn’t answer the question. You just added to your side of the argument without basis. Even if it does not roll or if it does for that matter, you have not posted any proof, hypotheses or research to back up your claim. I’m pointing out that common sense tells that there is a roller tip on it with the intension of rolling across the tip of the valve. How much do you think it would roll if it does work considering the contact path on the valve tip has to be less than 5/16 of an inch? Common sense should tell you there has to be some rolling loss (scrub/sliding) due to friction and pressure.

The least you could say is it was a bad/failed idea that does not work as intended and a waste of effort. Although I do not believe you are right about this. Too many companies manufacture high end rockers with roller tips. It has to serve some purpose.
 
ch1ll said:
You didn’t answer the question. You just added to your side of the argument without basis. Even if it does not roll or if it does for that matter, you have not posted any proof, hypotheses or research to back up your claim. I’m pointing out that common sense tells that there is a roller tip on it with the intension of rolling across the tip of the valve. How much do you think it would roll if it does work considering the contact path on the valve tip has to be less than 5/16 of an inch? Common sense should tell you there has to be some rolling loss (scrub/sliding) due to friction and pressure.

The least you could say is it was a bad/failed idea that does not work as intended and a waste of effort. Although I do not believe you are right about this. Too many companies manufacture high end rockers with roller tips. It has to serve some purpose.
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I suggest you do some research, spring pressure and the sweep is too narrow for it to roll as you think. not to mention rpm.
It actually slides, skips, skids, whatever.
 
fishmens67 said:
I suggest you do some research, spring pressure and the sweep is too narrow for it to roll as you think. not to mention rpm.
It actually slides, skips, skids, whatever.
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Show me the research you have found.
 
ch1ll said:
Show me the research you have found.
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He is correct. In order for the roller to roll it would have to be 2 inches in diameter or some huge number like that.

The do NOT roll. They wiggle. They slide. They do not roll.
 
fishmens67 said:
I suggest you do some research, spring pressure and the sweep is too narrow for it to roll as you think. not to mention rpm.
It actually slides, skips, skids, whatever.
Click to expand...
If the diameter of the roller is 1/2 inch, its circumference is 1.5708 inches. 2 x pi x radius. So if it “rolls” 5/16 of an inch, it “rolls” less than 1/6 of its circumference, or .3125/1.5708=.1989. Now 5% scrub would be .95 x .1989.=.18899. So every 7 or so times the valve actuates, the roller would spin totally around. This would promote even roller wear and reduce friction and in turn heat.

This is my common sense hypothesis, it may scrub more than 5%, but doubt more than 20%. I’m not a mathematician so any of you guy that are smarter than me and I know there are some on here, can check my math.

Like I said if you can show me solid data to the contrary, this is what I believe is happening at the roller/valve tip.
 
Now if any of you guys have roller rockers and have a valve cover off, mark a roller and turn the engine over by hand. If the roller doesn’t move as it actuates the valve I’ll STFU.
 
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